To be upset that he didn't respect my wishes about taking my children out on open water

[twirlytwit]

Long story short... FIL lives in small harbour side town on south coast. There is a walled off tidal pool, with a promenade walk way which we've witness children practicing sailing in previously.
Visiting FIL for Father's Day, 2.5 hour journey by car, happy to do so, relationships are good.
He's been keen to take the children out on his two man sea kayak and small dinghy with a motor for a while. I've never really been keen - kids are 4 and 6 now so I felt too young last year to either appreciate it or do so safely.
DH and children had to go without me Fri night as I had to work Sat morning.. then follow on by train, length of trip meaning I didn't arrive until 1600.
Before going I had a chat with DH and said very clearly that I was only comfortable with him taking the children on such a small boat within this walled harbour area and organised wetsuits for them to go. I even said to him I would consider it a serious breach of trust if he ignored my wishes. Also mentioned in a text to FIL re organising wetsuits that I wasn't keen for them to go in open water.
So yesterday I arrive (Sat) the kids meet me at the train station with DH, have already been out on the boats. First thing my daughter says was 'Mummy it tipped up and I drowned'. Clearly she hadn't actually drowned! But it turns out on questioning my husband they went out in the main harbour because it was too far to walk to the walled in bit. He then said he didn't know what I was taking about about the walled in bit anyway and was generally snotty/ignorant about it.
Turns out they went out in the general harbour area, not where I asked. In the dinghy at first which did not work (motor issues), had to row it back. Whilst FIL went back for oars husband had to secure the boat by hanging off an abandoned vessel in the harbour (for long enough that's he felt his arms might fall off - his words) with two kids bobbing about in it. Then they tried the kayak and managed overload and overturn it. Thank god they had buoyancy aids on. Kids like water but not competent swimmers (weekly lessons, but daughter still in little pool). Not used to the sea. It was cold & choppier than they thought it would be, but they continued. They failed to do something up properly on the kayak and water got in so apparently 'not their fault' it was overloaded. Kids a bit upset by the shock of falling into the water but the adults shoved them back onto the kayak and had to swim in back to shore. Got them back safely but I feel by luck rather then judgement.
Not a good introductory experience for the children. I told my husband that I was cross he'd ignored my wishes but didn't wish to spoil the weekend.
Then it turns out FIL spent the afternoon fixing the motor so they can go back out today. I've just said no. Kids not even keen, yesterday put them off. Son (6) said to
Me 'daddy lied and said we were in the safe harbour bit you told us about'.
AIBU? DH now has a strop on because I've 'embarrassed him' and don't trust him and his father enough to take the kids out safely.
Alternative is we leave early as I'm sticking with no today, it's horrible weather and I don't trust them to stay in the safe area - so left it as his choice.
Am I being unreasonable and spoiling their fun? I'm not a sailor or water goer so outside of my comfort zone.

And there is no such thing as being over the top about open water safety with young children. I speak as someone who lets her children take calculated risks that have horrified Mumsnet in the past.

Open sea with 2 little ones on a dingy and a kayak ??

I would seriously lose my shit at this plain fucking idiocy. Don't even get me started on the fact they're both inexperienced.

I live on the coast and a few times a year I'll be woken up by search and rescue helicopters hovering over my house. Often it doesn't end well. A few times we've seen bodies being brought back to shore........and these are usually experienced sailors who make a mistake. Not two dicks on a dingy

DH and FIL are incompetent idiots who clearly know FA about sailing. Have either of them undergone any training and have they achieved any RYA qualifications? I doubt it very much. What they did was flying in the face of all safety advice and they put your DCs in serious jeopardy. And those posters playing this down clearly know nothing about safety at sea.

Not over reacting at all. We live by the sea and sadly over the years adults choices have caused their children's deaths.

It's never acceptable to take such stupid risks when out with their kids. By all means bugger about unprepared and drown yourself but do not put your children in that position.

Your husband and his dad should be utterly ashamed of themselves not trying to save face.

They should behave like adults and admit they made dangerous decisions that put the children at risk.

The adults need to do some serious courses, they sound completely incompetent. The RNLI here spends so many of their rescues on this wannabe sailers putting their own lives at risk to help these idiots.

