AIBU to think some people become even more flaky and selfish after they have kids?

[Hey1256]

Ok so here’s the story, I’ve now lost a few friends over the years because prior to their pregnancies the friendship was mainly one way to start with. I would always instigate meet ups, I would always be the one to travel to see them because a half hour journey to most of my friends seems to be the other side of the world.

After their babies arrived I don’t hear from them, they cancel meets and NEVER want to travel anywhere.

Now, please don’t misunderstand what I’m trying to say - I totally get that when you have a child it is the priority and things become more difficult. But does it really mean you don’t care about anyone else enough to see how their life is going or want to see them, ever?

Fast forward a few years and quite a few of my other friends are having babies. One has been amazing, so good despite having the baby she has been making what effort she can which proves that you can still remember friends post baby.

The others I have not heard from them since they fell pregnant. If I don’t reach out to them and ask how they are it doesn’t happen.

Why is it that when some people have kids they start thinking people without kids lives are irrelevant? Not worthy of asking how they are? I know these friends keep in contact with their other pregnant friends. They haven’t wanted to initiate meet ups.

Anyway, it’s made me really upset. Do I just have shit friends? Why don’t people value social relationships anymore particularly once they have a child?

I’ve really had enough. Is it time to make new friends?

The "losing" your identity thing is pretty daft, though I recognise it's a trope or stereotype.

People's identities develope.

Does the 15 year old school child/ daughter of Jim and Sue/ sister of Mark/ bff of Becky, fan of Neighbors, New Kids on the Block (shows age) and Stephen King novels "lose her identity" when she becomes a medical student, Nivarna fan and watcher of House of Cards and reader of Ian Banks (or whatever)?

Or when she's a junior doctor with no time for TV who hasn't called Becky in three months?

Or when she becomes a GP and gets married and discovers she rather likes classical music and radio four.

Or when she has her first baby and takes maternity leave?

Why are any of those things "losing" your identity? They're not. None of them.

None of us are the schoolgirls/ students/ young workaholic party animals or whatever that we once we're, as soon as we're not.

Motherhood isn't losing your identity any more than entering a profession or studying something intensly is - it's a development of and element of your identity which might dominate at some times (as studying does around finals/ thesis deadlines) and be less central at other times.

Losing your identity is a daft way to look at it IMO. Change isn't loss.

Develop Not develope

@jealousorfair - no, I think that’s fine to say. That’s how friends talk to each other! I think it would be nicer to say ‘sorry you’re tired but all I can think is you lucky thing to be up watching Netflix when i was up with a teething toddler’ etc but what you’ve said is fine. What would be rude is snapping ‘you don’t know what tired is’. If you said that your friend would then (or should then) say something like oh god sorry, I’m whinging about being tired and you’re shattered, how can I help?

Unfortunately with ‘both sides’ seeing everything as a competition or a battle that rarely happens. It’s sad to see friendships and sometimes relationships end over this stuff, but I suppose that’s life.

@Anothernotherone - I agree with that post as well, I’ve never understood mothers ‘losing their identity’, surely they have just changed, they’re not lost! And no one ever describes fathers that way

Harry- I think someone who snaps like that has it as a personality. It’s not a mum thing unless she is going through depression and is triggered by sleep talk.. which shouldn’t end friendships that’s a bit much.

About “identity” being lost.. again I don’t think this should be the case. But many mums do feel they lose themselves when they become mothers especially first few years. Not comparable to changing professions and so on.

Depends how you define “identity”. And what type of parenting you follow. But having to put yourself and needs and feelings behind your kids does have that effect on people. Having no control over your ambitions and dreams and aspirations does have that effect..

Technically you should aim to remain in control of your life. But this isn’t the reality to many mothers. Say a mum with a special needs child ?

There’s certainly an identity crisis happening with many mums. Which isn’t on the same level as changing careers because again there is a lot of choice in that!.

I love being a mother. But it’s misundertsood by society and that makes it hard for us to be validated for what we go through which is a bit shit.

Anyway OP, if your friend was like that before she even had kids, then you are right that’s nothing to do with her being a mum. Maybe you are just the type of person that has a lot of giving that you attract people that take you for granted.

"Losing your identity is a daft way to look at it IMO. Change isn't loss"

I don't think that's what people mean when they say that. I don't think they mean their life has changed but that their entire life is about their children and that they don't have space or time for their own interests or hobbies.

