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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Those of you who have moved to the UAE?

111 replies

MonstranceClock · 15/07/2019 15:44

What's it REALLY like?

A friend has offered me a place on a graduate scheme at double the starting salary that would be offered here, for when I finish my degree.

However, I'm very feminist and have reservations about moving my daughter there. From everything I've heard via the media, from on here and from other sources, it just doesn't seem that safe a country to raise girls in. However, I am aware this could be my own prejudice as I come from an often misunderstood culture myself.

AIBU to dismiss quite a big opportunity because of doubt I have no real confirmation of? Are there any posters here who have emigrated there and have found it to be no where near as bad as it's portrayed.

OP posts:
Billballbaggins · 15/07/2019 15:45

I think ex-pats live in a glossy bubble in the UAE, they don’t see how it really is there. My friends who live there certainly do.

BostonFerl · 15/07/2019 16:00

I used to live there. People on here confuse it with Saudi Arabia all the time. For me, the chief problem with living there (lived in both Abu Dhabi and Dubai) was less its treatment of women than that it’s an effective dictatorship with a heavily censored press and scant concern for human rights, run by a series of corrupt interlinked royal families for the benefit of a small, culturally-confused minority of Emiratis who are outnumbered by foreign workers who can be deported for anything perceived as bad behaviour and have no stake in making the country a better place — it’s worse now than when I lived there in the sense that the authorities are now suppressing/imprisoning/ removing the passports of Emirati citizens who agitate for democracy.

If you are arrested for any reason, your rights are extremely limited, prison sentences can be arbitrary, and your embassy can do very little.

Plus the climate is awful for parts of the year, and it’s a cultural as well as an actual desert, and an environmental disaster. Having said that, I knew lots of British people who’d lived there for years and found the high untaxed salaries and cheap domestic labour made it well worth closing their eyes to other things.

Snog · 15/07/2019 16:22

I'm guessing that the posters who emigrated aren't the ones who have strong feelings about feminism or human rights.

Personally I wouldn't live there for 100 times my salary.

QRCode · 15/07/2019 16:29

Women are very safe in the UAE - there are separate areas for them to wait in public buildings, and to sit on public transport. I would go anywhere I wanted at any time of the day or night. Your responsibility as an expat is to know what the local laws are and observe them, which is not hard if you are prepared to dress appropriately in official buildings (v rare you will even enter one) and conduct yourself appropriately.

It is not a cultural desert - there is the Louvre in Abu Dhabi and Dubai Opera in Downtown Dubai, for starters, as well as loads of cinemas and a lot of street art and special events.

How old is your daughter? There are many excellent schools in the UAE, often with a British curriculum and British teachers, making it relatively easy to move back to the UK and pick up where she left off.

Original poster
MonstranceClock · 15/07/2019 19:08

I don't consider women having to sit in separate areas as safe. I may give it a visit and see, but I;m thinking it's not going to be ideal for raising children.

OP posts:
CarolDanvers · 15/07/2019 19:17

I've not lived there but have family who did for years and we spent a lot of time there. I'd move there in a heart beat. That said everyone I know has absolutely loved it, right up till they suddenly didn't and then they couldn't get back quick enough. It's a great life but not forever.

Dontsweatthelittlestuff · 15/07/2019 19:21

I have no idea but the fact men and women are segregated would not be a selling point for me.

PotteringAlong · 15/07/2019 19:25

I think there’s an AMA thread about it?

Adoptthisdogornot · 15/07/2019 19:25

Schooling is staggeringly expensive. So do your research and factor that in. Rent is also very pricey, and you'd be unwise to buy imo, the market can be very volatile. Quality of life is amazing, abd it's brilliant for young children, but I wouldn't want to raise children over about 10 years old there, they internalise some really unpleasant views, mostly re. race and money, they also cant ever work (holiday jobs etc) so that's not brilliant for life skills and independence. It's incredibly safe, you're far less likely to be a victim of crime than the UK. Having lived there, I think it's a great place to live/be resident, but not actually that great a place to visit/holiday in!
If the money is right, it's good to spend a couple of years there and save save save for deposit for house here etc. I wouldn't recommend planning to go and live there forever (you can't anyway) but consider a couple of years.

jellyfrizz · 15/07/2019 19:26

I lived there too OP. My children were very small when we were there and it was great then. I wouldn't have wanted them to grow up there though, too much consumerism and for many of the reasons BostonFerl mentioned.

I wouldn't say it was a cultural desert at all though. I learnt so much about so many different cultures through meeting people from all over the world and attending events from their culture with them.

PotteringAlong · 15/07/2019 19:27

Ah, no, it’s saudi Arabia

swingofthings · 15/07/2019 19:31

I don't consider women having to sit in separate areas as safe
And this is how prejudism takes place. QRCode didn't say you HAD to seat separately, she said it was available, hence able to feel safer than you would say in England when coming home late on public transport.

