...to think that children should look after elderly parents?

[wheresmymojo]

It's not a TAAT but inspired by another thread.

It seems to be a general trend that people feel like they shouldn't have any duty/obligation to care for their elderly parents anymore.

Partly I recognise that this is because societal trends make it harder to do elder care than it used to be - it's quite common to have two full time workers, be living quite far from your parents, still have DC to care for at the same time due to later births, etc.

I find it odd though that anyone wouldn't want to care for their elderly parents and find a way to make it happen.

So for example, we have just moved to live near to DH's parents who are in their 70s as while they don't need any help now, we know they will at some point in the next 10yrs.

My DM is very young (56!) so definitely doesn't need any help. I live 200 miles away but have already had the discussion that when she is elderly I'd like her to come and live with us.

I feel like I'm in the minority though these days?

I realise there are of course exceptions - any parental abuse and there will always be people who have very complex situations that mean it isn't possible (e.g. can't afford to move, already have children of their own with special needs, etc).

But I think it's sad that the average person either (a) thinks of it as an obligation/burden that they don't want to do or (b) thinks they don't have any obligation at all.

I think it largely is if you want to and are willing to be their carer and not doing it out of a sense of obligation for you can still love your parents without having to care for them.

My mum died at 55 and my dad at 67 but I always remember having this conversation with her and her being adamant that she didn’t want any of her children being her carer she said we have our own lives.

I myself have a 19 year old ds who has severe learning difficulties so know the challenges first hand of being a carer and believe me it can be exhausting at times, I care for my son because I love him unconditionally and I’m his mum, but my dh’s parents are now in their 80’s and I have made it very clear that I will not be caring for anyone else other than my ds, dd or dh, so if the time comes for them to be unable to live on their own and need a carer I will not be doing it.

Logistically we live to far to be able to help daily but I know and feel my dh mother in particular would expect her children to carer for her, I maybe wrong but I’m going on previous expectations of because she’s their mother they should do it.

I feel incredibly guilty about my DMum.

She lived alone 4 hours by public transport from me. I had no car.
I worked full time, had rent to pay and debts.

Quite literally to look after her I’d have had to give up work, my home, stop my DMP and move home.

As it was I changed my hours so I finished work at 2pm on a Friday, travelled ‘home’, looked after her until 6pm on Sunday night then travelled back to mine.

I did this for 2 years and was mentally/physically exhausted.

It’s not always as easy as people assume to care for elderly relatives when you have another life going on miles away.

ThighThighOfthigh

just to say, I haven't seen you around for ages. I'm glad your sister is helping out but I also hope you have got more help in since we last "spoke" about all this?

The only thing I would say about living a long distance away is that, as someone alluded to a while back, it can be quite hard to assess quite how much someone has deteriorated in their cognitive function on a daily basis. So, last year, my brother would swoop in every few weeks and go out for lunch with my dad, and inform us loftily that he was fine (with the inference being that we were fussing). But I would go down for a long weekend, or a week during the school holidays, and be in a position to notice that he couldn't get round the supermarket without leaning heavily on the trolley, or that he struggled to get out of his armchair as it was too low, or that he couldn't do his trousers up properly because he needed to hold on to the zimmer with one hand. Or that he couldn't use a tin opener or swing his legs up and round onto the bed at night when he was tired and he certainly couldn't cope with personal hygiene when he had a tummy upset (or even when he didn't).
I absolutely agree that so many of us can't provide daily care for our parents, but I do wonder who drives the process towards getting the necessary support if family aren't close by to observe the decline.

I absolutely agree that so many of us can't provide daily care for our parents, but I do wonder who drives the process towards getting the necessary support if family aren't close by to observe the decline

I've often wondered that too. My dad had 3 of us batting his corner, and that was hard work trying to get support. What if an elderly person has no family to help? How do they go shopping, cook, bath, do their washing (We always had a battle with my dad to change his clothes. But we did his laundry). How do those who don't have capacity/means to care for themselves manage? If there is nobody going back and fore their house how can they be brought to the attention of SS? They wouldn't even be able to get to medical appointments, or even realise they have an apt. Who notices that they need support?

It's very sad 😢 and very alarming.

We will also age someday and we will need our children to take care of us.

