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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

My ex got my 15yo to drive him home drunk, WWYD?

145 replies

AnneTwackie · 17/09/2019 23:15

Always had problems with my ex but there’s a contact order in place allowing overnight contact and, as he’s now 15, he is entitled to his own say. If I could, I would stop contact, but that isn’t a possibility.
I have the pin for my son’s phone and have just found out he drove his dad home on Saturday night at 2am because his dad was drunk. They were at a sports club event.
If I tell my son, his father or any of the family my son will know I look at his messages but it’s my one way of knowing what’s happening. What can I do? Would the police take action?

OP posts:
Orchidflower1 · 18/09/2019 08:43

How can you not tell the police and report it as safe guarding to ss.

He’s obviously done this before and will do again. You are the parent. Be a parent. If anything horrendous happened and you never reported this you would be just as culpable.

The fact that you may not report things makes me feel physically ill. If heaven forbid something happened whether the driving,the drugs etc you would never forgive yourself. Relationships can be repaired. Dead bodies can’t.

Herewego93 · 18/09/2019 08:50

What Orchid said.

Branleuse · 18/09/2019 08:51

I would sign him up to one of those under 17 driving classes if his dad is going to pull this shit.
Id also look very strongly into some sort of professional help/therapy working on your sons boundaries. Talk about maturity and how to know if someone is taking the piss. The difference between right and wrong and his own self esteem.
His dad is abusive and a really bad influence, but if you cant stop your son from seeing him, and you cant punish him on this or let him know youve seen the messages without it backfiring, then you do need to take another tactic so your son can feel empowered to know he doesnt have to do what his dad tells him.
Does he have other good male role models?

Herewego93 · 18/09/2019 08:52

I knew a few teenage boys who died from dangerous driving and to also think that he won't get caught at some point or crash its so unlikely that this is going to have a positive outcome if it continues.

Embracelife · 18/09/2019 08:58

My son reported it once but wouldn’t press charges after his dad said he’d never see him again. He’d choose his dad if it came to court again. He knows his dad is wrong but feels responsible for him. I just can’t see a way out. He’s almost an adult and I just hope he sees sense eventually.

He wont see sense without professional counselling or until something goes badly wrong.
And it may then be too late.
Try get your ds to talk to someone eg thru school

WonderWomansSpin · 18/09/2019 09:00

But she has no proof. She has a copy of some texts which she thinks mean her ex was drunk and DS drove him home. She has a very acrimonious relationship with her ex and a road with no CCTV.

SparklyMagpie · 18/09/2019 09:03

It's been asked so I'll ask again

How did you son know how to drive?

MrKlaw · 18/09/2019 09:09

The whole 'I'm proud of you' feels like prep for when he tries to get him to do it again. He's normalising illegal behaviour. The more he does it, the more your DS will be used to it. Potential also in the future that they start to pass those behaviours on in their relationships with others.

Can't imagine how hard this must be for you, but IMO you need to at least get a solicitor involved. DS needs counselling/therapy as this sounds like an abusive relationship.

Original poster
AnneTwackie · 18/09/2019 09:17

The school are already doing all they can counselling wise and he does occasionally open up to one man in particular.
I think his dad must have shown him how to drive. Still unsure what to do but am going to look into getting some legal advice.

OP posts:
WitchDancer · 18/09/2019 09:20

Just a slightly different viewpoint - you don't think it was a joke or a setup because he thinks you are accessing his phone?

VenusClapTrap · 18/09/2019 09:40

You would never forgive yourself if he did it again and killed himself or someone else. On that basis I would talk to the police.

JammieCodger · 18/09/2019 09:51

Report it to the police. The only person who will get into trouble is your ex.

If a child is coerced into carrying out a crime by their parent, the police will not be remotely interested in the child.

Original poster
AnneTwackie · 18/09/2019 09:55

Interesting point dancer but no sadly not

OP posts:
Ohyesiam · 18/09/2019 09:56

What I’m trying to say is that the father is the adult and therefore legally responsible

ProfessorSlocombe · 18/09/2019 10:03

The very first offence was committed when the cars owner gave the keys to someone they knew was not insured, nor licensed to drive the car. Anything else will flow from that.