Holy fuck. YANBU!

I'd be livid. Like actual steam coming from my ears.

Incompetent to the extent that they don't recognise their own incompetence.

The first step is for FIL and DH to take some lessons to learn how to operate their own craft.

Then wait until DC can swim. Then follow all safety precautions carefully and go out with a very competent person in charge, maybe a instructor.

By dinghy with oars and motor I assume a small inflatable boat with tiny engine - the type people don't think of as needing qualifications because it's not a sailing boat or a 40hp + engine (and even then muppets take large motorboats on the sea without training). The RYA do powerboat courses.

For the kayaking you would need the canoing body courses (can't remember the name at the moment!).

Your twat of a husband & FIL embarrassed themselves by putting their own children & GC in danger by seemingly not having a fucking clue.

Is it possible to go home & leaving to strop with his dad on Father's Day rather than the whole family having to be drawn into his patheticness?

Haven’t read all the replies.

It sounds like they were foolish to take the kids out but I wouldn’t have called the area they were in ‘open water’. I sail, canoe etc and no one I know would call the area they were in ‘open water’. Not that helpful but it maybe your husband wasn’t properly listening to you and just heard the ‘no open water bit.

They were tipped out of the boat? Holy heck, no, YANBU, no way would my children be going out again with incompetents such as these.

Water activated life jackets are not appropriate in a kayak. You can not kayak without getting wet, but you can get children's life jackets with head support which are far more sensible for kayaking.
The thing not properly secured that let water in and caused the kayak to be overloaded was probably a storage hatch. Your FIL and DH were incompetent and should not have taken children out to sea!
To be honest they don't appear to be safe just going out by themselves, tell them to get some training.

They were all fine though
I think you're overreacting even though everyone else seems to agree with you. If your dh grew up going on boats with his dad then it's understandable he wants to share that with his children

Completely irresponsible.
Everything is wrong,

I practically lived on my dad's boat right from when I was six months old. He was a member of the local lifeboat crew too. I say YANBU!!

Your FIL and DH sound utterly incompetent both at managing sea craft and at understanding basic water safety.

The sea - even in an enclosed, sheltered harbour - is an unpredictable beast and must be treated with caution and respect.

YANBU!! That is gravely irresponsible and his reaction to you is verging on unforgivable

The mere fact these idiots thought buoyancy aids are enough shows how little they qualify to take anyone out on open water. I've spent most of my school hols by the ocean (still go most years). I was raised loving the sea but also with a very healthy dose of respect for it. Every year people drown. Getting caught in rip tides is a regular occurrence (happened even to me only two years ago). Weather conditions change in an instant. Do not let your DCs out with them ever again. Please.

Agree with the poster who said they really shouldve been wearing life jackets, not just buoyancy aids. A good life jacket will turn you face up if you were to eg knock your head .. buoyancy aids do not. I feel buoyancy aids are really only for situations in which you have a rescue/safety boat following you (which is obviously what happens with most, safe sailing clubs).

But the main thing that strikes me and apologies if someone has already mentioned it and I haven't seen it is hypothermia.

It's possible to get it in quite a short time in the water.

And it's dangerous.

The sea at this time if year hadn't really warmed up much, it's at its warmest around September. And warm is an ironic word for most sea water around the UK.

I think they're irresponsible.

*hasn't.

Water activated life jackets are not appropriate in a kayak.

I thought they were in s dinghy.
We're the in both.
I can fully understand why water activated life jackets wouldn't be suitable for a kayak.

• were they in both?

Yes morality
Hypothermia kills quickly in 10 or 12 degree water
www.respectthewater.com/survivors/

I'm going to be slated for sounding so sexist, but why is it always men I hear about doing things like this?

It's like the testosterone overrides their risk assessing/judgement and caution or something.

For once I hope your husband is reading this thread op. He could do with a dose of reality

I’d be pretty furious. You say it’s a two man kayak - so presumably it isn’t suitable for 2 children and two adults and that’s why it overturned? Not exactly rocket science even without the issue about the walled bit, just basic counting.

I'm remembering that horrific case where the two men took several kids out on kayaks, the weather changed and only one child, an older girl who swam a considerable distance to shore survived (alongside the two men of course).