PILs

[NCwhatevs]

NC for this

DH’s brother had an affair & left DSIL for his mistress a while back, they are now divorcing. BIL is now shacked up with his mistress. We do not have good relationship with him and he is openly hostile via messages to DH who has kindly tried to keep in touch generally without being positive about his choices, as frankly they have been poor. We are not at this point at all interested in meeting with him and especially not with the OW and therefore certainly didn’t envision DD to do so either.

We have not discussed with our DD why we don’t see her uncle these days because she is young enough (7) to not talk about it specifically.

Today however, after having DD overnight during Easter break (at their request) on the way home, PIL (who have welcomed the mistress already) chose to take DD to BIL’s mistress’s home where she saw BIL for the first time in a long time and met the mistress properly for the very first time.

This was done without us being consulted or present and without context for her as she didn’t know about her uncle and a new partner.

We found out as soon as dd was home as DD spilled all the beans about meeting the OW.

She knows her auntie and uncle are living apart but not any reason why.

We had a massive argument with PILs tonight as we felt they overstepped massively by taking her there and acted completely inappropriately without consulting us as we would definitely have not done that ourselves and are incredibly shocked they chose to do this. It was not their call to make.

They were incredibly hurt by us calling them out on this & we have had a massive argument with them this evening. They have been told from both of us- this is unacceptable - DH has said that he will explain the situation with BIL and the mistress to DD tomorrow in a context she can understand but they have forced us into having to have this conversation with her and we are both so angry.

MiL was unfortunately mean about DSIL tonight who has done nothing and was in no way the cause of the split, and then tried to deflect all their actions today on supporting their other son and instead of taking any culpability in making the introduction to the mistress, told me what a terrible DIL I’ve been to her and how she’s “always wanted a closer relationship” and how hurt she is I never invite her to do things.

Anyway this is a tangent. She was deflecting and trying to place blame elsewhere from herself. I think they knew they messed up.

AIBU - surely not? I don’t feel like I’m overreacting. They should not have taken it into their own hands and held a meeting with her uncle and an introduction to their uncle’s mistress without our knowledge. The other stuff I can ignore from MIL as it was a baseless attack.

She’s sent me a conciliatory text earlier. I haven’t responded as of yet.

However I worded it, they knew for sure we aren’t in contact right now and haven’t been for some time, other than DH contacting him via text and being attacked. There was really no ambiguity for them on that point.

You are a very judgmental person, what happened in Bil marriage is his business, your general tone seems like something from 1950s. You don't ostracise someone because their marriage ended; stop saying mistress and he's married; his marriage is now a piece of paper; should nobody have a new relationship until they have divorce paper in hand?
Your DD needs little explanation, Uncle has new gf as him and Auntie don't want to live together anymore.
I hope your marriage never ends, unless you're perfect stop pushing your ridiculous opinions onto everyone else or you'll end up NC with the whole family.

However I worded it, they knew for sure we aren’t in contact right now and haven’t been for some time, other than DH contacting him via text and being attacked. There was really no ambiguity for them on that point.
But you never gave instructions that your child wasn't to meet BIL and his new partner. So you have no right to sound off at them.

This is actually really upsetting to read just how judgemental the OP and most of the posters are who are in agreement.

Makes me wonder about all the things people must have been thinking behind my back without actually knowing the whole story

‘Their marriage ended’ is such a neutral term. How about he cheated on his wife, who the op regarded as family? My sils are family, I couldn’t suddenly recategorise them to nothing to do with me because my brother or dhs brother was an asshole. They aren’t interchangeable cardboard cutouts labelled ‘bils woman’.

I agree that you are over-invested in your bil’s life choices. You display this by taking a stance over his new partner and imposing dramatic rules regarding your daughter’s contact with her...while also expecting your in laws to obey them.
No one cares what you think about bil’s conduct. You’re being self important and obstructive without justification.
Your daughter does not require an explanation beyond a nominal one.

It reads to me like the PIL were trying to force your hand a bit. Presumably they can visit BIL and partner anytime - odd that they chose to do it with granddaughter in tow knowing that you'd hit the roof.

MIL has sent a conciliatory text. What do you want to happen now?

@timeisnotaline no-one has suggested that the OP's SIL should now be nothing to her. There's no reason at all why they should not be friends. But when you have children, they are part of a wider family, and it's important that they are happy, comfortable and loved within it.

The child's uncle and his new partner are part of that family. OP doesn't have to be friends with either, but going NC and falling out with her PIL isn't helpful to the child, who is witnessing all this ill feeling. There will and should be extended family get togethers in this child's life. Time to stop letting judgement get in the way and cope with what's happened

Pack it in with mistress shit. She’s the OW.

Are you the self-appointed syntax police?

