I want Vegetarian choices, not just Vegan!

[ThisMustBeMyDream]

For 25 years I have eaten a vegetarian diet. I am vegetarian because I don't enjoy meat or fish.
I like eggs, cheese and all other dairy products. So I am not vegan.
This summer has shown to me that increasingly restaurants and supermarkets are making their vegetarian dishes vegan. So using substitute milks, cheese etc. I do not want substitutes. I am not vegan. I do not like any of the substitutes (I have tried them as I had a dairy free son for 3 years).
What can be done to protect those who are vegetarian? I am actually genuinely concerned about how places are doing this. It's much more common than people probably even realise (unless you're a vegetarian!). I want food choices when I eat out.

Me and DH are vegetarian, have been for over 30 years. I can't say we have noticed this at all.

Most restaurants we go to just seem to have added at least 1 vegan option to their menu but the veggie options are still there.

Vegan is vege but also tasteless, often pricey and full of salt etc to make up for the lack of anything else. Example being vegan fajitas I was served a few days ago. The place took vegetarian ones off (with cheese, sour cream, guacamole and fajita seasoning). The vegan ones were vegetables in a bitter tomato sauce and nothing else. So yes a vegetarian could eat them but hardly the same.

I'm vegan and even I have noticed this.

Also, tofu is vile. I hate it.

Not sure where some of you are eating? Most places have several veggie options compared to vegan. Eg the main pizza chains offer vegan cheese on the veggie pizza as an option, not a given.
Not sure about veganism being a ‘fad’ it’s more about becoming aware we need to be more environmentally aware. FWIW I’m vegan but don’t eat tofu or any of that awful vegan cheese or Jackfruit etc- I rarely have trouble finding things to eat in restaurants.

I’ve been vegetarian for over 30 years (not for moral reasons) and I also agree with the OP; I’ve noticed this in the past couple of months. If I go out to eat it is for a treat and I have found the vegan options bland.

That sounds like a terrible restaurant. The majority of Fajita seasonings and guacamole are vegan. There's no reason why they couldn't offer those.

And salsa is of course an option. There's no need for vegan fajitas to be bland.

I'm not vegetarian. I do eat a bit of meat but mostly default to fish or cheese. I'd rather have a halloumi burger than a beef burger.

I have seen this too, lots of companies leaping onto the bandwagon with their vegan ranges and cutting down on veggie options. Yes vegetarians can eat vegan just as the rest of us can eat vegan but they are having their choice eroded. Especially if they don't want to eat crap like quorn or abominations like "vegan bacon".

See the militant vegans who give the whole movement a bad name are out in force on this thread.

Never noticed it. I’m going out for a meal tomorrow, six vegetarian meals on the menu. If you’re vegan, pizza. That’s it. And it costs £3 more than the veggie pizza.

That’s fairly typical in my experience.

Coffee shops are the ones that annoy me tbh. Costa now have lots of milk alternatives which is great for vegans and people allergic to milk but they have nothing in place for cross contamination. They just wipe the wand thing down with a cloth. My dd has a nut allergy meaning she cant really risk the hot chocolate as it might end up with some almond milk in it.
I have no problem with them catering to other diets obviously but they could go about it better. And I doubt that the rise in alternative milks has much to do with allergies and more to do with veganism. Vegan diets are generally higher in nuts as well which make vegan diets hard for people with nut allergies.

rethereanyleftatall

Of the two, vegetarian or vegan, I would say vegetarian is more 'faddy'. 'Not liking meat' reasons aside, vegetarian for animal cruelty reasons doesn't really make sense. It's essentially reducing the amount of meat you eat (great), but not bothering with the dairy etc aspect which is possibly the crueler.
Veganism is on the rise, perhaps business owners are recognising and responding to this.
Vegetarianism for environmental reasons makes perfect sense. Cutting down on meat consumption is what we should all be doing. Many products used in vegan food and vegan products are flown halfway across the world. Coconut oil 'cheese' made from a thousand ingredients cannot be a good environmentally than cheese made from British milk and produced a few hundred miles away. If the endgame for vegans is for nobody to eat meat products, we wouldn't be able to feed everyone on the planet, unless we all day as if it was the middle ages. I wonder how many vegans there would be If they only had to eat locally sourced seasonal products? The jackfruit, avocados and coconut oil would have to be kept where they were grown. As well as cows, sheep egg becoming extinct. If the endgame is for meat production to be drastically reduced to enable more ethical farming, then vegans need to stop being so preachy and aggressive and let people just eat less meat without campaigning for small local butchers to be closed down as they have been where I live (ignoring Tesco, Lidl, Morrisons)

I guess this thread shows it is happening in some places and not in others so I guess whether it picks up everywhere will depend on whether the vegan options do well in the places they have replaced vegetarian.

I hope those on this thread that don't like the trend will, like me, vote with their feet and avoid said places rather Than going for the vegan option, because if we quietly eat it and say "lovely thank you" at the end it will expand further.

