AIBU to say that big is NOT beautiful!

[SummerSummerSummer]

So, I'm not expecting the MN community to take this statement well (or who knows), but I have come to the conclusion that the whole 'Big is Beautiful' stuff is complete nonsense! Big (I'm talking overweight here) is unhealthy, unattractive, and normal healthy weight is what we should all aim for.

Pre-DC, ten years ago, I was of normal weight, attractive and full of energy. I would cycle to work (in London), go running, rollerblading and do yoga classes. Whatever clothes I wanted to wear, I did with no problems. Everything looked great.

Children happened and the sleep deprivation, lack of me-time and the general exhaustion made me seek comfort in food and I gained a lot of weight. I would eat chocolate secretly behind my family's back to reward myself for something or to celebrate a moment or whatever reason really.

A few days ago I saw pictures taken of me on a family holiday and I can't fake it anymore. I look awful! My belly looks like I'm 6 months pregnant, my thighs are full of cellulite and my bum is enormous (however fashionable it might be at the moment). And I don't look good either. I hate getting into a swimming costume for everyone to see me, I cannot find any nice clothes to fit me and I'm so unfit!

It's easier to tell yourself in the winter that you're not really that big when you can wrap yourself in big jumpers, coats and scarves. You can do your hair and make up and kind of look ok. But in this heat there's no hiding from it, and no amount of make up or time spent on hair can fake you a healthy looking figure. And I hate the way I have to pull my t-shirts down over my belly instead of tucking them in like it's fashionable at the moment! And any leggings, tights or bottoms with elasticated waist always roll under my belly rather than stay up where they're supposed to be! Let alone the fact that this is now my preferred wardrobe due to jeans and smarter trousers feeling really uncomfortable! And tops! Spagetti top is a no, sleeveless top is a no, t-shirt is a maybe if it's the loose kind because of big wobbly arms!

So the reasons I'm saying big is not beautiful are:

1. Being overweight is unhealthy and puts you in risk of all kinds of illnesses (such as diabetes which I worry about)
2. You are constantly fixated on food and treats. What you are going to eat next, when can you eat it, how can you hide it from everyone else etc..

3.Nothing fits you nicely. You can not participate in the fashion scene.

1. You get out of breath so easily. Even going upstairs becomes a nuisance let alone having a game of football or tag with your children!
2. Telling lies to yourself is not healthy for you mentally. Healthy body, healthy mind.
3. Not wanting to appear in photographs. Editing yourself out of family photos which is super sad.

@Butters83 OP was saying that Big is Beautiful is allowing people to ignore their health. She also says that seeing food as a treat or reward is not good for health.

Do you really think that seeing food as a reward is healthy? Do you really think being obese is healthy. Isn't health beautiful?

Of course we all have our own aesthetics - but if you agree that Big is Beautiful, you do sacrifice your health to some extent. That is a scientific fact. If you value being Big and Beautiful over health then that is entirely your choice. Same with being underweight. No one would argue that being underweight is healthy would they?

OP you've said "You" a lot in your reasons for thinking this way in your opening post. You're projecting an awful lot onto others, you really should have said "I".

"Big" isn't beautiful.
"Small" isn't beautiful.
People are beautiful.
Their size is irrelevant, it's only one part of them.
Conventional attractiveness doesn't last forever - no point in using that as a measure of beauty if you've nothing else going for you to back it up.

I think you have an awful lot of residual self-hatred from your past, OP. I feel sorry for you if you think that every larger person thinks the same way as you do/did.

Gound this on health online.
Full article makes interesting reading.
O and my approx visceral fat was at normal levels even when still obese.

In a list of risk factors for those undergoing general anaesthetic obesity is the first one listed with smoking appearing third on the list.

@Butters83 you have no idea how fat/thin/obese/morbidly obese/dangerously underweight I am. You also assume that I think it's easy to lose weight and maintain that weight loss.

I'm an ex smoker (30 per day) and I don't preach at smokers, but I do know that they are making an unhealthy choice. I still miss smoking (gave up 20 years ago) and when I get to very ripe old age (should I be so lucky) I will take it up again in the latter years. Might even chuck in a drug habit and some chocolate eclairs.

But for the moment I choose to focus on getting to that very ripe old age.

zonkin

Ok, people with cancer are ugly.

Children with leukemia must be ugly.

Why is health beautiful? What does that look like exactly?

So no one ever died doing Cambridge style diets. O wait.
Although of course it was the excess weight not the strarvation.

@Butters83 talk about over exaggeration. Once again, presuming.

Why is deliberately being unhealthy attractive? Are you now saying being obese is the same as having cancer? Or children having leukemia?

As for Cambridge diet style stuff - of course that is unhealthy. And never going to work long term. How the heck could it?

Ah so now its not health that's beautiful - its people you perceive as being deliberately unhealthy based on a prejudice you hold against fatness?

"But if you eat fewer calories than your BMR consistently over the week and maintain that you’ll lose weight"

That sounds like a Cambridge style diet to may and someone was advocating it as a good idea.

@Butters83 I'm not prejudiced against fatness. I don't equate obesity with cancer either. What a rather offensive comparison.

The obesity paradox is thus: you could survive longer with fat reserves but your chances of surviving surgery are reduced significantly. Why do you think doctors won't operate on some obese people because the risk of morbidity is too high.

As I said we all have our own aesthetics - I don't find someone willfully harming themselves attractive.

It is scientific fact that being overweight is unhealthy. I don't see any scientist or health experts out there flying the "get overweight to become healthy" flag.

How can the Cambridge diet be compared to dropping a couple of hundred calories a day via healthy diet?

zonkin but fatness does NOT equate to unhealthy. There is a difference between correlation and causation.

Its fine to not fine fat people attractive. Its all personal taste.