YABU! Your DD has nothing to do with any of this, doesn't need an explanation further than he has got a new girlfriend. Your blowing it out of proportion massively

I don't think YABU OP. The BILs actions aren't to my liking but that is besides the point.

You trusted your child with PIL and they abused that trust by sneakily taking your DD to visit people they know you currently have issues with. That is the problem. Had it been otherwise they would have told you beforehand or told you themselves as they were doing it or when you picked up your DD.

You should leave your DH to sort out his family and reduce your contact with PIL.

You trusted your child with PIL and they abused that trust by sneakily taking your DD to visit people they know you currently have issues with. That is the problem. Had it been otherwise they would have told you beforehand or told you themselves as they were doing it or when you picked up your DD.

That’s it. This is what we are upset with.

I only gave the context of the affair and OW for an insight as to why we are unhappy with these people right now. Many have latched onto the validity of our feelings instead of the central issue we have which is with overstepping boundaries.

So did you actively tell them before this, that they were NOT to let your DD see BIL or his new partner? Clearly and in those words? Or did you leave it to them to assume that?

I can see why you're pissed off, but your reaction is extreme imo. They didn't hurt her, or put her in harms way.

I would be absolutely furious. It isn’t your PILS place to ignore your wishes in these circumstances.
The OW is a bit of a red herring I think. Ultimately it’s about the fact your PILS decided they knew better than you and circumvented you in order for your child to see their other son ignoring the strained relationship.

And as for the reconciliatory text - so apologies after they got what they wanted....mmmmm they would be very native to have thought you won’t have found it.....so went down the route of asking for forgiveness rather than permission. Unacceptable when it involves your child.

Your daughter spent some time in a house with her grandparents and her uncle and a lady. That's it. Nobody died.

@saraclara DH has said to PiLs in the recent past that we would all be happy to see them in the future (with us there too) but not right now as things stand. So yes they knew, explicitly, that this was against our wishes.

I think you're blowing this up into something it doesn't need to be. It doesn't sound like, personal relationships aside, your BIL and his girlfriend have done anything that would give you major concern for your DD's welfare when with them, especially in the presence of her GPs. You do sound quite controlling OP, but I can't see any reason here why you've gone off the deep end.

If you weren't happy with what PILs chose to do, this could've been addressed in a much more reasonable way than causing a massive argument. Not to mention that MIL has already sent a conciliatory text which you've dealt with by ignoring it. They could perhaps have apologised for doing something they knew you wouldn't like (even though they saw you as unreasonable) but you need to apologise for causing a row. I think you should reply and draw a line under this ASAP. You don't need to make this into a bigger drama than it already has been.

@saraclara DH has said to PiLs in the recent past that we would all be happy to see them in the future (with us there too) but not right now as things stand. So yes they knew, explicitly, that this was against our wishes.

Yep. You're still prevaricating here. You said you would all be happy to see them at some point but not now. That really is not the same as saying 'we don't want DD to see them so please ensure that she doesn't'.
Given that, you were possibly within your rights to say that you were disappointed that they didn't recognise that you wouldn't have wanted them to take her there, but not within your rights to cause a big row. They didn't defy instructions by any means.

I see both sides to this.

I don't think you're being unreasonable.

But I also think you were perhaps naive as to your expectations around PIL. He's their son. They will of course prioritise him.

In terms of your DD, all you have to say is BIL and SIL are no longer together. BIL is now with Mavis.

DD doesn't need to know that BIL is a cheating arsehole, or that Mavis is the OW.

You're being unreasonable to still call her the mistress. Why are you taking sides?! It's none of your business to judge how adults conduct themselves.

Some of the responses on here are astonishing. Was it a full moon or something last night?

Op, it would be a cold day in hell before I let the ILs babysit again. If you can’t trust them not to respect your wishes on this, what else can you not trust them with?

I think they should not have taken her there without your permission, knowing how you felt about the situation.
If he wanted to see his niece he should have gone to theirs.
I’d not let them watch her for a while as if they are going against your wishes on this then who knows what else they are doing.
However that said, I can see where they were coming from too as he is their son and a part of your and your daughters family and his partner if she is long term is too.
I do believe they should have asked first though

YANBU. I don't understand how anyone can think it's acceptable for your PIL to do something that they explicitly knew was against your wishes. I would be furious if I was in your situation.

I also don't understand why some people on mumsnet pick out certain pieces of information from posts and just focus on those as opposed to replying to what had actually been asked:

AIBU - surely not? I don’t feel like I’m overreacting. They should not have taken it into their own hands and held a meeting with her uncle and an introduction to their uncle’s mistress without our knowledge. The other stuff I can ignore from MIL as it was a baseless attack.

You know, I think it was actually a full moon last night!! 😂