to arrange the school runs this way?

[BonneMa]

I have twin sons, year 4.

DT1 just got a place at a local SS. Transport is done with minivan who collects 4 children from a pick up point at 7:45. Said point is 1 mile from home. LA does not fund home to school transport.

I drive DT1 to the bus stop each morning. DT2 is alone at home. He gets dressed and starts having breakfast I made ready for him in the meantime. I am out between 15-25 mins depending on traffic. I then come back home to collect him and drop DT2 off at his primary en route to my office.

DT2 is very mature and can be trusted. He has a phone in case of emergency.

I don't have family support around and have to do it all alone. This set up works for me and both DTs. DT2 enjoys the extra bit of 'responsibilty'.

A few friends where shocked and said this is illegal. I couldn't find anything about the law that states that you cannot leave a 9 year old alone at home for a bit.

Aibu to do what I do? I am a bit worried now that someone might report me to SS

It is totally fine. You know your child best.

I always left Ds2 from about year 4 for 5 or 10 minutes occasionally when I needed to take his brother somewhere. The main thing was having a plan in place in case I wasn't back by X time.

So the first thing was, he could see me on google maps on his computer and I could be pulling into our street.
He could ring me.
He could ring his Dad - at work but available to take calls
He could ring my friend, 3 miles away but able to get to him
He knew where all the keys were in case of fire
He knew what to do if there was a fire

We need to help children with planning, thinking for themselves, how to solve problems etc. If they are never left alone, how does it work when they start secondary school? Some children literally turn 11 and start school 4 days later.

The only thing I would have a slight issue with is the eating and the completely rare choking possibility.

I also have a sensible 9 year old son - he walks himself to and from school (about a 20 minute walk) and I leave him at home for up to about an hour if he doesn't want to come somewhere with me. I know that comparisons between countries aren't always helpful, but I live in Germany where this is all absolutely normal - it is very much seen as essential to encourage independence and self-confidence. And, having spoken to friends, it's not that German parents don't worry - they do - they just see it as a necessary part and parcel of life. I worried no end about it all at first, but I've definitely come round to the same way of thinking. If you've given your son the choice and he is happy to stay at home, then I don't see a problem.

If you trust him, then go with your instincts. My youngest DD is just going into year 5 and I do leave her for short times (10 or 20 minutes) to do errands. However, I have neighbours she can rely on.

Just go through lots of what to do if ...... etc and ban any sort of cooking (toaster).
He will probably enjoy a bit of time on his own.

*I would be contacting LA and telling them you can’t get dc to the bus stop due to other dc being left alone ... it’s their responsibility to educate dc ... that includes getting them there iro special needs. If you get no joy, speak to local mp... you’ll soon get somewhere.

If you didn’t have a car/didn’t drive, how would you get dc to bus stop? LA have to take that in to account. I think you need to focus on dt1’s right to access education in a safe manner. Try CAB. The transport issue is not right and needs resolving ... you might get better advice about that on the SN board*

From my experience the LA will say DT2 can make his own way to school, while o/p deals with DT1.

And the o/p does drive. So the “what if you didn’t drive” point is moot. I was borrowing a car during our appeal- i was told i could just keep borrowing it.

I regularly leave my 9 year old for an hour if I need to nip out.

He has the phone
He has the dog
Neighbour knows I'm out and keeps an eye.

How else do we teach them independence?

thehound my mum is German and I grew up there for some years. I find there is a lot less helicopter parenting over there in general - might have rubbed onto me.

It's fine as long as you have a contingency plan in place. Even if it's 'if I'm not back in X time, phone Y'. It doesn't necessarily have to be anyone nearby, just someone who can alert local services if, for example, you were involved in an accident.

Dd1 had instructions to call nana and grandad in an emergency. They wouldn't be able to get to our house easily, but would be able to get hold of anyone else inc dh at work, BIL or the school if needed.

BonneMa - it sounds to me as though your arrangement works well for all involved. Why change it? So long as you have discussed what your ds would do if you did not get back within 30 mins, I really don't see the problem.

My DD has started secondary school. My DD (age 10 year 5 walks to school- has done since Y4) My other DD (age 8 year 4) comes with me to drop eldest DD off at secondary school. This means she is late when we get her to primary school but this is how it has to be until DD11 is comfortable catching school bus.
My youngest DD -I could never trust to walk to school!! All Children are different.

You know your children OP. Whatever works for you

Of course it's ok.

It's not illegal and he is sensible.

I would just be sure he knows what to do in the extremely unlikely event of something prevented you from getting back.

As for rare choking possibilities, an adult can choke to death on their own just as easily as a 9-year old, fgs. I really don't think a NT 8 or 9 year old is at colossal risk of choking to death on breakfast cereal. At what age are you supposed to be OK to choke alone?!

