To ask why parents let their kids do this?!

[MustardScreams]

Took dd out for lunch today to a lovely little cafe, geared up for kiddies (playroom, good kids food) as a treat as I haven’t been well, and work full time so we never have a week-day off together.

There was a little girl (the only other child there at that point) around 4/5 with no parents in sight and she saw me playing with dd and latched on. Usually I wouldn’t mind, but I really just wanted to spend time with my child. We couldn’t shake her off, and I couldn’t find her parent/guardian anywhere. Surely if you’re taking your kid out for lunch or whatever a) you keep an eye on them and b) you don’t let them harass other families?!

DontMakeMeShushYou I agree with your point about saying what you mean! All the references to it being "time to find mummy" are daft and clear as mud, especially to a child who knows they are allowed to go and play and isn't there with "mummy" but with a different adult...

"We want to play on our own" would be enough though. Clear and to the point.

The adult has no right whatsoever to send children away from children's play corners in cafes or from communal pools, parks or playgrounds. The child doesn't have to find somewhere else to play, just someone else to play with, or something else to do in the space.

This is half the problem - these are not private parent-child "quality 1:1 time" zones available only to one parent-child unit, they are facilities made available for all customers/ local/ holidaymakers children to play in/on. It's really the adult who should budge over to the periphery and make space, not tell the intended user to find somewhere else to play.

Because that sounds harsh?

And here is your problem. It isn't harsh. It is truthful, factual, clear, and firm but polite. It's a small child - they are yet to learn the intricate nuances of the English language.

DecomposingComposers no! To be frank the adults need to back the fuck off and let the children play! Independent play means no adults - line of sight supervision, the entire point is it should not be adult led nor adult focussed.

Something isn't right with children over 3 or 4 who want to play with adults all the time - they've either been over scheduled and not allowed time to be bored and learn how to play without adults, or they've been neglected, or they have a different neurology challenge which is a whole different issue. Either way it's a red flag that something needs looking into!

Independent play = no adults.

But how is the ops lap as space intended for random children to play on? How are our toys taken to a park for our children to paly with communal toys all of a sudden?

When people are talking about 1:1 time they don't mean they want the place to themselves they mean they don't want to have to entertain children other than their own.

We've been swimming on holiday and my DH has been giving piggy backs to our DC in the pool and then had random children trying to climb on his shoulders who, despite repeatedly saying no to haven't given up so he's ended up getting out of the pool. Please explain how an adult needs to budge up.in a swimming pool meant for everyone?

All children need to be taught to respect personal space at the very minimum surely?

Neurological (or developmental) not neurology.

"We want to play on our own" would be enough though. Clear and to the point.

I agree. I added the second bit preemptively for situations where the child is actually following you around or, as in the case of the OP, trying to climb on you.

sitting at a table in a cafe @EdnaAdaSmith you mean like the op was.

To be frank the adults need to back the fuck off and let the children play! Independent play means no adults - line of sight supervision, the entire point is it should not be adult led nor adult focussed.

Which is exactly what isn't happening. No line of sight play in the ops case nor in the examples that I've given.

And just because we took our children to the park to play on occasion why do you conclude that they never played independently and always played with an adult? Why can't parents, on occasion, take their children to fly a kite or kick a ball around or push them on the swings?

I take it that you never played with your children then? Ever, at all? That's very sad.

I think you're being a bit harsh! She's a child and some children just love to play with others, they are just super sociable. I haven't read the full thread but how on earth could she be in a cafe alone without her mum? Bit strange..

DecomposingComposers the child shouldn't have been on the OP's lap. The op shouldn't have let her sit on her lap. Everything in that scenario is wrong - not because 5 year olds shouldn't be playing in the play corner in a cafe without their parents playing too though! A 5 year old climbing on a stranger's lap and looking for adult interaction instead of playing has something the matter, it isn't developmentally normal behaviour and there are a few possible reasons. It's not usual though. 5 year olds who are typically developing would sooner choose a plate of broccoli, cabbage and Brussel sprouts instead of chocolate and crisps than climb onto an unknown adult's lap.

All children need to be taught to respect personal space at the very minimum surely?

But personal space varies from person to person. What you might consider to be the edge of your personal space, I might well consider to well and truly invaded. Young children rarely have a personal space bubble as large as adults. If you've ever seen children playing together without adults, there is a lot of hugging and touching going on. Everyone should learn to be assertive about their own personal space.

And why can't parents take their child to a cafe, park or soft play for some 1:1 time? If people don't have gardens does that mean that they can't kick a ball around with their child? As adults we go to public spaces to spend time with partners don't we? I wouldn't expect to be having a meal or a drink with someone and get some random person come and join us just because we are in a place with other people

@DecomposingComposers was coming on to say that.So if you where out with your partner and not your child,its perfectly acceptable for a strange child to climb in to your lap.
If not,why not? You are in a public place with other people.

