UK lost measles free status

[Stressedout10]

So due to all the anti Vaxers the WHO have stripped us of our measles free status.
What next ?

@yabbers
Yes, one study does not make a conclusion....but it sure does invalidate your baseless assertion that all mumps outbreaks are due to unvaccinated people who didn’t get the mumps vaccine 20yrs ago.
Oh, and the study I quoted referenced half a dozen others documenting the waning immunity to mumps in vaccinated adolescents.

vs the risk of an unvaccinated child dying are 1 in 100.

Erm 1 in 1000 for the western world.

@Aderyn19 it's not a choice I dont like

It's a choice that could hurt your kid (ol you're the parent maybe that's acceptable to you) but more importantly it's a choice that kills - kills or profounsly affects other people but disproportionately affects babies, elderly, immuno compromised etc. I think society can take action to sanction individuals for choices that can adversely affect others. As it does with many other situations e.g. speeding, wearing seatbelts etc

@TrainspottingWelsh
“I don’t think the lack of general ability/ education to interpret stats, scientific research etc is the problem. “

This is very true. In the US the highest % of anti-vaxxers is in the Pacific Northwest. A study was done on the demographics of unvaccinated children using school records. They found that an unvaccinated child was most likely to come from a rich, well-educated family. It really stems from a distrust of the government imho.

I'm immunocompromised. I don't want antivaxxers to make a choice for me. They can fuck off with their "parents' choice, doesn't harm anyone " bullshit.

As far as immigration goes, raising public perception would solve that too. People who come from cultures where drink driving or seatbelts aren’t viewed in the same way as in the uk seem to absorb the prevailing rules and public opinion without any difficulty. Immigrants who haven’t vaccinated aren’t generally deliberately choosing not to, they’ve either got more pressing concerns or simply aren’t aware it’s an option

AH...here is one such study. It is an interesting read and what stands out is distrust of big pharma, government, doctors etc.
“Demographic characteristics of vaccine refusers were consistent with previous studies (i.e., better educated, high household income, and geographically located in the Pacific states [CA, OR, WA])”
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4162046/

@TrainspottingWelsh
“Immigrants who haven’t vaccinated aren’t generally deliberately choosing not to, they’ve either got more pressing concerns or simply aren’t aware it’s an option”
True. And what was interesting about those boarding school studies is that they found that the likelihood of getting sick during a measles outbreak was higher for foreign kids who had been vaccinated in their country of origin compared to local kids vaccinated here. (Highest was unvaccinated obviously). But researchers were surprised by this finding. So a measles vaccine is most effective within the country you get it due to differing strains. So even though most immigrants ARE immunised, the vaccine is not as effective here against our local measles strains.

but it sure does invalidate your baseless assertion that all mumps outbreaks are due to unvaccinated people who didn’t get the mumps vaccine 20yrs ago.

I hardly think herd immunity is a baseless assertion. That’s way more documented than your one study.

My child is the most important thing in the world to me.

Thankfully there are many more people who feel all children are important. And sometimes our own children come second. Teaching them that’s ok is one of the greatest lessons a child can be taught. I guess you were never taught that as a child.

You know what, my kids got their HPV and meningitis vaccines at the school during class time.
I just read that 87% of 5yr old entering reception have had both jabs.
So we need to get up to 95% for herd immunity.
Why not just have ALL childhood boosters done at the school? You see I think a fair number of parents aren’t active anti-vaccines but just can’t be bothered to get in with GP, take time off work, etc etc. If they just started doing the MMR booster the first week of school, and parents had to actively opt out, then that would help a lot.

Interesting study angela thanks. It kind of proves the point that a little bit of knowledge can be dangerous.

one of the worst things that has influenced take up in tribal areas in Pakistan is where the USA had spies looking for Osama bin Laden masquerading as medical staff vaccinating for mmr & polio - surely the foreseeable side effect was that people started to distrust vaccination? hence in areas like the North West Frontier rumours spread about the nature of vaccination - looking for Bin Laden - fine but doing it this way was wrong on so many fronts.

@Yabbers
What? What does you saying all mumps outbreaks are due to no MMR 20yrs ago and my saying, no not all mumps outbreaks and providing scientific evidence of vaccine failure have to do with denying herd immunity? I don’t deny herd immunity. But herd immunity only works if vaccine immunity is effective and does not wane. You can’t just be prejudiced and say, it’s those damn anti-vaxxers and ignore scientific evidence that says...oh wait a second....we don’t have herd immunity for several reasons not just the % unvaccinated.
Why do you think we get three DTaP shots? Because they studied and found out one vaccine was not enough. That’s is exactly what is happening now with the MMR...two is good for measles, but mumps may need 3 shots to be well immune.

Thankfully there are many more people who feel all children are important. And sometimes our own children come second. Teaching them that’s ok is one of the greatest lessons a child can be taught. I guess you were never taught that as a child.

You would do something you thought would harm your child, on the off chance that, by not doing it, harm would indirectly come to someone else’s? I salute your belief that you would, but I am not sure it would pass the test of actuality.

I'm immunocompromised. I don't want antivaxxers to make a choice for me. They can fuck off with their "parents' choice, doesn't harm anyone " bullshit.

What choice do you think a parent who chooses not to vaccinate their child has made for you? As in, a choice that ought to be yours?

@herculepoirot2 wreck herd immunity and you put me at risk.

@herculepoirot2 wreck herd immunity and you put me at risk.

Sorry. My choice to make decisions about my child’s healthcare cannot be reduced to anything like “wrecking herd immunity”. You aren’t entitled to immunity via my child, if I believe providing you with it will harm my child.

I don’t, so my child is very unlikely to give you measles, but if I did, you can’t really expect me to take action that I believe threatens my child, for you.

@NataliaOsipova as a children's social worker for 8 years, refusing HV involvement alone would not result in SS intervention.

What I find the most irritating about anti-vaxxers is that they are more than happy to reap the benefits of herd immunity whilst selfishly weakening the net for those most at risk.

What I find the most irritating about anti-vaxxers is that they are more than happy to reap the benefits of herd immunity whilst selfishly weakening the net for those most at risk.

I’m not sure that’s true. If their child is going to present a risk to the immuno-compromised, it will be because they haven’t reaped the benefits, won’t it?

Haven't RTFT but you may recall we had a massive outbreak of measles in New York earlier this year, primarily due to one religious group with a history of not vaccinating.

Vaccination is required for school attendance, state or private, but many got out of it by claiming a religious exemption, which was recently eliminated:

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/jun/13/new-york-vaccines-measles-religion

By the way, the courts here have consistently ruled that government can mandate vaccination as a condition of school attendance.

www.historyofvaccines.org/content/blog/jacobson-v-massachusetts-reiss

And a challenge to a law California passed to tighten vaccination requirements after the infamous Disneyland measles outbreak has been rejected.

blog.petrieflom.law.harvard.edu/2018/07/30/california-court-of-appeal-rejects-challenge-to-vaccine-law/

My US state won't allow dc to attend state or private school or daycare without a vaccination record.
It works fine.
My needle phobic dd is going to get her current batch this afternoon, she will find it very hard but she understands that she won't get an education without it as well as it helping to keep her well.

‘I’m not sure that’s true. If their child is going to present a risk to the immuno-compromised, it will be because they haven’t reaped the benefits, won’t it?’

Well that’s exactly my point, they present a risk to the immunocompromised without necessarily being at a high level of risk themselves. The chances are that their healthy child is in less danger due to everyone else contributing to herd immunity. If they get the disease they are statistically more likely to fully recover. It’s the most vulnerable who stand to lose their lives when herd immunity is reduced.