To say postnatal wards are the least conducive environment for a mum/baby recovery

[cheesemumma]

Currently sitting on a ward at 11.30pm. 6th night. No exaggeration I think in total I must have had 4 hours sleep. My physical and mental health is suffering. I'm going to have to talk to the Drs tomorrow and say we're going home whatever, as we're getting more ill staying. Its not just the other selfish fucker couples that decide to talk on phone /watch films/ have conversations with each other but the staff seem to not give 2 shits it's the middle of the night. I realise my tiredness and hormones are a big contributing factor but I can feel a full tantrum /meltdown coming on. It's also 10000000 degrees and the enviable screaming babies plus the fact you get 3 teeny portions of food a day so I'm really hungry as ebf.

Op I really feel for you. I had dd 16 years ago and the one night I had to stay in for was horrific. Christ the heat, the noise. It’s still all seared into my memory. That’s why with ds 2 years later I insisted we were off as soon as possible. Went straight from the delivery room home after the obligatory 6 hours. I went on about it so much in those 6 hours the nurses were only to happy to find a doctor to get rid of me.

YANBU. My stay two years ago was awful. It was february and the ward was SO hot so I can't imagine what it's like in summer. So much noise from other peoples visitors who were allowed in large groups for hours and hours until late. How they didn't bring food round the ward, you had to get up to get it yourself on the other side of the department but those of us with c-sections couldn't move so didn't have hot food for days. Men wandering around while I'm walking to the toilet in an hospital nighty open at the back with my giant arse out and bleeding everywhere. Keeping the lights on until midnight. The midwives/nurses talking really loudly amongst themselves until the early hours. The constant opening of my curtains from different people trying to sell me baby packages etc.
Women deserve so much better after going through birth/surgery.

My recovery started once I set foot in my own home.

Forgot to add.. I had my first in a hospital in the Middle East and it was so much better. Private room, private toilet, the midwives took all the babies over night every night so mum could sleep and start to recover, all meals brought to my bed. It was amazing.

The thing is the nicu nurse and midwifes have said her breast feeding is perfect but waiting for milk to come in. I don't think it ever did with dd1. But she's prem, small and jaundice so contributing factors mean I think it's all a bit to much for her. My plan is now pump as much as possible, top up as much as possible with breast and then formula as needed, which should help solve the jaundice and weight. A lovely nurse just came, got me a pump, said me and dh could use a pram and go to the cafe as its my dh birthday for a treat, they'll let her off the ward. And she said they'll try and move us into a nicu room.

Not in Dorset. I have a frie d who's wife is an nct Councillor who has offered to talk to me if needed which is nice. So hopefully that will help when we get home.

For me the horror started half way through the labour. When my assigned midwife aka bitch 1st class, walked into my room and stated that she was not going to help deliver my baby as there was a woman delivering Twins next door and she was so excited to do them over me. Would maybe be understandable, but she had been pretty horrible throughout my time with her - I was young, early 20s and looked about 16 and was not married and she had made it pretty clear how much she disapproved of me.

But the full movie started an hour after giving birth, with my legs akimbo to the Almighty while my vagina was being stitched up from a deep tear and a random doctor came into the room with 2 students who stood just within the doorway but could pretty much see everything, while the doctor asked my midwife if it 'was ok' for them observe the person stitching me up. Rather than just say no, the midwife came to the bed very slowly (it seemed like fucking half an hour) and asked me for my opinion (half delirious and exhausted) and I weakly croaked no. But the doctor gave me a look of disaproval as she shuffled out.

Then trying to get DD to latch on: My nipples were just mammoth size and really hard - I hadn't realised I needed to massage the nipples months beforehand to soften them up - Anyway nurse comes in and sees me struggling to get DD to latch. She kisses her teeth Jamaican style then grabs my breast and starts squeezing my nipple. I actually screamed they were so sensitive. She just kissed her teeth again and said: "How do you expect your baby to get such a large nipple into her mouth?! You were supposed to soften them up first! Of course your baby can't latch on!" I had to beg her to stop and she said "well, it takes effort!"

