To think that males should not be competing against biological females in sports

[Campervan69]

Another sporting body, this time Australian cricket, now allow anyone born male to self identify as a woman and compete in women's sports.

At the same time new "inclusion rules" say it's a breach for women to refuse to compete with trans athletes, use the wrong pronoun for them or say they're uncomfortable sharing the changing rooms with them.

AIBU to think that this is the beginning of the end for women's sports if allowed to continue?

And how can women fight against this if they are not allowed to speak out?

YANBU and I say this as someone who used to play cricket. Not very competitively but enough that know how insane this is. Facing balls from male friends and coaches for fun was ok because they knew to slow down. I would not bat if a man was bowling at me in a serious way, no way. If this goes on, whole teams will be made up of male-bodied people with all the advantages that confers. Women will withdraw for their own safety.

I was utterly desperate to play cricket instead of helping with the teas when I was a kid, but there were only teams for men and boys.

It seems so unjust that now there are actual women's cricket teams that women might lose places on it to men. Even the most mediocre of men can generally get on the 3rds, there's not that many leagues for women.

It's totally unfair. I play a full contact sport, and I practice against men, I do not feel particularly disadvantaged in a practice setting, and I do find it good training because they are generally bigger and stronger than you and force you to improve your technique, speed and (quite honestly) pain tolerance, all of which you need in my sport, so I'm not up for banning mixed sex classes. But competitions are a totally different ball game, the adrenaline heightens everything that's happening, and it's a lot harder for women to close that gap when we're no longer playing for sport, we're playing to win. And if mixed sex competitions must happen, they need to be clearly marked as mixed sex competitions and all people need to be eligible, not just trans people.
That said, I don't necessarily think that the people who make these changes, or even the people who push for these changes, are maniacal, hand wringing villains looking for anyway to put the biological women in these competitions at a disadvantage. I think the organisers need to be seen to be more inclusive, and their hands are kind of ties on that issue. And the people who push for these changes I think are mostly just misinformed, after all it's logical that if you fully transition and take sex hormones of the opposite sex then your body will become more like that. A few men are, undoubtedly, thinking this is a chance for them to win without really trying, but I think that the main issue at the heart of this is an honest attempt to make people more comfortable which unfortunately is fucking over a lot of people.

I think it's awful, just devastating for women's sport and makes a mockery of all involveds hard work.

I disagree re cricket, there's a huge difference between male and female bowlers, probably about 20mph speed wise. No reason they couldn't play if they were the same standard though but if it worked the other way round there would be no international women's team as a male England '2nd 11' would likely be stronger than the top 11 women unfortunately.

For anyone suggesting it is in anyway ok you don't know the fuck what you are talking about. As a bloke and reasonable cricketer, I once faced a team with a fast bowler from a minor county. He cracked the ribs of one of our players and broke the stumps when he bowled me. And he wasn't bowling aggressively.

I notice the usual crowd who come on to say how 'transphobic' mumsnet is when discussions arise about letting self id'd transwomen into female spaces never show up to defend this shit. Come on. Own it.

Another nail in the coffin of women's rights. It's noticeable how no women are transitioning to be male and invading male sports isn't it?

YANBU in the slightest. I have yet to meet anyone in RL who would disagree with you. My serious sporting days are over thank God, I couldn’t cope with this shit!

If men who say they are women are being treated by the overseeing body as if they are real women in that sport, while real women are forbidden to do anything other than pretend those men are women then it is no longer a womens sport.

There is nothing fair about it, forcing women to take part & lie about how they feel or have no arena to compete in at all is just more abuse of real women in the name of inclusivity.

If you are not - surely its actually a matter for those who take part in that sport, and that sports governing body - not you.
I watch sport, I have young relatives involved in sport - I do have a vested interest. But even if I didn't, this is an issue that affects women so I care about it.

Why is it on Mumsnet, only male to female transpeople seem to exist. I rarely ever see anything about female to male.
Very interesting isn't it. Male to female people make a lot of noise in their demands to be treated as women. But female to male people seem to be much quieter and less demanding. I wonder what the difference could be?

Yanbu. Absolutely devastating for today's young female athletes.

YANBU OP
This is an absolute joke.

Interesting development in America today

www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/us/2019/august/federal-govt-agrees-to-investigate-connecticut-policy-abolishing-girls-only-sports-due-to-transgender-opponents

"The CIAC policy regularly results in biological boys out-performing and displacing girls in competitive high school track events across Connecticut.

Throughout the 2018-19 track season, males consistently deprived the female athletes who are part of the complaint of multiple medals, opportunities to compete at a higher level, and the public recognition critical to college recruiting and scholarship opportunities."

Fondofbeetles has done a brilliant reply to this on Twitter. Apparently the fastest male bowler can bowl at 160mph but women have only reached 120 mph. She also points out that boundaries are smaller in women’s cricket to allow for differences in size and strength.

They have had a storyline in The Archers radio soap about having a mixed cricket team because they could not recruit enough men. I wouldn’t question mixed teams in social cricket but not 1st class cricket.

YANBU obvs. This is just cheating as another poster said. It’s an absolute bloody disgrace. Women’s rights are going backwards, how is this possible? We are actually having our rights taken away!

YANBU.

Lots of the sports authorities have got it wrong.

Transwomen, and those with a sex development condition with a Y chromosome, are cheating if they compete against girls or women.

Yanbu. I’m not going to make the slightest effort to try to “be nice” about this either, I’m just going to call it what it is, which is cheating.

Cheating. Taking your testosterone-sculpted male body into female sports is cheating.

I was very heartened a few weeks ago to attend an event in central london where 700 women (and a few men) got together to discuss what we can do about this threat to women’s sport. Rest assured, there are many, many women working together to keep women’s sports for women and girls.

(Fair Play For Women has all the details).

Of course it's unfair. Does it really need to be debated?
Campervan69 that is good news. Good to see that people are starting to push back in the US and hopefully Canada soon too.

It does need to be debated, because cheats have persuaded sporting bodies to prioritise their wishes over fairness and the needs and wishes of girl and women competitors.

I notice the usual crowd who come on to say how 'transphobic' mumsnet is when discussions arise about letting self id'd transwomen into female spaces never show up to defend this shit. Come on. Own it.

This, with bells on!

Agree with the poster who says its cheating.

How discouraging for women who have trained so hard, faced with many obstacles a male would never have to face, not to even mention the average strength difference between F and M, All To have it snatched away because of how someone feels

Unfortunately it does need to be debated because it's happening all over. I feel like recently all women's hard won rights are slipping away and half the female population are smiling and encouraging this to happen.

Not here on mumsnet I hasten to add. This thread is completely in agreement. So why can't the sporting bodies see this?

So why can't the sporting bodies see this?

Because sport is still, at heart, inherently misogynistic.

The sporting bodies have always resented having to fund women's sport. They are probably delighted to see an opportunity for its rising popularity to be sharply curtailed.

Dunno about that GC. I don’t think they care too much, but the public does and more importantly, there’s money in it.

USA powerlifting are spot on here with their new transgender rules:

t.co/JbD9s5cr7c

"Men naturally have a larger bone structure, higher bone density, stronger connective tissue and higher muscle density than women. These traits, even with reduced levels of testosterone do not go away."