Self ID women being asked to volunteer in Devon Rape Crisis Centre *Triggering - rape*

[Theendofmyrope]

AIBU to think this is just fucking insane? Is this how it is going to be from now on? As the parent of a rape victim I feel beyond angry. Is no place safe for women now?

I would be happy sharing with transmen.

I'm asking for one shelter for only women born women, within a 1000 Mile drive. One.

Ild go on a waiting list to get a space.

I'll never call rape crisis again.

I'll probably accept long term homelessness.

I'll not be able to access the legal help and advocacy I need.

So would you be happy for a transman to use the centres then? By the logic here, a transman is a woman

I feel it could potentially be an issue (I’ve referred to this on previous threads). If the transman had had some kind of penile constructive surgery, then there is the same issue of a penis owner in women’s spaces. But I gather few actually pursue this route.

In the absence of specific trans rape crisis centres, then yes, I think transmen would have to be allowed to access the service. I think there could be issues arising from transmen who pass sufficiently well as to appear “male”, but ultimately they are female and should be able to access the service.

it isn't all men that do these vile things but just a small minority

Seriously? Nearly 90,000 REPORTED rapes to the police in 2017
Over 500,000 women experienced sexual assault in 2017
80% of sexual assaults are NOT reported

A small minority you say. I would say a sizeable proportion of men do actually 'do these vile things'

Sorry you have tried in vain to help your friend Difficult

However I don’t think anyone here is ‘painting trans people as evil, horrible people wanting to steal services aimed at women’. This is not an all or nothing game. Why can’t we have appropriate services for both?

Lemon. Abused women should be able to access male free spaces.
What do you have to say to Detroit?

I am, of course, very sorry for Detroit. I have been in a refuge, pretty recently actually, and I can't imagine what it would be like to go through everything you go through to leave and then have to camp out for fear of your own safety. I really hope things improve for you soon Detroit.

The refuge situation is very different to the rape crisis centre issue though as you wouldn't be living with anyone at the crisis centre.

Women's crisis centres should centre women.
Women will not use services if they are confronted by males. Some women have even said that they would hang up the phone if they call for support and a male voice answered.

Damn....small minority of men!

Women are collateral damage in men's need to identify as women, is that your argument?!

Why can’t we have appropriate services for both?

Like trans people counselling trans service users and women counselling women?

Does it genuinely matter if they use the same building?

@Detroitinnineteensixtyeight
I would be absolutely happy for a trans man to share a shelter with me. 100 percent.

No problem.

They are women

You seem perfectly entitled to this opinion and I don’t think you opinion is unusual but please don’t say this to a trans person. It’s is insensitive.

I do actually find it odd that people are unhappy with a trans man at a rape crisis centre but happy for a trans man to be on one. Who may well appear extremely masculine- full beard etc. I wonder if this wouldn’t be more shocking to a female who had been the victim of assault at first sight at least.

I hate it when I there is an all men are rapists vibe when I’m a man. But we are talking about people who’ve been actually raped! It shouldn’t be an issue to understand why women in such circumstances want to be able to not have to be around men. I think people who oppose this stuff are inherently really evil nasty cunts

Catnip - We can tell 99.999% of the time.
If a transman was in a woman's shelter I think they would have a basic understanding of biology.

Does it genuinely matter if they use the same building?

But Difficult that goes back to my earlier point. How do you go about separation of the two sorts of women? If you are talking about one service, one point of use, how do you apply the division of users/service providers?

Also, Catnip, I really can't believe you are calling Detroit 'insensitive'.
FFS - Who is really being insensitive here?

How do you go about separation of the two sorts of women? If you are talking about one service, one point of use, how do you apply the division of users/service providers?

There will be forms and questions before anyone gets to the point of using whatever services they wish to access.

Lemon - women are hanging up the phone when they hear a male voice.
Workers at shelters are being giving instructions on how to deal with women who object. They are being told to centre the transwoman, and that the woman should be 'educated'.
Are you saying that crisis centres won't work the same way>?

There will be forms and questions before anyone gets to the point of using whatever services they wish to access.

But if TWAW, how will “forms and questions” identify a basis for separation?

Colour - good point.
Now that birth certificates are being changed, how will this work?

There will be forms and questions before anyone gets to the point of using whatever services they wish to access.

What sort of questions? Will they cover what point in the process of transition a TW has reached? What’s on their birth certificate? Whether they identify as trans or simply Female? Will other volunteers and staff have access to this information in order not to inadvertently mis direct a vulnerable client?

Not only does this seem unworkable in practice it also seems incredibly invasive.

Are you saying that crisis centres won't work the same way

I am saying, at this point in time, there is no reason for all of this speculation based on a few words in some advertising .

And I am saying that transgender people need to access support too.

As for transgender people being made central in refuges - having had a transgender person living in a refuge with me I can absolutely guarantee you that the world don't revolve around them in fact they were, obviously, pretty ill equipped to deal with the added trauma of it all and there were no specialist support services.

As I say I've lived the reality of it, I don't need to be reading blogs that may well be fictional to support an agenda, I certainly know how it was for us, and how it still is actually.

People who work at the rape crisis centres will be better placed than me to decide how service users are assessed.

I certainly know how my loved one has been questioned to access the correct services over the years, it probably is invasive, but then any similar thing where you need to access a service is really, trans or not.

A woman's right to be safe comes second to a man's right to not be offended.

Got it.

A woman's right to be safe comes second to a man's right to not be offended.

Plus ca change.

A victims right to access appropriate help and services comes before anything else.

All victims.

There is no suggestion that female victims will be in a position where they have to deal with anyone they don't wish to deal with.

@MsMcWibble No, I said if Detroit said that to a trans person, despite that being a valid opinion to hold, it would be insensitive. Just read my post again, I think my words are quite clear.

You might be surprised about trans men, I like some trans women, they often look pretty much indistinguishable from from Cis men. I can imagine the site of one in the ‘women’s centre’ could look exactly like any other man. I realise people have a basic understanding of biology but on these circumstances people aren’t usually performing physical examinations on one other.

I am not entirely sure why you are talking about ‘women’s centres’ anyway. This thread is about ‘rape crisis centres’ which often works with a wide range of people in terms of gender etc. I for one am glad no one is being marginalised unnecessarily.