Perhaps if you only define yourself by your job or current status, I get your ppint, but if you are the type of person who's previously spent a lot of time reading or sewing or hiking or simply deep in thought, and you can't do those things any more, then yes, it feels like a loss of identity.

@jealousorfair - I agree, it’s not a mum thing, rude people are rude whether they have children or not.

I do agree with you about putting yourself on hold to be a mother etc, I do also agree with the PP who said ‘a change is not a loss’ as well though. So I think I believe mothers as a group don’t lose their identity but individual mothers can, if that makes sense. I just don’t think it’s a nice thing for others to say about mothers as a whole.

I agree with PP, its the other way around.

My best friend of 18 years, I told her we were trying for our first and she was all "in so excited, aunty X is going to spoil baby" "I cant wait to meet them" if you need anything I'm always here" "ill have to pop around and see how your bump is growing ect" and seemed genuinely really excited..

But, she mentioned me not being able to go our drinking for 9 months.. and hasn't spoken to me since. Not once. Hasn't asked how I am, hasn't even text.

I've spoke to this girl every day of my life for the last 17/18 years and now shes gone off the face of the earth.

I can almost guarantee shell be interested for a week after baby is here. But then shell realise that my life has changed, that's a given. Of course I can arrange plans, go out and have a social life.

But I also need family time. I wont be arranging to go to the pub every weekend coming home in the early hours. I wont be able to have wine nights where we get pissed on the sofa and shes stays in the spare room that is now the nursery.

Things have changed, and because shes still in the clubbing and drinking phase of her life, and I'm settling down with a family it is different.. but to just cut me off is rude and hurtful. 18 years worth a friendship thrown away because people dont have the patience to wait for plans to be arranged.

What’s your example of a child free life that could be more tiring?

Hmm let's see. I'm running a business whilst recovering from a major operation, looking after a mother in law who is terminally ill a nephew who is living with me as it's close to his uni and an elderly father who is frailer than he admits. My partner has aspergers and is going throughout hard time professionally.

Leighhalfpennysthigh

Sorry you have all that to deal with.

We did mention being a carer to be the exception.. one of the few exceptions.

But this exception also applies to some mothers. And isn’t the average for child free couple.

@JealousOrFair my life is not that unusual for someone my age (late 40's). Life changes as you get older. My insomnia started when my late husband first got depressed 20 years ago. These days it's due to stress and worry.

😂

Working and bringing up kids is fucking knackering and they demand every single minute of your time. I would love to go out for lunch with my friends. Infact, when I have managed to organise something, its them who have usually let me down and been flaky, which has been really really disappointing when you haven't seen a friend for months.

There is also the fact that they invite you to inappropriate places where kids cant join you and if you are breastfeeding and your child refuses a bottle of expressed milk, you have to take them everywhere with you. You will find that men retain their previous life better than women.

Your friends may have made mum friends, but they probably only see them while you're at work or the mornings at the weekend.

When I also had kids I naturally ditched mates who were still pulling all nighters as they didn't want to compromise. Hangovers and babies aren't compatible.

Flakiness is awful. So rude and selfish.
But I don't often leave my kids behind when I meet up with friends. Because I love my kids and hate being away from them, especially if I work all week. The weekends is our time together.

Many friends are so because you share one key thing in common that is very important in your life. When you have a baby, you experience new things thst are easier shared with people who fully understand the detail of how it impact on your life. Those were never true blood friends.

At the same time, being pregnant and having a child can mean entering survival mode if you have a tough pregnancy or difficult baby. All that goes through your mind is making it unscattered to the end of the day. Some things go out of your mind, eating properly, dressing up, sometimes even washing, let alone keeping in touch with friends.

@Anothernotherone

Great post. Completely agree that becoming a mother constitutes development, not loss.

The competitive tiredness is so...tiring. I don't know why people get so offended when someone who is childfree says they're tired, does it matter? Does it then make you feel better rested? FFS. And OP even having children doesn't make you like every other parent, everyone is different. Just because you become a mum doesn't mean that your experiences become identical, and people will still say you don't understand, or that you're doing it wrong. I dared to start back at the gym when my baby was 2 months old as my DH was away for 3 months with work and I needed a slither of a break a day, people said I was selfish, didn't love my child etc; the worst bit about being a parents is other parents sometimes. Maybe that's why I've made an effort to keep in touch with my actual friends, not just those who want to make mummy friends.

I think this thread just proves that if you are a parent you have an excuse for just about anything.

If you are a non parent and point out bad behaviour you don’t understand the tiredness.

