Are my children "ungifted"?

[Puzzledbyart]

Please be kind, it is a stupid thread, but it does nag me somewhere deeply inside.

Just audited my friendship circle's offspring (children ranging in age from 2 to 12), and it looks like all of them have some special "superpower" in terms of abilities / interests. There's a fully fluent reader at 3y.o. A child aged 9 with highest grades in two musical instruments + a chorister at a famous choir. A sportsman competing at the national level. A math whizz, who is attending classes in secondary school now as he is way way ahead of the primary curriculum. A trilingual child, fully proficient at a native speaker level in all three languages. And everyone, just everyone seems to have their children on the "gifted and talented" register at school.

My children are 4 and 5, and are distinctly average in everything. Most of the time I am counting my lucky stars that they are just healthy and happy, but there are occasional days of doubt when I feel like I failed them in everything. Well, like today, when we had a playdate with a young friend similar to my oldest in age (5), and she created a comic book with a clear and engaging storyline, beautiful art and not a single spelling mistake, including expressions like "conifer trees" and "butterfly".

AIBU to ask you if you think that some children can be just naturally average, and there's no amount of effort that can make them excel at anything? Or did I miss something in their upbringing terribly?

They are just babies really and may have a gift yet to be developed. But what is a gift anyway? A lot of these kids are hot housed which is unhealthy. Kids are best off being kids, playing and having fun until they are older.

I think the vast majority of kids are ungifted. Who cares what party tricks your friends have taught their kids. Your kids are perfect the way they are.

Like pp have said, I’d rather have a kind, well-rounded child than one that can read Tolstoy but can’t say please or thank you.

The two aren’t mutually exclusive though.

There is no such thing as natural talent.

What about people lucky enough to born with perfect pitch or something?

Mine are bright but not overly so. Capable of decent grades but never going to be the very best at anything. Except my youngest was always the best at maths, but we're talking top of the class, not ahead of the class. Besides, he's bone idle. GCSEs this school year and is obviously expecting a Level 9 but I'm hoping he messes up a mock in order to realise that he'll have to put a bit of effort in.

All that aside, do you know when I was most proud of my kids' achievements? Sports Day. Not because they were good at it- they weren't. Every year I expected them to come somewhere between the middle and the back. So the year my daughter was hauled over the line on her knees in first place in the three legged race was special. Even if the other girl had done the running for them both. Even better than that, aged 5 and 7 in their respective "balance the beanbag on your head" races my two boys did the same thing. Beanbag on head. Hand over beanbag. Run like hell. School let it pass and gave each of them the win. Other parents were not happy!!! I was so proud. Talk about initiative!

I agreed with deemail and puzzlebyart. It depends how much effort parents put in when their kids showed the interest. You cant just push them into it. They have to like it and also a lot of hard work, commitment and talent. If you are up to it, well and great and you found something your kids enjoyed and willing to work hard for it. If not, no big deal. They are still happy and healthy. There are plenty of gifted kids which boost up the school status to outstanding, there are also a lot of average kids who are normal and happy at school which also boost the school status. Does it really matter to you or it matters to your kids? As they get older, they will notice others are better than them or they might just be happy being themselves. Take them to places and activities if you are concern and see where it takes them. Good luck. You might regret it when it costs too much and took a lot of time and chauffering and homework issues start to crop up.

Two of my friends have teenagers who are extremely bright and probably g & t. My dd struggled throughout school, struggled with her GCSEs, scraped through by the skin of her teeth, the others stayed on to 6th form, my dd went to college and has just be awarded a apprentiship and just started driving lessons. One of my friends kids has major social anxiety, autistic, ocd and is under a psychologis, clever enough to go to Cambridge/Oxford but probably won’t because not able to cope. The other one is also painfully shy and is also under psychologist. I am proud as punch of my dd, she has done amazing and is a well adjusted, friendly, helpful kid that has found her way in the world. Be careful what you wish for .