OPs son is a minor, and clearly acting under coercion which is a defence to the charge (were it to come to that, which it won't).

From the OPs writing, the only person who is going to hurt after this, will be the ex. It's hard to overstate just how serious the police will take this, and how it will feed into ensuring the OPs son is safe.

It seems incredibly fortunate this is all happening without someone getting hurt - which may not be the case next time, and it can't be stressed enough that there really must be no next time.

Embracelife · 18/09/2019 10:09

What proof will op give to police?
If ds is prepared to testify that the dad made him drive it may be pursued
But ds has already opted out if going against his dad.
So might say it never happened
So it s complex
But op can reiterate to ds what is illegal and potential implications not least killing other road users
That he is not responsible
What he should do next time eg call taxi / call op / speak to pub landlord or other adult

Littlechocola · 18/09/2019 10:19

By not reporting it I would worry that it would happen again.

CaveMum · 18/09/2019 10:24

A similar thing happened to a friend of mine when he was 16 - his dad asked him to drive him home when he was too drunk to do it himself (dad was an alcoholic). Unfortunately for him my friend was caught by the Police and given a fine (can’t remember how much) and 6 points on a licence he didn’t even have. As a result when he did pass his test and tried to get insurance for his first car aged 18 (a bog standard Fiesta if I remember rightly) the cheapest quote he could get was over £3000 due to the points.

This was 20-odd years ago so I imagine the penalties now may well be higher.

LakieLady · 18/09/2019 10:48

I would report this to the police, anonymously via Crimestoppers.

There are 2 things going on here. One is a safeguarding issue and the second is a public protection issue. Both need to be addressed imo OP, before your ex gets your son into serious trouble or someone gets seriously hurt. Or both.

If the police get involved, you then have something positive to raise a safeguarding about.

And, most importantly, your son will learn that actions have consequences AND that his dad is a selfish, irresponsible cunt.

Tonnerre · 18/09/2019 11:07

OPs son is a minor, and clearly acting under coercion which is a defence to the charge

I'm not sure that it is. Duress is only a defence if it involves a threat of death or serious physical harm. The age of the person in question is relevant, but in the absence of a physical threat I suspect the expectation is that a 15 year old is capable of saying no and going to another adult for support if necessary. The mere fact that his father gives him the car keys and tells him to drive home wouldn't be coercion in itself.

More materially, the only person who can give evidence of threat would be OP's son, and it sounds as if he just isn't going to do that.

ProfessorSlocombe · 18/09/2019 11:27

I'm not sure that it is. Duress is only a defence if it involves a threat of death or serious physical harm.

Who mentioned "duress" ? Coercion is not duress which is a complex legal area.

The OPs son is by definition a vulnerable person, so coercion is the term.

All of which is slightly hypothetical, since they're both terms that are used in court, and it's highly unlikely this case would see the inside of a court.

Sunshine93 · 18/09/2019 11:47

An actual police officer has been on and said that DS wouldn't be charged so I don't know why people are still insisting he would. As he was a minor under the care of another adult they would be pursue the son. The police officer also said they probably wouldn't have enough evidence to charge the dad but they would be able to caution him.

Op I would speak to a solicitor as it sounds like you plan to. Ultimately I would argue not reporting it means it is more likely to happen again. I think I would prioritise preventing it happening again. I do see how difficult this must be for you. I hope you manage to get some good legal advice.

I am sure that at some point your son will see his dad for who he is. As adults they probably won't have a great relationship. It's just getting him through these last few years that must be tough.

ProfessorSlocombe · 18/09/2019 11:56

The police officer also said they probably wouldn't have enough evidence to charge the dad but they would be able to caution him.

Only if he accepts it. He might refuse. Then what ? Accepting a caution is pleading guilty to the offence.

BertrandRussell · 18/09/2019 11:59

We only have the poster’s word that they are a police officer (sorry). The OP should see a real life solicitor.

Sunshine93 · 18/09/2019 12:09

Only if he accepts it. He might refuse. Then what ? At least it might make him realise the risk he has taken and not do it to his son again.

We only have the poster’s word that they are a police officer (sorry). The OP should see a real life solicitor I agree and have said that. I think it sounds like that's what the op is going to do.