I had my mum there but she was useless cow towed to authority like a sheep. (Note to any future mums to be reading this, make sure the person who goes with you can stand up for you (and your dignity) when you're too tired/in pain/drugged up/intimidated to do so. That isn't necessarily the person you'd like to be there).

Hours later on a 6 bed ward and DD still not feeding. Can't get help latch her on am imprisoned by the catheter and need to rely on the nurse. DD is just screaming. Pulled the cord and a nurse turns up and says "what is it?" I'm tearful and say I can't get DD to latch on and she won't stop crying I need a bottle - I had packed one, -but left the it behind and my mum was bringing it in - nurse tuts, "well of course not, you're so emotional, you need to be calm or the baby will definately not latch on. You should have been practicing!"

Later (nearly 24hrs) DD stilled not latched, my pleas for a bottle and a bit of formula were met with stern lecture by a senior nurse about how finite hospital resources were and "didn't I know my baby couldn't possibly be that hungry, her stomach was barely the size of a pea!!"

Then usual noisy visits, phones, crying babies, people bringing all their kids in, bounty pack lady, photo album guy - being unable to bathe because of the catheter, teeny smiddy food portions, horrid dramatic midwife swanning around after she had declined to help deliver me: "Let me see.....Oh! I've never seen a vagina so swollen before, I have no explanation!!" After I display my vag for inspection.

Our ward was by the reception. They had a radio on. Can you believe it? All fucking night long. It was playing Bryan Adams "baby when you're gone" over and over and even today I can remember the chorus going on and on:
"Baby when you're gone (when your goooooonnneee) I realize I'm in love (Soooooo in loooovvvvee)
Days go on and on (on and ooonnn) and the nights just seem sooooooo long (DD screaming)
Even food don't taste that good (la la laaaa), drink ain't doing what it should......

And I'm desperate for one myself by then!

Left on the morning of the 3rd day. 6 years later I ended up back there. But mentally armed by then and left the next day.

Get baby as much daylight as possible. I'd have a wander in the hospital grounds with your pram.
Get baby as close to the window as possible.

The bounty woman. Why?? Seriously how are they allowed? I've been asked 5 times. No.

Massive sympathy here OP. I stayed in for 4 days after DS2 was born. Absolute hell. Hot, noisy, cramped, being told different things by different midwives with regards to breastfeeding.

On the fourth day I was discharged by the doctor at 9:30am and I waited until 4:30pm for the midwife to write up my notes. She only did it then because I told her that my husband and I had to go home to collect our toddler from my parents (true) and if she didn't do the notes I'd be discharging mused come what may because I wouldn't have any other way of getting home.

My sister actually did discharge herself after having her twins. She was in a private room but was completely forgotten about and nobody gave her any help. She basically said that she was better off at home where her family would wait on her and the twins hand and foot. She was a children's nurse before having the twins and I think that gave her a sense of authority whenever she's been in hospital herself!

Sorry YANBU definitely not.

Wasn’t there a mumsnet campaign around this a little while ago? All of this fits with my experiences of my first birth. Second was a home birth as I couldn’t face the hospital again. We ended up going in and staying for one night but I demanded and (paid for) a private room where the window opened otherwise I would have discharged myself and gone back in the morning as there was nothing seriously wrong. After giving birth I just wanted a safe calm place to rest, sleep and recover and to be looked after and helped and supported with my baby. None of this was possible. Hope that you get home soon xx

🙈 the bounty women took some gorgeous photos of my first...... best ones we’ve got of him new!

yanbu - it is hell, if hell existed it would be an eternity spent on a postnatal ward. I've had four, all c-sections & I have ABO incompatibility so they all needed to stay in for a week plus for observation/treatment.

I had my first in 2000 & it was busy & noisy & lacked privacy but they were very strict about visiting, midwives generally treated you like a human being (rather than a PITA at best, something to abuse at worst), it was reasonably clean, there were meal times with (sort of edible) food brought you & staff did generally try to communicate with you & one another. My next three were born in 06, 09, 11 in the same hospital - the difference was unbelievable.

