To feel very poor after recent thread

[Clappingforjoy]

Recent thread on here where posters where revealing their income got me really fed up that I must be one of the lowest earners around and it made me feel like failure failure.
Is everybody well off on mumsnet or something where are these people that have to use food banks because all I ever see is people with brand new cars, going on holidays nice houses etc etc i find it mind boggling.

I know this thread talks about high earners being time poor, or stressed/miserable, or never seeing their kids, or having a long commute, but there are many other workers who experience that too, who do not get paid well. Those pressures are not exclusive to the wealthy. Hard work does not equate to your level of pay.

There is a cliche of being poor but happy and rich and unhappy. But there are so many working equally pressured as the burnt out and wealthy solicitor (example of solicitor used upthread) yet wondering where the next meal is coming from.

I was very stressed with work last year and my anxiety was taking over my life. When I went to my GP he said that he was seeing so many cases of this due to the demands of work/modern living - people trying to keep a roof over their family's head. The responsibility is overwhelming at times.

I worry about retirement too. I don't see this happening for me and I'm just under an 'average' earner, yet part-time. I read the pension threads on here and it scares me.

When I read about people retiring early or paying off their mortgage I start to panic. But I think MN isn't always representitive of the real world!

It sounds really obvious but up-skilling is the only way. Can you talk to your employers and see if they could support you in getting some form of further qualification? Or have you looked into any free online courses in your area of work? Are there any other companies/ employers offering more money?

I was earning crap money for years. I was so sick of seeing friends climb the ladder and talk about how much they were earning.

Managed to scrimp and get the cash together to do a part time course for a very basic qualification which allowed me to apply for a new position in work (IT related role) and got 8K payrise.

Then after 5 years in that role I did 2 further short part time courses and secured a second promotion with a further 8K payrise.

It can be done, might take a bit of luck and some hard work on your part though. I thought I'd be stuck in my broke rut forever and never imagined I'd have got 16K in payrises in 5 years

Ihaveseenalot it’s not really bragging though if someone has asked is it? If someone finds it interesting to hear what other people’s financial situations are like and a poster responds I don’t see that as bragging as it’s information that was asked for. Why shouldn’t people on the wealthier end of the spectrum respond to that? Should they keep quiet because it’s gauche? Our cultural pressure to keep quiet about salaries/money isn’t a good thing in my opinion. It lets companies get away with disparities in pay for one thing. Why is it wrong to discuss something so fundamental to all of our lives?

I know this thread talks about high earners being time poor, or stressed/miserable, or never seeing their kids, or having a long commute, but there are many other workers who experience that too, who do not get paid well. Those pressures are not exclusive to the wealthy. Hard work does not equate to your level of pay.

Everything you’ve said PP is spot on. I have never been as stressed at work and therefore overall as when I was earning £12k. On a NMW zero hours job. The total lack of control over my own life, having to take shit and smile from managers cos otherwise I wouldn’t get any shifts the following week. Never knowing if I’d be finishing work at 1pm after starting at midday cos it was quiet or at 1am cos it was busy. The mental stress of being totally unstimulated and bored shitless, while also having no standing to refuse to take crap from customers and coworkers.

I’ve never been less stressed in work and life or had more of a work life balance than I do in a professional job earning a much higher salary. For many reasons. It’s been my experience that the higher I climb professionally and the more I earn the easier it’s become!

I only read the first four of the seven pages of the linked thread, but saw no bragging at all, nor anything that I'd imagine to be a lie. Posts were straightforward, giving the poster's role and salary, which is what the OP asked for.

I really don't understand why anyone saying they earn a lot is considered to be lying. It's pretty clear that there are plenty of people in this country earning a lot, and some of them will post here.

I know how you feel OP.

I regularly post my low earnings on here. I earn 13k (part-time). I do it because some people seem to think people on low incomes didn't work hard/don't work hard/are lazy/are uneducated etc and I like to point out that there are millions of people who have always worked hard and did well at school but are still earning a pittance for all kinds of reasons.

I have lots of qualifications, a degree and lots of skills but my skills and talent are not regarded highly in our society. That's just bad luck.

In spite of never earning more than 16k I've still managed to pay off my mortgage, have savings, build up my investment portfolio to over 200k, bring up a child on my own without benefits or maintenance, have annual holidays/birthday parties etc.

It's not just about how much you earn, it's about how you spend/save/invest. Plenty of people on good incomes never grasp this and will always be poorer than me.