We don't know what life has in store for us or whether we may not end up in a situation where being cared for at home by our children would in fact be both uncomfortable and dangerous for us.

My MIL was dropped twice by her carers, while still living at home. It took dh and me all our strength to lift her onto the commode. She was terrified every time she needed the loo. Dignity?- I don't think so.

What she needed wasn't us (much as we loved her)- it was a good, properly equipped nursing home with trained staff. And I am glad to say that she got just that and that the last years of her life gave her the best quality of life she could possibly have had under the circumstances.

I do not want my children to ever have to full on care for me. Helping and company would be nice but I’d never expect them to prioritise me over their lives. I can see I’ll have this dilemma in the next few years. My mum is totally dependent on my dad and if something happened to him, she couldn’t live alone. I live 2 hours away and have small children. As harsh as it sounds, I feel my primary responsibility is towards my children and I will always put their needs first.

Not many people in Britain these days do full time care. What they do is the bits and pieces to keep someone at home. Maybe shopping, dealing with bills, replacing old clothes, sorting out maintenance, etc. Even by the time people need help getting in and out of bed and washed, this physical care can be done by a paid carer, with other bits being done by family.

@maddiemookins16mum, don't feel guilty. I think in these situations it would sometimes make sense for the elderly person to move. I know one of my mum's neighbours thought I should move in with her and look after her - ridiculous. I live 300 miles away, with a husband, 2 children and a job. If anyone were to move it would not have been me.

In any case, she didn't want me to be her carer. And then it got to the point where she couldn't stand, could barely move, and needed 24 hour care with 2 carers available at all times, along with specialist equipment. I'd like to see OP look after her parents in that situation.

Abused child here.

Like fuck am I going to look after her. You fucking do it if it's that important.

A friend of mine cleans for a lady in her 80s. She always tells me that 'in her country' she would never have to live alone, somebody would move in with her to take care of her.

BUT she has six children, she has a similar number of siblings and each of them has six children (her and her children are the only ones in the UK), that means each older person has around 36 grandchildren, of them some are bound to be without dependent children and able to take time between jobs in exchange for accomodation at any given time.
I have one child and one sibling who has no children. It's really not the same.

Absolutely no way would I want my children looking after me when I'm older. That's not why I had them, they didn't ask to be born, they owe me nothing.

I haven't the space for my elderly dad in a small home with four of us. If I win lots of money and bought a big home that would change, but I can't see that happening any time soon.
My siblings do have a bit more space , but their wives didn't want the responsibility of an elderly relative with Alzheimer's. I think most people on here wouldn't find that unreasonable. I certainly don't.
I wouldn't ever look after my mil ; she is difficult and made mine and other people's life's a complete nightmare over the years. She wouldn't want to live with us either.
What do we do then? ( she lives alone for now)
It's a horrible situation and even other people I speak to who have cared for old people / relatives end up having to place them in residential care as their needs are too complex: having falls etc etc.
I have gotten over the guilt of my own dad , but then I read threads like these.
What are we meant to do?

This seems to be one of the major challenges of our time and I don’t think we have even started to address it. Modern medicine has done some wonderful things but (in my humble opinion) has prolonged people’s lives with multiple interventions when it would sometimes have been best if that was not the case. Families are small, and hard pressed with most women working. Carers are poorly paid, difficult to recruit and hugely undervalued. People complain about having to sell their homes/losing their inheritance to pay for care. The truth is that many things will have to change. We may all have to do more and/or pay more. Maybe we should be looking more closely at community and family life in this country and what are values are. And maybe we need to think more carefully about endless interventions for the very elderly.

If you are under pension age and you care for a partner who will soon be pension age you will no longer be able to claim Pension Credit because of the age gap You now both have to be over state pension age to claim. And that could be going up as recommended by the same think tank that came up with UNIVERSAL CREDIT which is what age gap couples will have to claim instead. I posted a thread in Money Matters and there were plenty of people cheering it on. Some are just too thick and/or resentful and greedy to look at the bigger picture and see that the state will be providing the care if the younger spouse is forced out of caring and back to looking for work. Its likely that the state will have to do the care which will also mean more beds being taken up in hospitals after falls. There were plenty of people cheering this on which brings me back to the fact i mentioned upthread. The attitudes to carers who claim. And people wonder why some are now refusing to care. I started a thread in Money Matters back in January and some of the replies bear this out and prove me right!!