You are not forced to travel separately to males. I felt incredibly safe there with the locals, and that was dressed as I do in Spain, shorts mid tigh lenghs and tops showing my shoulders (but not my bra).

Of course I dressed appropriately in the mosque. One of my friend has been going there for years with her daughter and never encountered one issue.

No comment on the political agenda, but this whole stereotype that you are treated as second class because you are a woman annoys me.

GreyBasket · 15/07/2019 19:33

You'll need double your salary to live there though; more if schools fees are not included in your package (do check this! And if it's an allowance, know you'll have to top up. There are only private schools there.)

Ditto healthcare. They may rescind the offer if you are taking children as it adds to the expense of employing you. It is the responsibility of your employer to pay healthcare. Or you'll get lower level healthcare. Check.

Contracts are short (normally two years), rent is extremely high, bills are stupid, food is ludicrously expensive, childrens' activities are amazing but cost loads. Clubs like dancing, football, music lessons cost about 50% more than the UK.

That said, it's very safe for children and a very protected environment. My teenage girl could walk along the beach in a bikini and I would be 100% sure she'd get not a single whistle or ogle. It keeps children as children.

If your package is enough, it's a great place to have young children and they will make friends at school from across the world. Ditto you; half my friends are now different religions, nationalities and speak many different languages to me.

Greenmarmalade · 15/07/2019 19:33

The laws are harsh (e.g. Imprisonment for pregnancy outside of marriage, being drunk in public. Women have been imprisoned for being raped).

Schools: material is censored (I was a teacher there). Jewish holocaust isn't mentioned or taught.

Human rights abuse is everywhere. Labourers living in extreme poverty being abused by wealthy developers; their passports taken away; paid pennies.

It IS culturally barren due to censorship.

catlovingdoctor · 15/07/2019 19:34

I have recently moved there for work, albeit only for a few months. If you are an expat, I think it is very safe compared to the UK. There aren’t gangs of kids on bikes or acid attacks to worry about. I personally feel because of the culture, there is more general respect - hence there is no petty crime or littering in the same way there is in parts of the UK.

managedmis · 15/07/2019 19:36

It's a balance, op, like anywhere.

Amibeingdaft81 · 15/07/2019 19:41

I'm very feminist

The fact that you are considering this move would indicate you’re not quite the feminist you think you are! Grin

BananaFace5 · 15/07/2019 19:43

Look up the case of the missing princess, it is shocking. That aside, I still couldnt go for any amount of money

LotusInspired · 15/07/2019 19:47

I have been to Dubai twice and my best friend moved there and has worked there for 7 years. If I had the opportunity 7 years ago I certainly would and might even now. Not more than 8-10 years though, I feel in my 40s I might feel a bit isolated.

Original poster
MonstranceClock · 15/07/2019 19:48

I don't think it's prejudice to state that a country that requires segregated areas for men and women isn't safe. If it was safe, you wouldn't need those areas.

I am a feminist. But I'm also a skint single mum with a child and another one on the way, and sticking it out for 2 years could enable me to save up a lot of money for us to buy a house somewhere else.

OP posts:
HouseworkAvoider10 · 15/07/2019 19:51

I lived in Dubai for a while.
Loved it while I was there, but 2 years was enough for me.
Saved a ton of money and saw some beautiful places.
Agree that the climate is not always nice, its stinking hot and quite humid from May-Oct.

Will definitely return for a visit, just to see what's new, since I left.

SoundsAboutRight · 15/07/2019 19:52

I lived in Dubai. Loved it. Might be going back. But depends whereabouts you will be based? Sharjah is dry, so no drinking there, the likes of Ras Al Khaimah and Ajman are remote and very quiet. Abu Dhabi and Dubai are big cities...

Also depends on the age of your daughter and her personality. But as someone else said, school fees and healthcare are expensive. Check out the package for those.

Yes, there are things that are not ideal. But that's the same anywhere in the world if you want to look... It is definitely what you make it. You can have a wonderful time or a bloody miserable one, really is up to you.

SoundsAboutRight · 15/07/2019 19:57

I don't think it's prejudice to state that a country that requires segregated areas for men and women isn't safe. If it was safe, you wouldn't need those areas.

It is for religious & cultural reasons rather than safety. The UAE is very safe for women. Obviously, sometimes things do happen, it would be foolish to think otherwise, but it is much safer to be a woman or a child in the UAE than in just about any other country. You don't get teenagers hanging around in mobs carrying knives that's for sure that seems to be on the rise in the UK.

Adoptthisdogornot · 15/07/2019 19:58

You'll have a very difficult time as a single mum, it is required and expected that you are married to have a child. It is possible, but it will be harder in terms of paperwork, visas, utilities etc.