All kids are pretty average on the whole.
But some do have a thing or two they really excel in.
However, you don't know about any struggles or hold backs they may have had.

My 3 year old is excelling in a couple of areas (fine motor skills and socialising) which fills me with pride.
BUT he didn't take his first steps until he was 24 months.

You'll find that often, the talented children have had a shortfall in a different area of learning along the line, which actually makes them pretty average too in the grand scale of things

The other day my sister and I were looking through our old school reports. We’re both in our 50’s and by the looks of the reports came from a school where many of the teachers didn’t like kids too much or focused on irrelevances such as the neatness of our workbooks etc. As a young kid I was very very bright and excelled at maths reading and sport. My sister less so with the excelling part. Come later in high school I started to stumble as I’d never had to work hard. I still have a good career and even a doctorate that came at the price of blood sweat and tears, but if I compare it to my sister’s, she’s a professor, has written a book etc etc. Ditto my husband who never did well at school but is also a professor.

My take home message from this is that innate ability often levels out later and is more a matter of early or late cognitive development. I see this in my kids’ friends as well. I also think than many other qualities are crucial, some of which aren’t necessarily learned if everything comes easily: perseverance, hard work, concentration, an ability to still do something even if not initially good at it etc.

As someone else said above, please don't assume that kids that have been labelled G&T are necessarily unkind, rude, lacking in humility, empathy and compassion, or common sense and day to day skills. That's something of a stereotype, and an unkind one to put on kids who have done nothing but have the temerity to be good at something.

As for being a tiger mum - nope. My concern has always been 'the whole child'. In fact, one of the things that saddened me about the Year 9 Excellence evening last night was that I didn't hear one allusion to having fun while learning. (My eldest has told me off numerous times for not pushing her sufficiently. Sigh.)

My girls are self driven. One has decided she wants to go into medicine. The other into engineering. They are the ones that have decided that. They are the ones who decide how much study to do, how much tuition they need. They are entirely self-driven. We just facilitate and support them. One of the plus sides is that with the eldest, it's turned her off any kind of experimentation in drugs or alcohol - as she says, she's gonna need all the brain cells she's got, lol.

The reason it is called average, is because it is what the majority of people are.

My DC are pretty average, and certainly were at your DCs age. DD2 starter karate at age 8 and will get her black belt, in all likelihood by the time she is 15. She frequently competes against black belts in competitions and gets gold or silver.

They may excel at something, but haven't tried it yet.

EVERY child is gifted. Albert Einstein once wrote, “Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”

Be thankful your children are normal, don’t pressure them into anything and don’t make them feel inadequate . Let them have their childhood and when and if they excel in something, be happy and encourage them . Their time will come.

I know someone whose child is highly (and globally, as in good at everything) gifted and talented. They're in the 99.9th percentile, if I recall correctly.

There is no school where they are that can meet their needs. There's the option of them going to university (since they were ten or eleven) - but that's no good, because developmentally and emotionally they're a ten/eleven year old child.

They have trouble interacting with their peers, and can really only manage to do so successfully with other G&T children, or they all start getting frustrated and angry, and fighting.

They're incredibly fortunate that their parent is willing and able to homeschool them. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

Just keep counting your lucky stars they're healthy and happy. You've played a big part in that and it will see them through life. Don't get caught up in looking what other kids do. Some kids are naturally fab at one thing or another but it doesn't follow that they don't struggle in other ways that you don't see. Some parents get very anxious unless they're pushing their kid to be a whizz at some demonstrable skill - an will train their kids to show that skill in public. Politely appreciate the kid's talent but don't fall into the competitive/anxiety-inducing buzz all parents in truth are made to feel that somehow they've got to get their kids to do likewise (we all worry about this, but honestly the pressure doesn't help you or them). Your kids are so young - they've got years to find what their particular passion and skill is. Keep providing the healthy, happy environment you're giving them and they'll find what they need in life.