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/legal_money_matters/3479693-Changes-to-Pension-Credit

I know im talking about a spouse rather than a parent but the attitudes to family carers are the same.

THIS is what needs to change if you want people to step up for want of a better phrase.

I don't want to be morbid, but my parents will be long gone by the time I can stop working. They are in their 70s and 80s and I have approximately another 30 years of work ahead of me

What are we meant to do?
I have no clue, almost every account on here where someone takes on elder care ends with 'it broke me'
seeing this going on all around them increasingly people will see they have no option but to save themselves and refuse to do this work.

Most of us gave all we had to our children, we cant pay it forward and pay it back

My father in law is a narcissist who has emotionally abused my mother in law and his children. Husband has categorically said that he will not be looking after him when and if he needs that and that he will have to go into a home. If my in laws lived near us we’d have probably got divorced, they are not a good influence on our relationship and make no effort with our kids. Why would we want them to live with us, or for us to have to care for them, when they are not particularly nice people to be around. My own parents have made it very clear that they want us to not have to worry about us and have made arrangements for care when they need it.

I think if you want to, and have a good relationship with your parents or in laws then more power to you, to look after them, but I don’t think people should have to. If someone’s family are toxic and abusive or not easy to be around it’s not fair to say care is an obligation.

Carers are poorly paid, difficult to recruit and hugely undervalued
but with increasing numbers of elderly and we will have large numbers needing care and no one willing to do the work, for love or money

My parents are adamant that we don't help them, I doubt my sister will to be honest. But I will encourage them to let me help, but won't force them to either. I don't want my daughter looking after me in my old age though so I understand

Don't think it's a should - I didn't have children so they would look after me when I'm older.

I would like to think that they'd want to do this though - as a gesture of love. But that's not going to be the case with every family. If you've had crappy parents then you're not going to feel any obligation towards them.

I didnt bring my children into this world to look after me in my old age. I would hope if I was mentally incapacitated they would ensure my needs are met through support and outside help. It isnt there job. It's not a trade off.

I am very clear on this as I was born to look after my mother in her old age. I was told that. I did that however I know it tied me invisibly to a role I had to do. My late mom had alzheimers so it was increasingly difficult doing 24/7 with my husband.

So the answer is clear from me no it isnt their job

We will also age someday and we will need our children to take care of us.

Oh well, that’s me buggered then seeing as how I neglected to produce any children.

This does of course mean that I have always been in work, been able to save, and thus should be able to enjoy a comfortable retirement. If I need care (rather than dying suddenly) I hope that one of my nephews or nieces will help me find a nice care home. It would also be nice if they came to visit me occasionally, but I absolutely would not put any pressure on them to do that.

Pity the poor person who was the child of older or disabled parents, who grew up looking after them and consequently never managed to meet someone or have their own home. In their 50’s or 60’s they find themselves inheriting the family home but unused to the freedom to decide how to spend their own time. Too late for the women to have a child, and unlikely for the men. Who is going to look after them?

I think parents who insist their children look after them, at any stage of life, are deeply selfish. As are people who guilt trip others because they don’t feel able to look after their very frail, demanding and sometimes difficult parents.

Of course, we would all wish to do whatever we can for our family members and the people we love.

However, I have just said goodbye to my mother in law after 10 years of decline due to many health problems, chief among them dementia and severe depression. My father in law died two years ago after a 9 year battle with dementia and cancer. Trying to hold down a job, look after children and be there for my husband plus the pressure and demands of this very slow and terribly difficult decline was extremely difficult.

So whilst I have no regrets, everyone paid the price - especially me. There was no room for me in any of it.

My mum didn’t want me to look after her. When she was diagnosed with early onset Alzheimer’s she told me verbally and in writing both by letter and in her will, that she did not want me to look after her. She would rather go in a home as she didn’t want me to give up my life (200 miles away with a young family) nor did she want the indignity of a family member taking care of her personal hygiene needs. When the time came I respected her wishes. I found an excellent nursing home very close to my home so that I could visit every day, we spent quality time together in her final years.
I have said exactly the same to my children.