just been accused of exploiting my niece

[AvocadoApple]

i have asked my 26 year old niece to look after my 1yr old dc (between 5pm and 6:30pm and weekends)in return for food, shelter, clothing, for herself and her 6yr old dc school needs
her mother (my aunt) has just rang me to accuse me of exploiting her DD

Ps: my aunt kicked her out about 3 years ago after she failed to find employment so she has been living different partners since then until the beginning of the year when i took her and her dc in

do i ask my niece to leave and find myself a nanny or should i tell my aunt to fuck off?

am i being a called a troll because i didnt word my thread properly and for talking about a problem most of you would not encounter?

I think a lot of people here are not getting the cultural angle here. (Apologies to OP here for my generalisation, but I hope it helps posters understand what's happening )

But in a lot of African countries, and among Africans in the UK, this type of arrangement is very common. Relatives living with other relatives and doing this sort of child care is something I come/came across often, in my old job here in the UK, and in my frequent visits to an African country. Also finishing high school in one's mid 20s is common. I'm helping someone do that currently

I agree it sounds slightly odd in a UK context, but its pretty close to normal in some countries.

I believe you're being suspected of trolling by changing details (whether deliberately or due to genuine mistakes) half way through your thread. Whichever way you cut it, 0645-0730 and 1700-1915 isn't the same as 1700-1830.

in africa this is a problem you would deal with regularly, i asked MN because i wanted a different opinion not an african solution to this but i guess this is a wrong platform.

I don't think you're being exploitative, it's hardly 'work' looking after a child you live with anyway.

You did a good thing taking her in and she should have offered to do this for you imo.

saraclara

I think a lot of people here are not getting the cultural angle here. (Apologies to OP here for my generalisation, but I hope it helps posters understand what's happening )

But in a lot of African countries, and among Africans in the UK, this type of arrangement is very common. Relatives living with other relatives and doing this sort of child care is something I come/came across often, in my old job here in the UK, and in my frequent visits to an African country. Also finishing high school in one's mid 20s is common. I'm helping someone do that currently

I agree it sounds slightly odd in a UK context, but its pretty close to normal in some countries.

thank you for phrasing this so clearly, i was struggling to explain it this way to those that were accusing me of being a troll

I don’t think you’re a troll, only one (or two?) people have. And that won’t be because they haven’t encountered your problem, it’s because you are inconsistent with the detail.

@saraclara I agree that there are cultural difference.

But OP posted in a predominantly UK site, without suggesting the situation was not in the UK.

• she lied about the number of daily hours each evening
• she downplayed the extent of the weekend working
• she missed out entirely that her niece had to work for her for a short time 5 mornings per week as well

I’m sure this type of situation exists. I’m sure in many cases it’s mutually beneficial. But there will also be cases where it is exploitation. The fact that the OP has lied about the extent of the niece’s responsibilities suggests to me that she could easily fall at the exploitative end of the scale!

I don’t think morning + afternoon is too much to ask, in return for living together AND schooling opportunity. That negates my concern that the split shifts stops niece progressing a proper job.

But the extra weekends is quite a lot.

And the biggest issue for me here is not letting a 26yo have the clothing allowance that she has earned in cash. Infantilising d controlling are too close to exploitation for me.

DanielRicciardosSmile

I believe you're being suspected of trolling by changing details (whether deliberately or due to genuine mistakes) half way through your thread. Whichever way you cut it, 0645-0730 and 1700-1915 isn't the same as 1700-1830.

i did not think time in between waiting on a pickup would count as work

am i being a called a troll because i didnt word my thread properly and for talking about a problem most of you would not encounter?

No it's because you described one person as both your sister and your auntie. Understand if you changed details but just tell us you did otherwise it doesn't make sense!

So you specifically post here because you want a non-African opinion, a different view.

Yet when that different view is given to you, you just say “but you haven’t encountered this”.

So do you want another viewpoint or not?

Bottom line: you are wrong to not give your niece the money and independence to buy her own clothes from the money she has earned. Whatever else is deemed culturally appropriate for you in terms of family care responsibilities, I truly believe that is wrong. No 26yo should have to ask another adult to get them clothes that they have earned the money for.

OP if I reword it, is this accurate?

“My niece is NC with her Mum, my sister. She has a six year old daughter and has made some bad decisions in the past. She dropped out of school with no qualifications and they were homeless.