Sounds like it's working well for you OP, your friends obviously aren't really considering the whole picture.

Like a couple of PPs, when I started leaving my 9 yos home alone, I asked them not to eat because of the tiny weeny choking risk. I'm not naturally a worrier, so tried to think of what could happen that was preventable, could be very serious, but also time critical (e.g. if a dc fell downstairs and broke a leg, they'd just have to lie there in pain for ten minutes till I got back, but it wouldn't get any worse!), and choking was all I could think of. Fires are often mentioned in these situations, but I thought it was reasonable to ignore the basically-zero risk of anything spontaneously bursting into flame!

And yes, I know anyone can choke! It just seemed very easily avoidable for twenty minutes. Older children can learn about self-Heimlich methods.

It sounds fine to me. I have a sensible Year 4 and would do this.

You can only do what works best for you and your children and what you feel comfortable with as you will always get a range of responses. I have a year 4 child and personally I wouldn't feel comfortable doing this but then I leave my house at 7.30 every morning and drop the children at childcare before I go to work so they have to be up and ready whether they like it or not.

I think it depends on the maturity of the child.

Make sure they can escape from fire otherwise no opening of the door or use of cooker, iron or fire.
Make sure they have an emergency contact as well as you. Preferably an neighbour or nearby friends parent as well as your exdh. 30 mins is still a long way away.

How about your shocked friends offer some practical help instead of criticism.
They should be ashamed of themselves.
My DCs are at secondary now but when they were in primary, I had several families over the years drop a child with me. They'd already had their breakfast or they brought something to eat with them to keep it easy for me. They just sat watching TV until we were ready to go, then I took them to school with mine. Are there no school friends' parents who could do this?
BTW, I don't think it's bad at all to leave DT at home for that length of time, at that time of day. But I'm also a single mother ( widow) so I think we have a different reality/ perspective sometimes- and HAVE to do things that we might not prefer if circumstances were different.

Having thought about this, I've got more to say...
My son never went to a mainstream school, but straight into a special education, so I spent many hours over the 14 years he was in school waiting for school transport. Some days it was late - weather, breakdown, etc - or it never came at all for the same reasons, so you need a back-up plan for those times. The other thing is that there were 3 children who used the school transport from the same pick-up point, which was historically at a certain place long after those children had left school. I asked the LEA to consider collecting from a point which made far more sense for those children currently at the school. They did, so I had a 5 minute walk to a covered bus shelter rather than 20 minutes to stand outside in all weathers.

My god OP - ludicrous responses here. He is 9 - he will be fine - this would have been very normal even one generation ago. In many many countries (including European countries) he would have been walking to school alone by now.

In scotland my cousins walk to school from 7 ?? How is that different?

You can only do what's best for your child and it sounds like you're doing your best in a tricky situation.

I voted YABU though. 99% of the time it'll be fine and you know your child. But the 1% of the time covers too many things for me. It's not like it's a quick walk to the corner shop when you've got a support network he can call on should something happen. If you've not got a support network and something happens to you when out, him having a mobile for you doesn't really help him.

That would be my worry but you're doing your best in a tricky situation and I think your friends reaction was a bit over the top

I think it's fine as long as he is happy. I think the extra time at home would make his day much more chilled. He has a phone & presumably you set his breakfast out. I think the morning seems better than the evening tbh.

I work for LA there is nothing legislative which would make this illegal.

OP has said the dad is available if there is an emergency, just can’t help on a regular basis

This is absolutely FINE OP! He's 9, it's a short period of time and he has a phone. Life cannot be risk free and the chances of you dropping dead whilst out are extremely slim. Maybe give him a friends number to call if you are not back by a certain time?

Honestly, Mumsnet is crazy.

AtiaoftheJulii - personally, I think choking so badly on breakfast cereal that coughing violently doesn't dislodge the blockage is not hugely more likely than being stung by an insect your turn out to have a severe allergic reaction to, cutting yourself badly on broken glass after dropping something, or starting a fire because you thought you were grown up enough to try to heat something on the gas stove or because there is faulty wiring in the house, or falling down the stairs and breaking your neck, or answering the door to someone who then robbed your house, etc, etc. I suspect a vanishingly small number of people know how to perform the heimlich manouevre on themselves, tbh, and if they do, they can cause severe abdominal injuries to themselves, so a serious choking incident is phenomenally dangerous to 100% of people who are eating alone - it's just it's an extremely rare occurrence to choke that severely in the first place if you have normal reflexes and are in otherwise good health. I don't think the likelihood of choking is great enough to tell a 9-year old that eating breakfast while you are out is too risky for them.