It was filthy - blood & god knows what else in bathrooms & corridors & on furniture. Midwives were awful - actively nasty, rude, mocking - I believe they were getting off on being abusive to patients. They ignored everything that was planned antenatally & then shrugged at the complications this caused (SCBU - but it wasn't their problem, they were probably happy to have one fewer baby on the ward). Sadistic in their refusal to administer pain relief. No controls on visiting - town centre on a Saturday night was calmer - it was intimidating & felt very unsafe at times. No meals - food was dumped at the end of the ward (which is huge & multi-area so effectively four in one, I was on the special care one - couldn't have chosen a less appropriate name - which is furthest away), you weren't allowed to take your baby with you to get food so were only fed if you were happy to leave your baby out of view/earshot in the company of fuck knows who. Getting a water refill (or god forbid a cup of tea) was impossible. My last two were born in a hot spell the temperature on the ward was dangerous. No-one would answer the door buzzer so most of the time it as propped open with a bin. Total lack of communication (or you know, reading notes) ... I could go on all day, it was just hell.

If you're going to have a baby in the UK (or maybe just England?) expect it to be awful, you will be treated like shit & will be lucky if nothing dangerous happens. Save for private care or at least a private room (£185 a night at our local NHS unit & no guarantee you will get one). Have someone who is willing to bring you food/drinks, guard your baby while you wash etc (hopefully you won't catch anything in the shower), if you have other children your partner needs to look after & no-one else to help then you are screwed. Consider taking your own pain relief. Pray that you have a complication free delivery & healthy baby. When you eventually get home you will need time & TLC to recover from their care (ha!).

I'm a medic and had my mum with me for the last three deliveries - she's a midwife - we do not have unreasonable expectations. Between 2000 & 2009 medical care improved - delivery was much better/safer as was antenatal care but postnatal was almost unbelievably bad.

@CatherineOfAraginsPrayerBook I honestly think I just burst my stitches reading that. The dinner lady came to check I was OK. I think I may be a little hysterical. Haven't belly laughed like that in a while. Tah

Bounty are no longer allowed in our local hospitals after we campaigned pretty hard to remove them.

Yanbu. My stay on the ward was awful. It gave me PTSD. I can't think about having another baby as the thought of possibly having to stay on a ward again gives me such anxiety. When I think back to giving birth to Dd it's tainted by such an awful experience. It's the reason I was put off breastfeeding too!

I was left on a piss and blood stained mattress for hours as my catheter bag leaked. Not one nurse came and checked on me or asked if I was okay. The bell was ignored and when it was answered I was met with a disgraceful attitude and made to feel like I was bothering them. I was too anxious to ring the bell and only rang it a few times! I didn't eat or drink for 36 hours as I was expected to trail to the canteen with a new born and a bag of piss attached to me. The other mum's had partners and family to bring them stuff and get them stuff but I had no one. The nurses seemed to be happy to help them but I felt like I was just the stupid young mum with nobody who didn't matter. I was even told off for leaving Dd alone for 5 minutes whilst I went to get a glass of water.

I desperately tried to breastfeed but recieved minimal help and was simply told to try harder. At one point I was told off for starving my baby as she's gone without any milk for 24 hours. They threw my ready made formula away and refused to let me use the bottles I had brought as they hadn't been sterilised in front of them. In the end I gave up breast feeding. The whole experience put me off.

The other babies cried all night and I didn't sleep for 36 hours. Dd was too weak to make a noise which made me feel even worse!

One woman was brought in at 3am and had no respect for anyone else on the ward and continued to talk loudly to the staff and constantly ring the bell. She kept asking if the nurses though her baby had downs syndrome and going on about how awfully big she was at 10lbs. Asking for toast and tea and being waited on hand and foot!

I had to listen to the other mum's successfully breastfeeding and having their partners there all day.

I literally just sat and cried behind a curtain for the whole time I was there. The only person who was remotely nice to me was the Bounty woman! She gave me a hug and that was the only bit of salvation in my whole stay.

Also to say, I don't want to bash midwives, I know they do a fantastic, challenging and often thankless job. Some of them are amazing. And I know some fantastic. Ones who were horrified by what I told them this morning. But some, like all professions, give a bad name.

With the Bounty lady and loud and firm "fuck off" will suffice. The trust's have stopped it around my area (finally!)

