Self ID women being asked to volunteer in Devon Rape Crisis Centre *Triggering - rape*

[Theendofmyrope]

AIBU to think this is just fucking insane? Is this how it is going to be from now on? As the parent of a rape victim I feel beyond angry. Is no place safe for women now?

Butchyrestingface The comment in relation to sexual assault was from earlier in the thread in which someone had said women can't commit rape. I was just trying to clarify that they can, and even if the law only states penetration as rape it does not mean women can't be perpetrators of rape regardless of the strict definition in law.

@GCAcademic They're still a woman, a woman who committed rape but still a woman.

Butchyrestingface The comment in relation to sexual assault was from earlier in the thread in which someone had said women can't commit rape. I was just trying to clarify that they can, and even if the law only states penetration as rape it does not mean women can't be perpetrators of rape regardless of the strict definition in law.

Yes, I know. But you’re wrong. Women can commit sexual assault. They cannot commit rape.

Time - do not ever say this out loud to a victim of sexual assault by a male.

Lemon - they can campaign for their own shelters and services.
Just like women did.

As I have already said, your average transgender person has been utterly fucked over by the TRAs, there is no specialised help any more because they have put paid to that.

Even if they did campaign, and, miraculously the TRAs back down and a few years down the line they got a specialised place 1- where do they go for support meantime and 2- they would be applying for the same support as women's services and that would be the next thing "why should rape centres for transgender people get money when it could be put into women only services".

In a way if it was a really supportive male then it might help to get over the hurdle that it isn't all men that do these vile things but just a small minority.

Why do you think these facilities were single sex to start with? What has changed since they were set up?

And how are they supposed to seek that support if there no specific trans services, they are being sent to the rape crisis centres, and trans women aren't welcome to work there?

They can provide services for them in the same way they are provided for biological females. There should be no expectation that men who self id as women have access to biological females who have been assaulted. Devon RCC have not made that clear at all.

Lemon - Stonewall is hemorrhaging money supporting trans rights.
They can afford to fund more centres for transwomen than you can shake a stick at - tomorrow.
They don't want this. They want validation that they are women.
Again, google AGP.

Butchyrestingface You're naive if you think women cant perform acts of penetration using alternative means, resulting in rape.

@GCAcademic They're still a woman, a woman who committed rape but still a woman.

At least you’re more consistent in your position though.

The knots that TRAs tie themselves in on this site trying to define womanhood as simply a question of stating that you are one but at the same time denying that the likes of Karen White could be one.

98 pc of sexual crimes is committed by males.
There is absolutely NO proof that this changes on 'transition' - whatever that means.

They're still a woman, a woman who committed rape but still a woman

This utter utter bullshit is the reason why the world has Lost.Its.Fucking.Mind and women are being screwed over left right and centre

@Relizeliz They're still a woman, a woman who committed rape but still a woman.

Just, wow. So, you'd have the rape victim refer to her rapist as "she" in court? And put them in a prison with vulnerable females? Nice to see whose side you're on. Funny how it's always the person with the penis who ends up in the position of power. This is ideological thinking, pure and simple.

Why do you think these facilities were single sex to start with? What has changed since they were set up?

@GCAcademic. Honestly, I think that is partly because organisations like Rape crisis have gained more of a foothold in terms of finding and recognition and some of them have wanted to broaden out there client group. Also, the issue of men being the victim of sexual assault and rape had become more talked about and victims have started to come forward. It’s perfectly possible to work with a wider group of people sensitively.

Butchyrestingface You're naive if you think women cant perform acts of penetration using alternative means, resulting in rape.

I have nowhere disputed that women can commit acts of penetration using alternative means.

But the law states that rape involves penetration using a penis. That is what “rape” (in the context of sexual assault) means. Words have meaning. Even in 2019.

You don’t have to be man in order to commit rape sticking to the legal definition if women have penises too. This is unfortunately the new world and I have no idea why most people are accepting of it and politicians refuse to speak against it. You can talk about TRA lobbyists as much as you like but they are tiny as a voting block or proportion of the population despite being noisy. I blame Stonewall personally as in this politically correct world people are terrified of being homophobic and they’ve managed to conflate things.

The hated on here Pink News has stopped taking comments because who were once considered regular gay people are super critical themselves and pissed off with them for basic good reasons but also don’t want to be associated with them

@Theendofmyrope Don't worry my view of feminism will and will always include you.

Unfortunately not sure I'm included in yours.

MsMcWibble I don't need to Google anything thanks

So, again, how is your average transgender person supposed to access support? TRAs have fucked everyone over, they have got to all the big organisations who could help and cut trans only support services off before they have even started, there is NO help available, and there won't be for the foreseeable future because if these people who claim to have helped.

So what are transgender victims supposed to do meantime?

Just, wow. So, you'd have the rape victim refer to her rapist as "she" in court? And put them in a prison with vulnerable females? Nice to see whose side you're on. Funny how it's always the person with the penis who ends up in the position of power. This is ideological thinking, pure and simple.

Sickening as it is, I feel that position has more internal logic than the alternative “well, you’re a woman just as long as you say you are... unless of course, you do something bad, and then you’re not a woman anymore, and you never were in the first place.”

Both positions complete bollox, of course.

It’s perfectly possible to work with a wider group of people sensitively.

But why should they? If it means the result is a service that is less easy to navigate and becomes less effective for some?

Honestly, people who work at the rape crisis centre know what they are doing. They are people who work with trauma and vulnerable women everyday. They are capable of dealing with this appropriately. Don’t let some scare mongering stories in the news, about some stupid bastard in Canada, have you thinking that rape crisis centres aren’t going to be invaded by men with a skirt and an agenda, and no one will stop them traumatising vulnerable people.

I am basing my understanding on actual examples of women in refuges being sent away, onto the streets, because they would not share a twin room with a male person. It's happened. Those refuges did do that, and in at least one case, called the terrified woman they kicked out a bigot in the process.

Self ID females will be needed to help Self ID females who have suffered sexual assault.

I'm generally a rad fem but I still wouldnt stop a sexual assault survivor from accessing support they feel comfortable with, even if they have a penis yet prefer female pronouns.

It doesn't stop them needing help, does it?

Lemon I answered this.
Stonewall can fund it. They have ODDLES of money.
It is not women's problem. It's mens problem. They need to stop making women pick up the slack.
If you already know about AGP you will understand why women don't want to be used as a prop in someone else's sexual fantasy.

So, again, how is your average transgender person supposed to access support?

I don’t know. And it shouldn’t be traumatised women’s problem to deal with.

Off the top of my head though, piggyback on the men’s service and use the same arguments towards male sex abuse survivors that have been made to women on this thread.