I know IANBU. At what age would you allow your DD to wear a strapless top?

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Like this one. DD is 11 and thinks IABU.

So girls shouldn’t have the freedom of wearing what they want?

Of course they SHOULD. But the unfortunate truth is that they DON'T have the freedom of wearing whatever they want without facing certain behaviour from men. That's sad but it is true.

Girls do NOT get leered at/assaulted/raped because they’re wearing skimpy’ clothes

Well... girls DO sometimes get leered at because they’re wearing 'skimpy’ clothes. Of course sometimes they get leered at no matter what they're wearing, but that doesn't mean that wearing revealing clothing makes no difference.

I would let my daughter wear it at any age I think. I don't see any major problem with it. Obviously if she was hiking in a thunderstorm I'd recommend something more appropriate, but I think she'd figure that out for herself anyway.

Well... girls DO sometimes get leered at because they’re wearing 'skimpy’ clothes. Of course sometimes they get leered at no matter what they're wearing, but that doesn't mean that wearing revealing clothing makes no difference.

What the fuck?

You know people who 'lear' at 11 year old girls are PAEDOPHILES?

11 year old children should not ever have to take responsibility for what they wear because of sick bastard men.

Fuck that. Fuck fuck fuck that.

Honestly what a lot of shite.

But the unfortunate truth is that they DON'T have the freedom of wearing whatever they want without facing certain behaviour from men

It's the men's behaviour that needs to change. Not the children's.

No

I don't give into this idea. it's a comma away from victim blamimg.

Well... girls DO sometimes get leered at because they’re wearing 'skimpy’ clothes.

So we should speak to our sons about respect and what is appropriate.

It's the men's behaviour that needs to change. Not the children's

Agreed.

So we should speak to our sons about respect and what is appropriate

Agreed with that too.

But which part means I shouldn't worry about men leering at my preteen daughter?

I’m not sexualizing an 11 year old. They’re perfectly capable of doing that themselves. God, my 4th year of Junior school was a hotbed of kissing in the long grass and playing boyfriends and girlfriends. Fast forward x amount of years and I know of 12 year olds who have been asked by their peers if they share nudes. 11/12 year olds can be dickheads!

It’s hard enough being a teenager nowadays. I’ll do everything I can to protect my 11 yo (imaginary one as all mine are teenagers) and that means not wearing clothes designed for older kids. My 11 year old son can’t wear one either.

They can’t have Tiktok either but that’s a whole other story.

I’m not sexualizing an 11 year old. They’re perfectly capable of doing that themselves.

FUCK OFF.

But which part means I shouldn't worry about men leering at my preteen daughter

Then take their disgusting behaviour up with them instead of teaching your daughter to modify her behaviour to appease perverts!

As an aside, vetoing anything only makes it more attractive OP.

And bollocks to teaching girls to change their behaviour to avoid dickheads. Teach them to be who they are and tell perverts to fuck off!

Then take their disgusting behaviour up with them instead of teaching your daughter to modify her behaviour to appease perverts!

I can't really take things up with all the men out there.

I will not risk subjecting my 11-year-old daughter to frightening and threatening behaviour to make a point. I understand entirely what you're saying, but protecting my daughter comes before making a stand, for me.

Victim blaming much? So girls shouldn’t have the freedom of wearing what they want? Girls do NOT get leered at/assaulted/raped because they’re wearing ‘skimpy’ clothes!!!

You've entirely misrepresented my post, but I expect you do that as a matter of course.

You specifically said ‘what happens when girls wear skimpy clothes’. What exactly does happen then?

This is fine at any age! I’d probably be a bit if a DD had huge breasts as it would draw attention to them but a 5 year old could wear that top and I would think nothing of it.

NunoGoncalves teaching your child to kowtow to men because her mother won't speak up isn't protecting her.

Nice little snide dig there though eh?

Woman up.

I understand entirely what you're saying, but protecting my daughter comes before making a stand, for me.

You are not protecting her. You are teaching her to change herself according to what men may be thinking.

Not exactly a good tool for her future, is it?

Nice little snide dig there though eh?

I wasn't snide in any way! But since you seem incapable for having a calm conversation I won't be responding to your other point or anything else you post.

Culturally there are plenty of places where bare shoulders are not usually deemed acceptable

Not here. Answer the question OP. Why do YOU think this too is inappropriate?

You implied that anything other than your way wasn't protecting your child.

Snide.

Also, with a DD and 2 DSDs I will not be telling them to modify their behaviour or their clothing to appease men. I have taught them to be who they are and to talk back when inappropriate comments are made.

You know, given them the tools they need to cope with real life as an adult?

Because I spent my childhood being conditioned to appease men and it will not be happening to my daughters. My sons aren't being raised to feel superior to girls/women either.

You are not protecting her. You are teaching her to change herself according to what men may be thinking

I believe that letting her walk around in revealing clothing would potentially subject her to threatening and scary behaviour from men. So yes, I am protecting her. I could tell her "don't change! if an adult man honks his horn at you or leers at you in the street, just tell him to fuck off" but she's 11. I don't think she's ready to be off standing up to strange adult males yet.

Not exactly a good tool for her future, is it?

I do and will continue to teach her about the inequalities and injustices of this world, I will continue to make sure she knows how unfair society can be and that as she grows up she can try to change that if she wants to. But I will also continue to teach her that sometimes personal safety comes above making a stand. I'm ok with that.

@AlaskanOilBaron you said: ‘what happens when girls wear skimpy clothes’. What exactly did you mean then if you didn’t mean that girls need to know what happens to them when they ‘wear skimpy clothes’.

A reality check for a lot of the ignorant PPs that think skimpy clothing gets women raped. IT’S NOT TRUE. A man that rapes a women will rape them regardless. They already have that mentality, they will rape regardless of whether a women is completely covered or wearing a bikini. Same with men that give unwanted attention. They do it regardless. The idea that clothing has any bearing on what despicable people do, is all a construct to shift the blame and is basically, all in your head.

Dd2 (9) chose a top like that today for holidays. I have no problem with it at all. She's 9 FFS. If someone thinks it's sexualising her then imo they have the problem not her.

A reality check for a lot of the ignorant PPs that think skimpy clothing gets women raped

I just skim-checked and I don't think a single person has said that.

Answer the question OP. Why do YOU think this too is inappropriate?

I thought I had. It's not an appropriate piece of clothing for a child who still spends a large part of her free time hopscotching, messing around on bikes, trampolining etc.

I would also veto a full face of make up and high heels for the same reason.

I would be fine with strapless, less happy about strapless and cropped (as 2nd image)

You yourself equate "personal safety" with clothing choices, so you have said exactly that.

Can I suggest a look at the "this is what I was wearing when I was raped" photo exhibition that was shown recently?

I think it would be an eye opener.

Me? I was in bed, in my pyjamas and a nursing bra.

But hey, clothing choice = personal safety and teaching girls to defer to men's actions is keeping them safe eh?