Don't worry, I am dyslexic dyspraxic with 3 dc who are too. The 'worst' was my ds, his younger sister could read extremely early too and used to take every opportunity to rub it in. Provision and ed psych access was
limited and I had to fight for everything. At one I was actually told not to expect too much as he had a low iq. He failed Maths & English so despite passing English on a remark, I kept him on a 3yr Media BTEC at a college with great support. He went on to get 3 distinctions a first class degree from one of the best unis for his chosen area and did paid work from 2nd yr of uni, one year after leaving he can earn £400 a day, still as a junior and has landed a dream job doing exactly what he wants with world travel. So glad I ignored the 'experts'.

I agree @Herocomplex. The way people boast about and bask in their childrens’ achievements is quite sick-making at times. They seem desperate for reflected glory, even though it’s the child who has put in all the effort.

My kids were/are distinctly average. My oldest had the ability but not the work ethic, although if he could have done GCSEs/A-Levels in pub quiz questions, obscure sporting facts, cricket, world geography and US politics he would have got into Oxford . My youngest hated school with a passion and did the bare minimum to get out as soon as she possibly could.

Neither went to university, one has a good job (in my mind it’s good, the MN snobs would be horrified ) the other has a crappy job, but they are adults now and what they do is up to them. It doesn’t reflect on me in the slightest.

@howyoulikemenow you must be really proud of yourself to have overcome such shit and done well in spite of it

Interesting discussion. I do agree that a lot of ability is inate, and for the person who asked about that fits in with something like Downs, it's just a scramblng of code when the embyro is in development or even earlier, at conception. I am not a scientist but I think you can distingush a genetic condition from bright parents having bright children. Or indeed socially gifted parents having socially gifted children. But also if you are good at something as a parent you expose your kids to it. There are plenty of sportspeople whose parents were good at sport. They have the genetic ability, no doubt, but also they are exposed to the sport and given the coaching to do it, whereas someone else might not even be exposed to that particular sport.

I could read at 3, was considered clever at primary school, passed 11+, went to grammar school, did ok until I got to sixth form and then got all As. Got a decent degree but I've not done particularly well in my career. I may have chosen the wrong career and just not really have the right aptitude, I may be lazy. Or a mix of both. There are things I can do quite well and I am making enough money to live on, but nothing like my academic record would have predicted.

I was ok at music but was too lazy to practice, though I was a member of my school and county choirs, I was rubbish at sport.

F got top marks at GCSEs, but because he had never had to work, he floundered in first year 6th form. He did ok at A level (but nowhere near what his early ability predicted)

I worry that my ds will be like this as he coasted through his GCSEs, didn't get top grades but very solid.

High class problem! I know you know that though. Focus on the important things in life. Them growing up to be loving, kind, caring young people.

Maybe involve them in some young people activities where they get to help others. Teach them go cook and bake with you. Maybe one will be the next Jamie Oliver and so on. It doesnt really matter

Tinkerbelle57 and others have said it perfectly. Another one here who was on G&T (and the other G&T as an adult), but I've never really found anything I particularly excelled in or loved as a child or adult, didn't have a career I loved and am now about to retrain completely.

So clearly I haven't got either the drive or passion, I know that if I'd pushed myself a little bit I could have achieved a lot more at school and uni, but the point is I don't have that drive and was happy being fairly average.

It's not just the academic/physical ability, it's the desire and drive and passion to keep at it, or parents who really push you perhaps, and that's not always a good thing.

Most people, me included, do not have outstandingly gifted children.

My son is dme, gifted with multiple additional needs. It’s not a gift even though I love and adore him

Your perfectly normal kids will most likely have the best chance at being employed! Don't bother comparing your kids to others, they are yours and they're wonderful. End of.

We’ve just pulled our son out of school as they can’t cater to DME

You audited your friendship circle’s offspring.....? I don’t even know where to begin, except to wonder what fresh hell is this.

There is no such thing as natural talent

Oh yes there is. Although I would probably describe it as more of a natural aptitude, or your body is physically built the right way to facilitate it.