So, I might be completely undervalued in the workplace, but in real life I'm very proud of what I've achieved. I'm never ashamed to say how much I earn.

@Clappingforjoy, one of the things I like about Mumset is that it brings parents of all backgrounds and lifestyles together. I'm sure I chat to people on here that would totally intimidate me in real life. Those rich mums relishing the chance to boast on that thread you mention are probably the same ones you offer comfort to on parenting threads or advice to on AIBU, and there are certainly many threads about people who are struggling financially.

I agree, and said, up thread that I dont believe the thread linked (if it's the one she is talking about was bragging at all).

I personally honk trying to shame people (especially women) into not talking about how they got a well paid job, what they studied, that they job hopped, skills they gained, the fact that they negotiated, aakes for pay rises, changed careers etc is damaging. Women really suffer with imposter syndrome and tend to take what's offered and not push for more.

Trying to shame those people into shutting up, does no favours for women at all.

@Clappingforjoy

Don't believe everything you read on the internet.

Some people claim to have these amazing high-flying six figure a year jobs, yet they're always on here!

A very small minority of the working population is on a six figure sum or higher, so don't take any notice. The vast majority of people on here making these claims are fantasists.

The thing is there is also age. Obviously someone aged 50 may well earn more than a 22-year-old. If someone looks at what dh and I earn and grumble, I would point to my £7K starting salary in 1987.

There was a calculator online a while ago called something like, "I am Dave" which worked out what the average income was for someone like you , ie same age, level of education etc. That really is more helpful to see where you are than comparing yourself with someone who is 20 years older with professional qualifications and experience.

I didn't post on the thread, which sounds pretty naff to me. There will always be somebody far worse off, and far better off, than I am. And that's even within the same profession.

My profession are the worst paid in Europe for what I do (academic). Out of interest, I Googled the average equivalent salary in the US, which turned out to be $102,000 (About £80K). I can promise you I don't earn anything approaching that amount. Conditions in the UK are not all that brilliant either. Admin, mechanics, politics are nasty, and getting nastier. But 'm fortunate enough to love what I do, which makes a big difference.

I went to university late. Whilst my friends were buying designer clothes, good cars, and travelling the world, I spent my twenties as a student, broke for 8 years and relying on public transport, Dr Marten boots and vintage shop clothes. But I made my own sacrifices to pursue the life I wanted, and can be proud that I did this without any form of help - financial or otherwise - from anyone.

As an aside, Jeremy Corbyn's idea of rich and mine are two entirely different things. And it's interesting that when the question of privilege comes around, there is no political will to attack the elite: the City, bankers and seemingly untouchable financial/ruling echelons who cream off the vastest percentage of the UK's wealth. No prizes for guessing why not.

You're also assuming that a) the people on that thread were telling the truth or that b) that the gleaming Range Rover sitting on the drive of their 4-bedroomed detached house hasn't landed them up to their ears in debt until they retire.

Being beholden to the banks forever - the very 'class' of people I despise as detailed above - doesn't greatly appeal. I drive a battered golf

I have debt, I don’t earn a high salary and constantly borrowing from a friend to get to the end of the month (then she borrows from me)

Many on here are comfortably off you can tell by the responses to certain threads like get a cleaner/part time nanny etc

But some love to brag and other like to okay the martyr

Having little money does bring you down but I don’t see myself as a failure I have a very worthwhile job, I work very hard and have job satisfaction just wish I was paid better though there is room for career growth. I think finding what you a are happy and focusing on that helps

But I still stress over bills

I posted on that thread, saying that I earn 30k working part time and DH earns considerably more. *Troysmammy is right, though - I didn’t post about the fact that we have loads of debt and live most of the month in our overdraft!

If you are concerned about your income and your future, could you look into retraining to get some more qualifications and a better job in the future?

Oh, don't make me look at "I am Dave", I will feel even more pathetically hard done by!

I earn, literally, (as per my most recent tax return) £10,354. That's it. And being single, that has to pay all my bills, everything, including my extortionate CT. I can't afford to heat my house or run the hot water system (I boil kettles and have an insta-heat shower).

But I survive. Everyone around me shudders at the thought of no central heating, no hot water and acts as though they would die if deprived of 22 degree heat all the year round. I just point out that I live exactly the way that EVERYBODY lived until about fifty years ago, and the human race has managed to continue.

@saraclara it’s not anyone saying they earn a lot, it’s a select few.

