To be deeply saddened by a teenager being euthanised **Upsetting content - warning added by MNHQ** ***MNHQ further note that the details of this story are disputed***

[TheHorseOnSeventhAvenue]

I am greatly aware of our rights and understand autonomy but as far as I can see this young Dutch girl, Noa, did not end her own life but was assisted.

My heart goes out to her and her family but this is my absolute reason why euthanasia should not be supported.

I think it was decided that forcing her would only increase her trauma, causing her mental health to be worse.

I can only assume, given the doctors know more detail about this, than the papers or us. There were good reasons for this. I hope to God there were anyway.

What is the problem? Seriously? Yeah, it's grand. Let's just let teenagers kill themselves and make no attempt to help or stop them. Teenagers are known for their impeccable decision making skills.

Precisely. I was jumping in front of cars and overdosing at one point. I'm not now 6 years later.

@Chocoholicsasylum Depression can be cured

This is not true. journals.sagepub.com/doi/pdf/10.1177/070674370705200108

It is also the case that depression is never ‘cured’ it is only ever in remission and frequently re-appears.

I have had Major Depressive Disorder for >30 years and although I have episodes of being well, my depression is always in the background.

I have a long history of trauma and co-morbidity and I understand this young woman’s decision. She was incredibly brave, honest and sincere.

It is the world’s loss and a dreadful indictment of how society deals with MH.

@Marinkazurie But nobody did anything here

Please read the thread.

@irisAtwood

I have?

Oh wow

It’s great that some people recover from such a trauma. But not everyone does.
Noa, and the rest of us arguing on here, will never find out if with the correct treatment she possibly could have survived and gone on to find peace and have some sort of life!
This thread has deeply disturbed, and upset, me as a mother of a daughter with MH issues.

How can a 17 year old be allowed to choose to be euthanised?
Her life had barely began. Devastated

To me legalised euthanasia is the same as abortion: suicide and abortions will happen regardless of whether or not they are provided by the state, it just enables people who will do it anyway to do it with the minimum amount of suffering.

I completely agree.

The think that I feel most when reading this is anger. Rage at the scum bag that ruined her life for a few moments of sexual gratification.

I know who should have been euthanised.

Marinkazurie - but she had been admitted to hospital on previous occasions and even put into a medically induced coma so that she could be force fed. Do you really think they hadn't been making concerted efforts over an extended period to stop her from starving herself to death or otherwise killing herself?

It is obviously a complex case. And evidently Noa had all sorts of treatments including Electro shock therapy.

But to say that the circumstances of abortion and euthanasia are the same is ridiculous. They are not the same thing.

I don't believe there is one person on this thread who would be in favour of euthanasia if it was your daughter who had been in this situation (god forbid)

MoominMantra - I disagree. I think as a parent I could eventually come to the point where I felt it was kinder to allow my child to have their wish and end their misery. Regrets and what ifs and guilt would be all mine to suffer - my child would not be the one feeling them.

I agree, Walkround. I have lost a child. I have a son who has autism, OCD, ADHD and PDA. Life is a misery with these, even with what treatment is available. If he decides that it's too much for him, then I'll support that, in fact, I'll go with him because it should always be a choice. Bodily autonomy needs to be that and detached from ideals of morality or it is oppression.

JessieTalamasca If he decides that it's too much for him, then I'll support that, in fact, I'll go with him because it should always be a choice
As horrendous as it is to imagine our children choosing euthanasia is, Your post was very moving, open minded, full of love.

@IrisAtwood

I totally get what you are saying, I do and have also had a genuine breakdown myself, where I wouldnt get out of bed apart from needing the toilet. My husband had to look after the kids and make sure I was ok. I have had major episodes where my family have been put through bad times with me and I'll hate myself forever for it. MH is very complex and I do agree it doesnt always 100% go away but it can be managed and some of it can be cured. Sometimes its the lifestyle that needs changed. Not all cases are the same, of course. It is a real disease and if people could "pull themselves out of it" obviously they dam well would. Take care.

It’s interesting to see two threads on this but with very different comments. It’s a really hard ethical, moral and emotive topic. I think I support euthanasia but ...

I also agree with those who have commented about lack of MH care.

It is been discussed on loose women now

I’ve just watched a young fried for a painful death that took 3 years. And my poor dad dies after a short but very undignified cancer battle. An uncle to Alzheimer’s. I wish we had this here.

There is something wrong with a society that turns the death of a teenager into an excuse for crocodile-mourning and pointless platitudes.

Why aren’t people with MH issues being given the support they need instead of being held up as the poster people for those who want appear oh so kind and caring on bloody social media.

A teenager took her own life and people knew it was happening and no one helped her.

And why arent we WOMEN campaigning for more to be done about rape. I am sorry, but it is going to take us making noise about it for it to ever change. Men will happily let it go on as it is

Arabella lots of people helped her. She spent years in treatment. She was sectioned and force fed, including being put in an induced coma. Read the full story.

Not everyone can recover. That is just how it is. At least she was allowed to choose how much misery and suffering was enough. Too many people on here would have denied her that to appease their own moral discomfort. Who are we to judge? We weren't there.

And why arent we WOMEN campaigning for more to be done about rape
I fully agree the #metoo was not enough, every day I read the paper there's a rape case.
Most recent the rapists was pulled off his victim by Garda, his solicitor said it was a moment of madness loneliness working away from his family in Romanian.
How do these solicitors and judges sleep at night.

'And why arent we WOMEN campaigning for more to be done about rape'

Women around the world have being trying to get more done about rape for time immemorial.

Two things I suppose

The structures and authorities were designed built by men and based in property crime, they do not lend themselves well to other crimes, and also as these are still male dominated structures authorities they are not that interested in things that predominantly affect women girls, or struggle even to see them as crimes eg rape in marriage legal into 1990s in uk

Other side is that there seems to be little appetite in society as a a while to confront improve and address, society is women as well as men. A lot of victim blaming and excuses. A lot of ideas about not wanting to 'ruin' men's lives over a mistake or moment of madness or whatever. I think in society deep down men are simply more important than women girls and it feels unconfable to call them to account for these crimes. The stats certainly back up the fact that current system does not work for sex offences.

Certainly the man or men who raped this girl are responsible but barely considered even on the thread, sleight of hand and they are somehow looked around. Nebulous, shadowy man /men can't vocud on them.

Currently rape is pretty much legal in practice. This girls story and outcome is a drop in the ocean.

The think that I feel most when reading this is anger. Rage at the scum bag that ruined her life for a few moments of sexual gratification.

I know who should have been euthanised.

Agreed. And it was multiple men.They caused her death.

They should be charged with murder. Everything this poor girl and her loved ones went through, and the undoubted pain of those staff caring for her, is all down to these people and they should answer for their actions.