You are not failing your baby. TBH, I would top up with formula right now to get the baby up to her required weight and run home for lots of long, lovely skin to skin cuddles and blissful sleep.

My first baby was at this time of year, six years ago in the middle of a heatwave. I was fortunate to get a room as I had a C-section, but the heat (and the fact you could not open the windows) left me feeling like I was boiled alive.

I have heard of babymoon hotels over in China. They sound like an amazing idea.

I hated it every time. After the first time I swore I would not be staying again but had emergency surgery and blood transfusion after DS2 so no choice. I discharged myself after 24hours because the 'care' was so awful. Exactly the same issues - the godawful heat, the noise, inconsiderate people, being woken at all hours for random crap, being expected to care for DS when I was sheet white and felt awful, having to stagger down the ward to get food. I went home, my DH and my mum looked after me and I went to local hospital as a day patient for transfusions. When DD was born she was a few weeks early and below the birthweight for discharge and we had to go to transitional care. It was not so bad because I was relatively fit and well, but I was actually relieved when she had to go to SCBU so I was moved to a side room - where is the logic there? Relatively well mum gets quiet, twin bed room whilst baby is cared for in SCBU, I could spend as much time as I wanted with DD but also go have a sleep and know she was being cared for. I did still feel like I was going mad from being trapped inside. OP, get some clarity on why your baby needs to stay, whether the same care could be provided in the community and whst the timescale is for going home. If the issue is with your baby rather than you then I guess you can't discharge against their advice or they might get SS involved, but you can work with them on a plan. We got out earlier with DD because we agreed to take her for daily checks with community midwives.

And I think the whole trauma started when a doctor tried 5 times in one go to pop my waters. It didn't work, my cervix was closed. It eventually opened enough to pop 12 hours later My husband couldnt look at me while she did it. apparently he told my dB it was like watching his wife be tortured. There was a lot of pain and blood for nothing. I was panicking from that point on. No wonder my BP went up!

there is a culture of bullying in the NHS which in areas is particularly bad in midwifery. The person at the very bottom of the pile is the patient. I don't think care can be improved until we're willing to address that (the NHS angels narrative is supremely unhelpful).

I self discharged after dd1. I was 18yo, told to adhere to pathetic visiting hours (5hrs broken up during the day) so had no help, had no idea how to even change a nappy. They were rude, patronising and refused to help me when I asked as the lady next to me had twins so she needed help round the clock. They refused to give me a bottle for dd and made me wait 4hrs with a hungry screaming newborn until my mum came in with milk. I self discharged and they outwardly called me irresponsible and told me to go back to my bed when I went to the desk to query something. They also put a lady who had sadly just lost her baby in the bed opposite me, in a room with 5 other ladies who had newborns. Fortunately her husband kicked off big time, grabbed a wheel chair and took his wife home whilst telling them exactly what he thought.

Second time me and OH left 24hrs after emcs. Also asked for help multiple times as he screamed all night long and was unable to get him to latch. I work in the same hospital and was so utterly shocked at just how poor the care is. Were all short staffed but we try our best. On post natal ward it was like you're just in the way. I hope you get out today! Cant believe the huge response on here of bad experiences, that speaks real volumes.

And we scratch our heads and wonder why so many women develop PND/PTSD...

I'm a medic

Did you also get the impression that midwives thought it was funny that they had a doctor in their care?

I've described some of the crap they told me upthread (claiming "the doctors" had passed on advice which I knew was rubbish).

But I also had a lot of, "Well. You know what it's like now hahaha" and witholding of pain killers.
During the birth of my first child my OH suggested things were going wrong (turned out she was OP) and got yelled at: "Doctors! You're always the worst".

I had an awful time with my first. I found with my second that help was more forthcoming when I was threatened to switch to formula as I was desperate to go home! “I’m not hand expressing, he either latches properly or we give formula” mysteriously got me some breastfeeding help in the middle of the night. They told me we needed feeding to be established to go home, but when I said “If we need to establish feeding to go home, he can have formula” magically we suddenly could be discharged that day without feeding being fully established. I hope you get out soon!!

Yep, I self-discharged after 2 nights of hell. I'd say it's a massive factor in me not wanting another baby too (but obviously not the only factor!).