That no-one warned us about the horror of narcissists?

[iwunderwhy]

Am I wrong to be really angry that the medical and psychiatric communities let the public down by not educating us decades ago on narcissism, and for not calling it the serious F'g mental illness it is. Narcissism - the real deal (not vanity etc) is shocking, devastating, and dangerous AND there's mounting evidence its increasing. It's like a narcissism tsunami ...Is it me or WTF??

Very rarely though is it diagnosed by a medical professional, but the term is bandied around frequently by ex partners- understandably but an armchair diagnosis based on personal experience isn't the same as one by a professional. Many people may show narcissistic traits, but if not formally diagnosed it's an opinion not a diagnosis.

Mainly not diagnosed as people who may have it, don't go looking for a diagnosis as they don't believe they are wrong- everyone else is.......

Most narcissists would never go to see a doctor about their personality - they just don't see that they have a problem. So you'll never get any true statistics on this.

Unfortunately I've noticed that everyone who has a horrible mother / ex partner / sister describes them as a narcissist - or just a "narc". No wonder people think it's more common than it really is.

Or perhaps we r diagnosing arseholes as NPD. Top shelf NPD are rare
There are arseholes aplenty though.
We cant do much about that really except learn to be assertive earlier with people rather than excuse bad behaviour and try to be understanding etc

Is there evidence that it’s increasing? Have you got a link?

I don't know whether it's actually increasing or whether more people are realising, probably through the power of the internet and social media, that a lot of behaviours that they've put up with for years are just actually shit.

And I agree that a lot more people have narc traits than are true narcs - but whether that's down to an actual disorder or just upbringing and sense of entitlement is hard to say.

I don't think it's going to get better any time soon, either.

It's not a mental illness though. It's a personality disorder at the most. Getting any sort of diagnosis out of the MH sector is hard, let alone labelling a fairly large proportion of the populace :)

I know a diagnosed Narcissist.
Her behaviour is so extreme compared to the examples on this site.
She destroyes relationships for no reason.
Very dangerous person.

Mn diagnosis of others narcisism is on the rise

But i doubt that actually apllies in real life

I wish I had been educated about this disorder before I met my partner though as I recognise all the traits in him and I can see very clearly now that changing him and the way he thinks is near on impossible now. I have wasted years feeling sorry for him and excusing his lies etc but now I have an insight into narcissistic thinking it helps me realise I should be putting myself first instead of him. More education for young people about self esteem and relationship building would be useful in general. Because I am a kind and empathetic person, I just assumed most other people thought in the same way. And now I realise they do not!

Mn diagnosis of others narcisism is on the rise

But i doubt that actually apllies in real life

Exactly. Pretty much every ex-DH and MIL on MN is an informally diagnosed ‘narc’. Mainly this seems to mean ‘I perceive them to be a bit selfish and they do things I don’t like’.

Narcissism - the real deal (not vanity etc) is shocking, devastating, and dangerous AND there's mounting evidence its increasing.

Where is this evidence from? Any links? Genuine question. I’d be interested to read some robustly researched articles on this.

How are we supposed to be educated op? At school? On adverts?

I work in mental health. Narcissistic Personality Disorder (which is what I think your opening post refers to) is actually a pretty rare diagnosis still, in the grand scheme of what the majority of people receiving mental health care are diagnosed with.

And how would you expect the public to be educated on this? Are you looking for lessons in school? A TV campaign?

Some people are just very selfish and manipulative though & thrive on dominating others.

I’ve found it’s best to ignore those. They hate that 😂

My DFs mother was, so is one of his sisters and one brother. My DH mother and her 2 youngest DCs are too.
It causes terrible mental anguish for their victims, I've seen both my father and DH take yrs to get over the mental abuse they suffered. Even my MiL own mother knew she was one from being a child, and it was only last year just before she passed that she realised how bad her daughter had it and how many ppl it affected.
For my DHs mental health we had to go NC his DM nearly 3yrs ago and it was the best thing as he's now thriving and HAPPY.
Is it a condition of environment or are you born with it?
I'd doubt the ones I've encountered would seek diagnosis as they are adamant their behaviour is 'normal'.