I have said that they can live with me in return for board, losing and some childcare (I work shifts and have a one year old).

I don’t want to give my niece cash at this stage, because she has made some bad choices in the past. However I do want to keep my great-niece safe and meet her needs, so I am happy to pay for food and her school uniform etc. My niece does have access to some limited government benefits. Her mother doesn’t support her. She’s 26.

My niece is hoping to go back to college in September to get some qualifications.”

If this is the situation and you’d laid it out like this then I think you’d have got different responses.

For what it’s worth; I think it’s fine for now. Longer term your niece will need to get some sort of employment; but perhaps her qualifications take precedence for now; in which case I would say try it for 6-12 months and see how it works out.

And the biggest issue for me here is not letting a 26yo have the clothing allowance that she has earned in cash. Infantilising d controlling are too close to exploitation for me.

maybe i am treating her like a child for not giving her money to do as she pleases but most of my decisions are based on the welfare of her child

i did not think time in between waiting on a pickup would count as work

So what would you do otherwise? Leave your child alone to wait? Of course not. Your niece is there to watch, prevent accidents, give reassurance. To provide care. Therefore it’s work.

Board, FOOD and childcare

As for the poster saying it not being work, looking after a child you live with anyway...

Two full days every other weekend caring for a 1yo?!

I just dare you to go onto any of the many threads on MN about difficulties with fathers “helping” at weekends, and tell the poster that it’s not work anyway

Well, if you had a nanny she would need paying for that as well so yes, it's work. And realistically any time spent with a 1 year old is going to count as childcare as they're hard work at that age.

Tingface

OP if I reword it, is this accurate?

“My niece is NC with her Mum, my sister. She has a six year old daughter and has made some bad decisions in the past. She dropped out of school with no qualifications and they were homeless.

I have said that they can live with me in return for board, losing and some childcare (I work shifts and have a one year old).

I don’t want to give my niece cash at this stage, because she has made some bad choices in the past. However I do want to keep my great-niece safe and meet her needs, so I am happy to pay for food and her school uniform etc. My niece does have access to some limited government benefits. Her mother doesn’t support her. She’s 26.

My niece is hoping to go back to college in September to get some qualifications.”

If this is the situation and you’d laid it out like this then I think you’d have got different responses.

For what it’s worth; I think it’s fine for now. Longer term your niece will need to get some sort of employment; but perhaps her qualifications take precedence for now; in which case I would say try it for 6-12 months and see how it works out.

yes this is accurate (i dont know if mentioning her mother kicked her out makes a difference)

it's hardly 'work' looking after a child you live with anyway

Try telling a nanny that, and come back to tell us what their reply was (including hand gestures).

You don’t think that being in sole care of a 1yo for 30 minutes after you leave for work in the morning is work?

This is the problem. In your culture, or any other.

It’s not a big deal, sure. But it is work. That is where exploitation comes in. Where you make her do something, and then ignore it.

I really don’t think it’s a big deal for her to do it. But I do think it’s a big deal for you to not count it.

Why don't you also try giving her a small amount to begin with when she needs something, she won't learn to budget unless she's given a chance .

Ironmanisnotdead yes but au pairs don't usually bring along DC and have clothes provided for them either. There's so much here that we don't know the detail of though, it's hard to make a call.

OP, putting aside for a moment the 45 minutes in the morning and whether you consider it to be work or not; your niece still isn't only working until 1830 when you don't finish work until 1900 and (going by the time you leave in the morning) not home until 1915. That's not "waiting on a pickup", is it?

Just adding to the Auntie / Sister thing, I am wondering if this is a cultural reference? Is your sister much older than you? In African culture an elder is often referred to as Auntie or Uncle as a sign of respect, my partner calls his BIL ‘Uncle’ as there is a big age gap and he has been told to do this from a young age. So if this is the case in this situation I can understand people in the UK getting confused between the Aunt / Sister references.

In reference to your question, I think you will find varying responses dependent on people’s cultures.

Surely if her mother is your aunt then she's your cousin not your niece?

It's hard to tell whether you're exploiting her because it's not clear how many hours she's working at the weekend or the kind of food and clothes you buy for her,but you definitely seem to be controlling her. She is a fully grown woman,how will she ever learn to budget if you don't pay her cash so that she can buy the necessities for herself? I would be worried with the set up if she were my daughter tbh.