Going bekow bmr is not dropping a few hundred calories a day. My bmr is 1200 calories so going below that is pretty ectreme dieting imo.

For all those lovely people having to endure fat women on TV - can I ask, if it was scientifically proven that obesity is an illness, rather than a moral failing, WTAF would you do with yourselves? How would you cope? If it became impossible to vilify fat people?

Would you form a secret society? Would you join a Fat Denial movement where you strived to overturn such a heinous scientific discovery? Would there be a logo or a uniform? Because of course you know that this is what research is focusing on at the moment.

Obviously, anyone with half a brain on MN knows that this is all bollocks and that researchers (duh) are wasting their time. The science is simple - eat less, move more (but do not dance on the telly please).

So just wondered. How you would cope if you couldn't openly talk about people being obese because they are "wilfully harming themselves" because those views (a) proven wrong and (b) ignorant?

If your BMR is 1200 calories then you are clearly not overweight. So yes, not healthy for you to reduce calories consumed significantly.

Nobody is "enduring fat people". Where did I say that? I couldn't give a shit who does or doesn't dance or TV. Or who wears what. Or who eats what. Or who does pretty much anything. To be fair I think most people couldn't care either. We're all to busy getting on with our lives.

However, I cannot agree that being fat/overweight/big/whatever is healthy. Until I see scientific evidence otherwise.

When the proven evidence comes in that obesity is good for you and people aren't wilfully harming themselves I will happily agree with you.

I am overweight. I am only 5ft tall.

Well then, you know the answer. Drop to 1000 for a while if BMR is 1200. You won't die. Your organs won't fail. Or don't. Your body, your choice. I won't judge but don't moan about being overweight.

Zonkin but your argument still doesnt make ANY sense.

There are a myriad of illnesses that cause weight gain, as well as some people just being naturally fat (as in, it would take an extreme diet for them to stay slim). You are are also completely disregarding peoples mental health.

You can NOT tell someones health by looking at them. If you want to make an assumption in your head, feel free.

Everyone willfully harms themselves every single day, by drinking alcohol, eating processed foods, smoking, not exercising enough, partaking in dangerous sports. Unless you are going to live in a bubble eating a vegan diet and only drinking water? So again, police the thin bodies as much as the fat ones. Oh..but you cant. Because that would be...pretty much everyone. So its just easier to pick on the fat people to make yourself feel somehow superior and like you might live a little bit longer.

It's a tough one OP.

I think the real problem here is that being fat is the symptom, not the actual problem itself. And it's a symptom with a very long delay on it.

If you have a bad diet, over-eat, don't exercise, etc it can take years for your weight to fully display this in being fat. It's a gradual shift, and by the time you really notice it, you're set in your routine and it's like turning around an oil tanker.

And, equally, if you are already fat and then start to live really healthily it can take years for your body to settle into a new equilibrium where you aren't fat. Do it for just a few weeks or months and you'll barely notice a difference.

So fat shaming doesn't really help anyone. It doesn't stop people getting fat, because it creeps up on you so gradually. And it doesn't help people get fit, because everyone wants instant results and when they don't get them they just jack it all in. I reckon you have the body you deserve base on what you've done over the past 7 years. All these crash diets are bollocks.

Butters83

You’re arguments are, ironically, thin

Lots of people fat due to having a disease. But many many more due to lifestyle. Go into a supermarket and look. Unhealthy shit everywhere. Go into a corner shop in a poor area, even more unhealthy shit. Fat people sitting in McDonald’s eating shit. But no connection in your mind with far and health. It’s idiotic.

As for saying being fat is in itself a disease- just an excuse. Otherwise everything could be explained as a disease. Schizophrenic person murders someone. Often still gets a life sentence. Why? It’s a new concept to you: PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY, ie unlike the snowflake attitude in your posts, things that happen to you are usually a direct consequence of your own actions.

Well, I should say most people have the body they deserve.

Very rare (a lot rarer than some would make out) but there are medical conditions where the body prioritises laying down fat over giving you any energy for actually living your life, and other such conditions, and no one deserves that.

Shortstuff99 but again - you are judging people just because you feel you can 'see' unhealthy choices on their body. Thin/Slim people also eat shit, and dont exercise, and take drugs, and drink, and go to macdonalds. But you dont police them because you cant 'see' their lifestyle choices.
So again, it doesn't fly with me at all that anyone cares about health.

Lol who uses the word snowflake, other than middle aged gammons on the daily mail hahaa

My point is that I don't CARE if people are healthy or not because thats not my business.
And my bugbear is - neither does anyone here. They pretend they care about fat peoples health while disregarding mental health and never once policing a thin unhealthy person. You just dont like fat people and cant/wont admit it. Because you need this to make your own life feel somehow superior.

Sure there are diseases that cause uncontrollable weight gain or loss. Those people have my upmost sympathy. I'd bet my house that the majority of overweight people don't suffer from these diseases.

I really and truly honestly don't go around looking at people and deciding if they are healthy or not. Life really is too short.

Never said that I though anyone who doesn't exercise regardless of size is a healthy role model. Never said that anyone who eats crisps, MacDonalds, biscuits etc is a healthy role model (once again regardless of size). Never said boozers, junkies etc are a paragon of virtue even if they are slim.

Go to MacDonalds, do a head count and a quick visual would I like to have their body? Bet there are more that you don't want to look like than you do want to look like.

In this discussion about HEALTH, nobody is fat shaming. Rather saying, don't preach to others that it's okay to be fat and something to take pride in.

Like I say, I don't really care about you or your health. I don't know you. You don't care about my health. Why would you? But I do care about my health.

And until I see proven evidence that being overweight is NOT bad for you and your life expectancy, illnesses in later life, etc. then I'm afraid I won't be convinced otherwise.