Growing up and witnessing what my DF had to go through at first I just thought she was the 'horrible' grandmother from the fairy tales...but obviously as I grew I realised just how different her behaviour was.

If diagnosed is there an actual treatment for it?
My eldest has dyspraxicia, it's very obvious, but we've been informed that NHS do not diagnose for that within our trust area so I'd imagine getting a diagnosis for narcissism even more difficult maybe?

Lastly OP I agree that we are let down and not educated enough on this condition and it seems totally overlooked. Alot of ppl suffer at the hands of narcissists and if you are raising children then in my view having experienced my DF and DH, it's clear they were badly neglected children and they had no help to overcome the mental scarring left except from loving ppl (thank God!)

It’s only on the rise on Mumsnet. In reality, the people they are saying is a narcissist, is definitely not a narcissist. They would realise this if they met a diagnosed one. I hate that term being used on Mumsnet

Look at Quora.all about narcissism

Narc has become shorthand for anyone you don't like. It's become the bitch and bastard of its time.

The question is, though, who would you like to warn us about the horrors of narcissists, and how, and what would that warning involve? I'm old enough to remember those terrifying AIDS awareness posters from the 80s, and how they achieved little beyond demonising gay men and blonde sex workers.

For a person to attract a diagnosis of NPD, they need first and foremost to be a human being, with all the dignity and intrinsic value that entails. Then they need to encounter a mental health professional willing to impose such a scientifically-dubious and stigmatising diagnosis - that's harder. And then what? There's no treatment. Are we suppose to throw them in prison forever? Or feed them to the lions at Edinburgh Zoo?

(My qualifications in saying this - I once had a BFF with diagnosed NPD. She was nothing remotely like the internet-diagnosed "narcs" on here, her narcissism was really the least of her many problems, and she was an incredibly kind and likeable person)

'Narcissist' has become a convenient label to slap on people whose behaviour we don't like. Just like 'must be schizo' or 'manic depressive' used to be bandied about as insults.

But really, does it matter what label we put on it? If someone's behaviour causes us problems, yet it doesn't seem to affect them in any way, we just have to either work around it or cut them out of our lives. Because whether they are 'narc' or just nasty people, they aren't going to change just because we don't like how they behave.

And as for educating us about narcissism - well, it's up to each individual person to decide what behaviour they will and won't put up with, and draw their own lines in the sand.

I'm not sure what diference it makes? My parents are incredibly abusive arseholes. Wether they are "just" arseholes or "actually" narcissists makes no difference to the damage they did to me and how I need to heal from it

I suspect my DF has Narcissist Personality disorder. He caused a great deal of trauma to me. What could I have done as a 5 year old child, moved out?!

I knew someone who would trample on anyone to advance his career. He would lie, use people, generally see people as objects. I have no idea if he would be diagnosed with NPD and he certainly wouldn't see a doctor to be diagnosed, he wouldn't think there was anything wrong. He's very successful and earns a lot of money. People don't really like him much but he (obviously) isn't concerned about what other people think.

I do think it's important to make the distinction between someone who is narcissistic and someone who has NPD. I think it's possible to have many narcissistic traits without having a psychiatric condition. Or perhaps, like autism, there is a spectrum?
I think the key is to recognise the behaviour for what it is and to protect yourself from it.

I'm not sure what diference it makes? My parents are incredibly abusive arseholes. Wether they are "just" arseholes or "actually" narcissists makes no difference to the damage they did to me and how I need to heal from it

It probably makes a huge difference to people with mental illness who have carried the stigma of being society's bogeyman to then round up all the arseholes and slap them with a mental illness diagnosis.