To go ahead and feed my vegetarian kids meat?

[QueenEagle]

To clarify:

I am meat eater, dh is strict, strict vegetarian. We agreed when I was pregnant with our first that baby would eat fish and chicken.

One way or another I was overruled since and both our 2 kids have been veggie as dh couldn't face them having meat or animal products until they were of an age to decide for themselves.

They are 4.5 and 2.5 and their diets consist mainly of a processed frozen Quorn product such as sausages, Quorn chicken kiev sttyle thing, or similar with potatoes/pasta and veg. As often as time constraints allow, I make veggie shepherds pie or lasagne from scratch (ish).

Anyway, increasingly I wish to feed them good quality meat and I do struggle for inspiration for veggie dishes; in short I am getting quite tired of them being veggie because of dh's wishes whilst mine are disregarded.

Our relationship is at a very bad point right now and I suspect dh would see this as me trying to have a go at him. My older 3 kids have been veggie by choice for the last 4 years (dh and me been 2gether for 6). However dd has recently started eating meat again and tbh it's been lovely having a fellow meat eater in the house, and being able to do hearty beef casseroles and pork chops etc for someone other than myself.

If you have stuck reading this through that load of old ramblings, thank - any advice? What should I do?

on a slight tangent, DD1 seems to be going off meat. she does eat tuna and some fish but can someone point me in the direction of a good recipe book for toddler (she is 3) meals that are veggie. She's eating so much cheese at the moment, i really don't think it can be good for her.

and back to OP - get your dh to cook more! what does he like to eat?

I think 3 year olds would be fine with most veggie family meals such as shepherds pie made with lentils, stir fry with tofu and noodles, mild chickpea curry with rice, bowl of lentil soup and bread, etc

I don't think you should slip them meat behind dh's back, that would be very mean. Discuss it with dh. But sounds as if your 4.5 yr old wouldn't be tempted anyway.

If you do introduce meat, btw, go gently - if their bodies aren't used to meat it might take them a little time to adjust.

Cali do you think it is wrong to enforce one's ethical beliefs on children when they are too young to decide for themselves? Would you, for instance, let your children make their own mind up about stealing, until they were older?

Vegetarianism is a moral belief for most people who don't eat meat - it isn't a kind of lifestyle choice.

Califrau, it cuts both ways - if children eat meat that's because their parents 'force' them to have a diet that includes meat. Parents make choices for children all the time, including when we shop/cook/serve food.

I feed ds meat, btw, so not particularly biased one way or the other, just can't stand the false logic that vegetarians are somehow 'forcing' children and omnivores aren't.

don't massively get this tbh

i am not vegetarian, dp is, it means a lot to him that the kids are also

so we have a vegetarian house and outwith the house I occasionally eat meat (well haven't for years, can't afford it in restaurants but still)

Don't get what people go up on their high horses about

I don't think quorn is THAT bad, really, but I agree, OP kid's diet isn't very healthy and it would be wise to learn to cook some diverse dishes.

Cali, do you mean that you don't see it as a moral belief? Why do you think people choose not to eat meat? Because they don't fancy it much?

I know some people who stopped eating meat because they were worried about mad cow disease, not moral reasons

Which is not to say I don't understand the moral reasons which is why I have had times of being vegetarian and am very careful about buying meat.

Franny - dh moved into my house 6 years ago when he knew full well that me and all 3 of my kids ate meat and had done so all our lives. So how has it turned out that my whole house is now bloody vegetarian ffs?

I have been the one all along to compromise, find veggie dishes and cook the bastards. Yes, our relationship is part of the reason I am feeling like standing up against what I have sacrificed over the last 6 years, I even cook veggie stuff 99% of the time. It's as much being sick of being the only one of the two of us to compromise as much as anything.

QE I think it would be worth getting a book on child nutrition. Children do have specific nutritional needs in order to grow and develop to their potential. And it's perfectly possible to do this by being vegetarian. You just need to include certain combinations of proteins, etc. I think you need the FACTS so that you can be re-assured; or if you feel that the kids aren't actually eating the diet they need to help them develop, then as parents you and DH need to discuss that.

I imagine it'll be alot easier to discuss it from the point of view of their nutritional needs than from "I've been over-ruled by your views".

I also think you should relax about it; they have two role models in you and DH; one veggie, one meat eating. They will make their own choices based on that.