If more people eat vegan there is absolutely no reason why a meat option can't be dropped in favour of a vegan option. There are already many more meat options than veggie.

Tbf it doesn't exactly take much for a vegan to be considered 'militant'.

Totally agree. It’s so irritating when you go to a pub for example and there’s only vegan or fish - like vegan maccy - l want cheese!
I eat fish but I’m not a big fan of it and prefer a veg option.

So basically, you are complaining that restaurants are catering to ethical eaters and should think more about the poor fussy eaters? I'm an Omni but always feel it a bit cringey when a vegetarian has to let everyone know they aren't veggie for ethical reasons, they just don't like the taste of meat. I know 3 veggies like you who have to make sure everyone knows. Why on earth would you rather people know you were fussy rather than caring about animals and the environment?

But it's even worse to claim you need some kind of protection.

I get that people enjoy dairy. I do too, but I don't think there needs to be a dairy option on every menu when vegetarians can eat foods that are solely plant based and that don't contain fake meat. Like the items I listed.

This and several other comments along the lines of "but you can eat it so just get on with it"

and I think they're missing the point. I've been vegetarian for years in a country that automatically puts meat on everything. I am really happy to see that the vegetarian options are increasing (slowly, an average of one per restaurant) but they are often vegan and either bland or spicy. I don't want bland and i don't always want spicy when i go out.

I want a treat, a meal i can look forward to, something a bit sinful and fattening maybe. Definitely something that I don't cook at home. I don't usually go out for a burger or a pizza for a treat. I usually go to a high-end place. And a plate of thinly sliced beetroot and a sprinkle of alfalfa followed by a charred slice of cauliflower, some spicy chickpeas (yum, though) and a side of pea shoots followed by chocolate chia seed pudding just doesn't cut it. (to be fair, i can usually get a good creme brûlée for dessert so that's ok).

So while I really don't mind if it's vegan or not. I do want some thought put into it, i want tasty not dry (McD changing their veggie burger to the dry almost no sauce vegan thing was the final nail in their coffin for me, same with Subway and their veggie patty). As pp have said if i see one more sweet potato bake/curry I'm going to scream.

so, OP, in a way YABU because we don't need dairy in everything but YANBU because: Bland.

The waitress in pizza express told me my non-vegan giardiniera order was asked for by lots of customers!
I did exactly the same thing! I love mozzarella.

I'm an Omni but always feel it a bit cringey when a vegetarian has to let everyone know they aren't veggie for ethical reasons, they just don't like the taste of meat. I know 3 veggies like you who have to make sure everyone knows. Why on earth would you rather people know you were fussy rather than caring about animals and the environment?

I don’t agree that not liking the taste of meat makes someone “fussy”. There are countless people on this thread alone who say they don’t like tofu, jackfruit, etc. It’s a personal preference, not fussiness.

I think your view is coloured by the surprisingly high number of people of our acquaintance who “make sure everyone knows” why they’re vegetarian. Most people don’t know that many, you’re obviously just unlucky.

“Of your acquaintance”

It happens in this house. One of our offspring is vegan, one is vegetarian. I’m not cooking two meals so the vegetarian gets the same as the vegan. If she wishes to add cheese or eggs, she’s perfectly at liberty to do so. The rest of us are meat eaters.

Your very lucky to have a choice whether to eat vegetarian or not. I have intolerance to dairy, eggs and gluten and prefer vegetarian diet so therefore vegan menus are perfect providing they are gluten free. If you are just vegetarian you can ask for the addition of eggs and cheese to a vegan option but you cannot take it out, if the restaurant or cafe has pre-prepared items that already contain those ingredients. Please spare a thought for people like me that don't have a choice and certainly are not going through the latest fad!

If you are just vegetarian you can ask for the addition of eggs and cheese to a vegan option

Most vegetarian dishes that include eggs or cheese have it as part of the dish, though. It’s not just plonked on the side of the plate alongside the vegan option.

Why on earth would you rather people know you were fussy rather than caring about animals and the environment?

Surprisingly people who just express a simple dietary preference seem to have more friends. For some reason people just don't like when you tell them you are better than them.

There's actually a lot more natural and unprocessed vegan food than there is natural and unprocessed non vegan food.

Fruit, vegetables, pulses, nuts, seeds, rice, potatoes...all natural. Compared to natural and unprocessed non vegan food which would be unprocessed meat and fish, milk and eggs. Even then it's debatable whether consuming milk meant for another animal is natural...

Sure you can get unhealthy processed vegan food which is full of crap. There is a lot more non vegan food which is processed and full of crap. Whilst I don't have any stats I am willing to bet there are far more non vegans stuffing themselves fuĺl of crap food on a regular basis than you will find vegans doing the same.

I eat pretty healthy most of the time so if I want to treat myself to the occasional vegan sausage roll or some vegan mozzarella sticks then I don't give a damn what anyone else thinks.

It's funny that when I wasn't a vegan I frequently ate sausage rolls, chicken nuggets and other crap but nobody gave a shit. God forbid I want to indulge in the occasional bourbon or biscoff spread now though .