DecomposingComposers now you're being ridiculous and ignoring things I've already said outlining exactly how I play with my children. I cba to go around in circles.

3/4 of the problem is parents expecting to live in a hermetically sealed "my little family" bubble when in community settings and over directing their children, producing older children and who lack creativity and are unable to function independently or do anything alone. The other 1/4 of the problem is neglectful parents who ignore their children.

"We want to play on our own" would be enough though. Clear and to the point.

I agree. I added the second bit preemptively for situations where the child is actually following you around or, as in the case of the OP, trying to climb on you.

And there's the rub! I don't like being put in a position where I am forced to be unkind to a four or five year old. I would never say that to a child if it was obvious they wanted to play with us. I might say "don't climb on me please" but I would never say "we want to play on our own" be wise it's mean! So I would button my lip and include them in the game and if that makes me a "martyr" or equivalent of what people say on here then fine! Better that than being unkind! But I still stand by the fact that parents in public and social situations, if at all possible, should be looking out to see whether their DC are bothering other children or adults. And DC should be taught to be aware of others and not go around bothering people and wait to be invited to join in. It's basic good manners.

be wise it's mean!

Bloomin' autocorrect!

Third time lucky ...because it's mean!

@MustardScreams
I hope you recall this incident when your DC who is an only child, is very lonely and wants someone to play with, but everyone is too busy concentrating on their own lives with their multiple children, and your DC doesn't get a look in 😥

dustarr73 she wasn't sitting at a table! She posted a photo of where she was! She wrote that the child was present until our food was ready and we went to our table The child was in the play corner of the cafe, which is meant for children - the child was in an absolutely appropriate place and not at the OP's table at all! However the child shouldn't have been on the OP's lap. The child shouldn't have tried to get into the OP's lap and the op should not have let them when they did try!

The op was in the play corner of a cafe showing her toddler photos on her camera, apparently. That's what she wrote.

If she'd been at her table the other child should have been removed immediately, but she wasn't.

Unless you hang out with your partner having couple alone time in children's public play areas (which would be weirder than anything a 5 year old could do) then where you go to be alone with your partner is nothing to do with how closely children in children's play areas should be supervised.

I used to work in retail, parents would dump their kids for 45 minutes or so, even leave the store and go to other shops. Not right.

The youngest I saw was about 3.

@EdnaAdaSmith but the child wasnt supervised.Otherwise anyone with a bit of cop on,would have went over and got their child from a strangers lap.

And i let my kids play independently,what i didnt let them do was annoy other people.

The other parent is in the wrong,completely.

Eeyoreshouse

I completely agree with you. I wouldn't say that to a young child either.

EdnaAdaSmith

Sorry but I think it's you being ridiculous. You're the one saying that there's something wrong with a child playing with their parent. You've decided that playing with a parent on occasion somehow means only ever playing with a parent.

As you keep saying, the op was in a public space. She had every right to be there too. In fact many such places have signs up saying children not to be left unattended so they actually want the parents to be there.

The person at fault here is the parent of the child who, if they were watching, should have intervened and if they weren't watching then they absolutely should have been.

Eeyoreshouse I very strongly disagree that you should teach / model to your child that they should be kind at the expense of feeling uncomfortable or significantly disadvantaged. They should be polite, and kind only when they can afford to be. Being kind at all costs paves the road to date rape and all kinds of other exploitation and is a terrible ideal to set up for your child, especially but not exclusively if your child is female. Boundaries, clarity, politeness, community spirit, helpfulness if you can afford to be helpful, being kind yes but only when you can afford to be. Secure your own oxygen mask first, then help others - not don't help others, don't be a mug because if you are you aren't helping anyone.

but I would never say "we want to play on our own" be wise it's mean!

It isn't mean. You're projecting your own adult social norms on to a child. Young children have not learned the sort of nuanced communications that you have as an adult. Generally this skill develops as children enter the teenage years. "We want to play on our own" is perfectly acceptable and unoffensive to a 4 year old.

YAB a little U.

The child is 4-5 and has no idea you want alone time with your dd in a public place. This child was in the play area too. My dd is very sociable and will make friends with any child anywhere, even with me there.

Yes the parents should be checking in, but I wouldn't know you were offended by my child wanting to play with yours.

Was your dd upset by this girls attention?

Just read all of your replies. Not unreasonable to want the parents to parent.
Definitely sounds like some lazy parenting. (Could still be more to it though - as someone who struggles with chronic illness I try not to judge.)

I would have been a little annoyed too, but probably would have felt a little sorry for the girl and done my best to manage interacting with her too.