I'm not sure why people get offended by the term 'losing identity'. I never said this happens to all mothers - so if it doesn't apply to you move on.

It happens to people quite often in relationships too, after they get married sometimes in couple without children, though as this is a thread about people becoming flaky after having kids I thought it appropriate to take about mother's losing identity.

If you're in denial that this type of behaviour exists then more fool you.

Someone also mentioned it only applies to mothers - no it does Happen to men too but I am yet to hear a man himself make an admission that it was as a result of him having children he lost his identity. I'm sure it does happen but not as often as to women and perhaps going back to the point many women on this thread have made this may be because quite often the woman is moulded into 'the default parent' whether by choice or circumstances I don't know.

I have heard many women themselves say they feel they've lost their identity after kids. Once again, disclaimer; NOT all women just some.

Men seem to talk about losing their identity when they lose their job and struggle to
Find new ones but rarely when they have kids have I heard a man talk about losing identity so as someone posted this is why they don't often get associated with it in relation to having children.

Perhaps as someone earlier put it we should refer to it as change not loss that's a fair point.

Once again, this isn't an attack on mothers I don't know why some take everything so personally.

"Do I just have shit friends? "

Yes, but most friends are shit. Most friendship is just a convenience thing really, only a minority of people really care about their friends. That's normal really. Shit friends will drop you whenever there's a change in their life, doesn't have to be children. You just concentrate on the one or two who are not like that and make more convenience friends.

So can I just ask what the advice is from parents if your friends are being flaky?

If you are a non parent either voluntarily or by choice what should you do? Give up on the friendship and find new friends?

Can I ask each of you who have said oh you are so tired / busy / have new priorities to put yourself in the shoes of your childless friend just for a moment. She is probably lonely, she may or may not want children but can’t have them or isn’t in a position to have them. She may be struggling with her place in the world as a non parent. Does that friend not deserve a text message or a cup of coffee??

And OP even having children doesn't make you like every other parent, everyone is different.

Such a good point.

Somehow I think the motherhood experience is down to lots of different factors which determines how the experience is. Every mother has a different support network, emotionally and financially.

So I wish some of the mothers on this thread would stop assuming every motherhood journey is the same, it's like every childfree woman's life isn't the same.

We are all different.

I agree op there's definitely an issue with loss of identity with some mums and I'd include myself. Yes there is a development and of course motherhood is a big part of you. But this often comes at the expense of other parts of your identity. You can't keep up with the life you had before so something has to give. I have lost some friendships, travel much less, read less, study less. So in those areas my life is less rich. However I still have my career and still have hobbies and friends - it's just all pared down. I don't ferl li

Meh. I'm not going to get into a bun fight about parents being more tired etc than non parents although what I would say is that since I've become a parent I've found that my focus is more split so I get distracted away from writing messages to friends or making plans etc, luckily a lot of the friends I am close to also have young children so we are understanding of each other! However I just do also have a lot less time to meet up with people. I work most days and so I want to be with my son on my days off to see him, and I also don't want him to have a boring miserable time so my social plans do tend to revolve around things we can do with him in tow, if my friends are happy to come to my house so he can play in the garden or come to the park with us, that is much easier than trying to get him to sit in a coffee shop which will usually work for about 5 minutes.

I'm also just busy as I'm looking after him on my own and working 4 days a week so inevitably I just focus on my very close friends who mean the most to me. I imagine that's similar for lots of parents, you don't have time to maintain a massive circle of friends. It sounds to me like you perhaps weren't a top priority to those friends who you haven't been in touch with- sorry OP.

OP I am on the flipside of the coin to you (apologies I have only read a few pages of this thread)

I have had a child and pregnant and found that for the majority of my friendships I am the one making the effort and its exhausting.

I have one friend with a much older child who is amazing and we have an equal friendship, I also have a new friend I made through our children who seems to be on my wavelength

Other than that I dont really have a circle of "friends". I have some mummy friends who we meet up randomly and i could talk to in a crisis. However the one good friend I do have, it was hard before children but I now find it impossible to meet up etc and I find it so sad.

It doesn't help that I cant afford my own car at the moment so I struggle to get to peoples houses but it can get very lonely. I always had difficulty making friends and with children I find it even harder.

All I can hope is that when the new baby is no longer breastfeeding and I find my new rhythm I can get back into my usual pursuits.

It is also absolutely correct that there is a change in identity for a lot of mothers but I'm not going to apologise for that being the case for me, it's just the reality that being a mother IS the most significant thing in my life because, frankly, no one else can do that job. I have to step up to it.