In case it helps here's my own situation. I'm veggie, Dh is not. I don't believe that meat is needed in the diet as much as most people have it, so we have meat about twice a week. Because it's not every day I can afford to buy organic, free range stuff and that is the only meat in the house. Ds has it if he chooses to, which he usually does. We also have fish and ds has that too.

I have strong feelings on this subject. My dp and my dss are vegetarians, dp isn't strict but became one to support dss when he was 6 or 8 or something.

DD is mine and dp's equally however I am responsible for the cooking in the house and it is my STRONG belief that for a child a balanced healthy diet is easier to achieve for a child by including good quality, responsibly reared meat in their diet. We eat vegetarian food 90 per cent of the time but I cook meat for dd and me every so often.
If dp was the one who was responsible for her diet then I would not object to him feeding her a good quality, well balanced, nutritionally complete vegetarian diet. But he is not. So I choose what she eats.

Now QE feeding your dc's veggie food within my terms is a courtesy to your dh and one that it is perfectly fair to withdraw if he is being a tosser.

I am a trained chef and have studied nutrition. I find it piss easy to cook delicious veggie meals that provide every thing our family need but if you are not and it is a pain in the ass, feed them meat.

I have said on here before that when dp and his ex let dss become a vegetarian when he was a small child they didn't realise that they needed to make him eat more than pizza and chips and such like. He has a curvature of his spine that may or may not be a result of bad nutrition. If your dc's are to be vegetarian you bloody well better know how to ensure that they get a properly balanced diet and not just be doing it to pander to a militant vegetarian who doesn't put his money where his mouth is. QE if he is passionate about his dc's not eating meat he can feed them himself.

I agree carmen - a child being veggie IS different to an adult. they have different needs. I agree that you need to inform yourself of what they need before letting them be veggie; it's not the same as when an adult makes that decision.

hear hear
now who is going to point me in the direction of a good vegetarian cookbook with things in that DD1 will actually eat! she wouldn't touch a lentil or mixed bean casserole for example. she loves cheese and is good with vegetables. it's the lack of protein i worry about.

carmenere - what a great post!

I have a good veggie cookbook and also one for ok-ish veggish kids food but not a veggie one that will suit adults AND kids alike. I DO NOT have time to cook 2 different meals each day.

dh does the cooking when I am at work but they are Quorn subs meals. I need fairky quick, easy to prepare meals that kids will like as well as us!

ami, "Yummy" by Jane Clarke is really good.

Here's a bit about vegetarian children

"Kids need protein because the amino acids the protein foods contain have a huge role to play in their digestive, muscular, hormonal and immune systems"

"with animal produce the proteins are what we call complete, that is they contain sufficient amounts of all the 8 essential amino acids the body requires. But vegetable proteins, with the exception of soya and seaweed, which in my world aren't consumed very much in a child's diet, are incomplete, and to get round this you need to have a variety of different vegetable proteins to ensure your child gets enough of all the amino acids needed to thrive".

She also says that "there are also numerous benefits. Studies have shown that children brought up on a vegetarian diet consume more fresh fruits and vegetables and are less likely to suffer from diseases such as obesity, bowel cancer and heart disease as an adult".

It's a brilliant book, worth having IMO.

Below are some of the foods I cook but I also do meat dishes and I do lots of fish as dp will eat that too.
Lentil/quorn bolognaise
Chickpea cakes/flafels
Veggie fajitas with guacamole and grated cheese.
Ratatouille with chickpeas as a pasta sauce or mixed up as a pasta bake with melted mozzarella on top.
Butternut squash curry.
Any kind of curry or casserole served with quinoa.
Veggie sausages and mash with onion gravy.
Veg Pad Thai with marinated tofu.

When can I come for dinner, carmen? YUM.

Yikes - just reading this whilst watching channel 4 slaughtering lambs!

I'm vegetarian and have been for 16 years, so over half my life. Dp (not veggie) and I decided that when dd was weaned she would get offered meat as it would be easier to provide her with a balanced diet. Neither of us are very good cooks and whilst I'm prepared to risk muy own nutrition because of my beliefs I'm not prepared to risk dd's. As she gets older I will explain to her my reasons, and the reasons that others give, for being veggie and we will accept whatever choice she makes.

agree re the reading up on nutrition

but thats true of ALL kids, meat eaters or not

the kind of parents who expect their kids to subsist on pizza and chips if vegetarian are not going to be offering fantastically balanced meals if they eat meat.

Kids do need protein, but protein deficiency is very rare in the west.

The big nutritional problem is lack of fresh fruit/veg and to an extent complex carbs. There is no reason on earth why a vegetarian diet should lack these.