@user1493759849, hardly the vast majority, as I said, just the usual few. I haven’t noticed many people claiming to be on six figures anyway.

OP, there are certain threads I've learned to stay away from.
The 'how much do you earn' , 'How much do you spend on holidays', 'Can I survive on £200,000 a year' (and you'llalwaysget posters saying it's not enough) and finally, 'how much do you spend on dc for xmas'!

I find these pointless as well. I spend as much as think appropriate within my budget on all the above. If i read that 50 other posters are spending £500 on their kids for xmas and i have got £50 why is that in any way helpful? It wont give me any extra. Similarly if you were one if the ones spending 500 what difference does it make to them if someone else spent £100...?
And to the pp who "only " has 500 left after bills, i would be over the moon with that!

I work 2.5 days a week from home and earn 100K P/A.

Or do I?

Not saying everyone is making stuff up but you don't get the whole picture/ whole truth on here.

You don't get to hear from ordinary workers with ordinary salaries on threads like that!

gingersausage I think most people on here know what I mean when I refer to North/South differences. I’ve lived in London and know £60k is not very much, as well as other counties in the South where equally the same applies. But there will be pockets in the south, especially rural areas, where this amount would be considered a high annual income. Likewise in the North £60k for most areas up here would be pretty good money, but again there are pockets of affluent areas in the North, especially round Manchester, where £60k would be pretty average. The point I was trying to make is that whether your annual earnings are high depends very much on where you live as to whether it’s considered a good wage. I earn £26k, live in the North, and am pretty comfortable, but that amount would probably be classed as pretty bad if I lived in London or other affluent areas in the South.

Everyone is in their bubble. BIL told me recently the average salary is ~£50k in London. He mixes with super rich people due to his job and so has a completely skewed idea of what is 'average'. He was shocked when I said the median income was around £20k. He only knows people in professional roles.

I doubt most people are lying about their own income though, why would you on an anonymous forum (I've been on a S&B thread that was held up as an example of people lying about how many coats they had. I know I wasn't lying)? And due to these bubbles if you earn £25K most people you know will be on similar just as if you earn £50k most people will be on similar. Or at least you assume they are on similar, just like most of us have a tendancy to assume workmates are a similar age to ourselves unless they look particularly young/old. So if you have a household income of £100k it's normal. Because even in the north that income doesn't make you feel 'rich', just 'comfortable' with no money worries but still not able to buy things without prioritising. It's just that you are prioritising between a holiday and redecorating the sitting room vs prioritising between paying the gas bill vs feeding your DC if you are on a very low income. But e.g. on that income school fees are still a massive chunk out of your income so depending on your number of DC it may or may not be possible.

MN does skew richer and better educated than the average. This isn't a surprise because to be posting here you need internet access, time to fritter away and to be literate in English. Not everyone has all of these things and people who don't have them are more likely to be poor.

That said, of course the income threads aren't representative. People are more likely to post on them if they feel like they have something to say, whether that's showing off or making a point about how little they have to live on. There are also a lot of bullshitters, trolls and proper fantasists on here.

I really don't understand why anyone saying they earn a lot is considered to be lying.

Has anyone said that? Or have people pointed out that some people lie about money?

I wouldn't say the liars are all the ones pretending to be richer either. Always got the impression there are some low income claiming trolls on here too.

I wouldn't say the liars are all the ones pretending to be richer either. Always got the impression there are some low income claiming trolls on here too.

Yes, that’s an excellent point too.

On that thread there was no bragging.

I get peanuts but I make it work. If people get more then that's just life.

I only get annoyed if people assume hard work pays or pays off.

You can study and up skill and still get paid poorly. You can also work a physical or mentally demanding job or a skilled job and still get paid poorly.

The big wages do not mean you are more skilled or in a more demanding job and people need to stop believing that.

Also at every wage level, you can make your money go further but some people at all levels are wasteful.

These discussion are good as it can show which jobs earn more, it can show what education to do or not to do. It can also show that money does not buy happiness as so many posting on higher wages sound dissatisfied or tired and stressed.

So op don't let others earning more make you feel unhappy. Look at what you have got and be grateful.

@clappingforjoy You can get yourself in a better position financially by dealing with your debts. You can go to the CAB or a local debt advice service for them to look at them with you. You can potentially get either a debt relief order where they are written off or a repayment plan with the interest put on hold and minimal affordable payments being made. The advice services should not charge, other than the £90 needed for the DRO. It won't change your wage but it will mean that what you earn is yours.