AIBU to think his ex-wife-son are taking us for too much

[Shesonlyworth30]

Long time lurker, first time poster. It’s a long one so apologies in advance.

Been with my DF for almost 7 years, have a 3 (almost 4) yr old and getting married in the summer.

DF was married before (to C - she was also married before and had 2 other sons (both older) and has one son with DF (16 this year) who lives with C in Scotland. DF has never not paid for his son, he even chose to have it deducted straight from wages when CSA were in charge. He didn’t trust C and wanted there to be a proper paper trail if ever she decided to say she never received anything. Since we have been together the payments have been just shy of £200. I have never had a problem with him paying for his son.

C has never let DF speak to son or see him since he was 3. She tried to kill herself a few times (once when pregnant and once when son was born) so DF took parental responsibility for her 2 older sons and their own while she was sectioned. They split up when son was 3 and she told a court it would be detrimental to her mental health to allow DF custody and access. Court agreed. (DF living in north of England at this point and C in Scotland)

Fast forward to last year. CMS took over from CSA and they re-assesses him and told him his payments would need to be £500 a month. We argued that this was a massive increase. They said it was because of what he earned. However they were taking overtime into account which we said was wrong. His overtime was not guaranteed and he did that to pay for our wedding/holidays etc. They said they were right. He went to court and while the judge was sympathetic said there was nothing they could do. He even tried showing them that if he had a basic month, with no overtime, paid the mortgage (a not unreasonable £660) gas, elec etc he physically would not have enough to pay the CMS. They didn’t care. They don’t take household expenses into account. He then said he had another child to support (ours) they said they had allowed £30 pcm for her. £30 bloody quid. That’s not even a day in nursery.

Because C doesn’t want him to know where she is she wants everything doing through the CMS so he has to pay their admin charge (extra £83 pm) and now we are in a vicious cycle. He worked more OT last year to pay her and still have money for our savings but because he earned more he now has to pay more this year £634 pcm!!!!

I’m fed up with it. My daughter doesn’t have £634 a month spent on her from her dad. I expected his payments to go up but AIBU to think this is grossly unfair and there is a fundamental flaw in this thinking. Surely if CMS believe 2 children should cost £664 then that money should be split between the 2?

His son can leave school at any time now but we know she won’t tell us so this could be ongoing for another 4 years because there isn’t a doubt in my mind she’ll make son stay at school if she’s getting £550 odd quid a month. Oh and she’s back with her first husband!! 🤬🤬

It is much easier to say the ex is awful than explain to people he is a shit parent. 13 years no contact... good grief.

&500+ a month sounds like the amount he does need to pay if he is in Avery good income or has been underpaying/ missing payment for years.

Are you sure that money he says he is being asked to pay in maintenance is not being used by him on something else?

I understand where you're coming from @Shesonlyworth30
-Yes it's annoying to pay that sort of money when -OT is not guaranteed
Yes it's annoying to pay it to someone who seemingly is on benefits and has state support
-I believe your Fiancé has tried to see his son but it sounds like with an obstructive ex he's given up far too easily

In a system like CSA some good people will loose out in order to get the real deadbeats to pay up. If sounds like this is you and your DP. The only thing you can do is either earn less or accept it's an additional cost you're going to have to bear until your son turns 18.

I'm also sorry that all the bitter ex wives have come out to demonise your DP

£600 a month sounds high to me. Ppl are talking about the mortgage/rent and heating costs etc.. Surely she'd have to pay for a roof over her head without DS being there.

If hypothetically you split up with him... i expect the payments would reduce a fair bit.

I'm more perplexed that he was deemed good enough and stable to care for her 2 kids and his own.

Then the courts agree that her mental health would suffer if he had visitation.

Custody is about the right of the child to have a relationship with both parents. It doesn't make sense to me.

He has a child that he has no relationship with and wouldn't recognise if he walked passed in the street. Thats incredibly sad.

I’ve just been on the child maintenance calculator. To get it anywhere near £600+ a month using the details you gave - no contact and 1 child plus 1 child living with him the earnings have to be over £80k a year. Can’t really see if his basic is 32k that he is earning 50k in over time!!!!
So either he is using some of the money for something else or he has more than 1 child he is paying maintenance for and he is lying

Also I really can’t see a court giving no contact at all to the father and giving full custody to the mother who has a history of mental health problems to the extent that she was sectioned. I feel he is also lying about this also.

@lboogy
Just wanted to point out I am not an ex wife bitter or otherwise.
Like other PP’s, tried to point out to OP that she only has her DP’s word for all of this “truth” even though it has been pointed out that what he has said is not how these things actually happen. Amazed you would advocate that benefits should be paid by everyone to let absent fathers “off the hook”. One true thing you said the system should be designed to get the real deadbeats to pay up, and in this case, belatedly it now seems to be achieving just that.

Also you daughter will be having at least £600 a month spent on her - food, electric, clothes, activities, toiletries, medicines, birthday parties, Christmas presents, school uniform, shoes, proportion of mortgage to own a house with a bedroom for her, etc

Why hasn't he seen his son, why wasn't him at the wedding, there isn't a court in the land that would stop a fathers contact with his son, because it caused the DM MH issues.
My BIL pays maintenance, he hasn't seen his son in 15 years, he also states the mother is mad, his reason for staying away. complete bullshit, reality is he can't be bothered. I don't know how he sleeps at night
Is it the same for your DP.

Omg your being very naive OP. CMS only deduct straight from Earnings if the Parent did not pay Maintenance on time, or other constant excuses. He will also have to pay the 20% fee on top, so the £83 fee means HMRC have informed CMS off his salary, so he is definitely earning more than you say.

As for his Ex, if a Court has deemed him a risk to his Ex Mental Health, that should ring Alarm Bells.

As far as his paying too much, thats not your concern, his Salary is as given by HMRC, his son is none of your concern. Stop being so gullible and read how CMS works!

He could stop doing overtime and get the CMS to reassess it immediately (which can be done if his income drops 25% or more, you don't have to wait for the annual review in that case).

Or stop doing overtime just before the annual review, if it wouldn't make as much difference as 25%.

That way he isn't trapped in the cycle of working more just to make the payments.

The rest of your post contents sound spiteful and misinformed.

@Nearlythere1 it makes no difference when he leaves school, the DF still had to pay for his son regardless.

It's like OP thinks child maintenance is for buying toys and candy, while the resident parent pays for all the necessities of life.

@Nearlythere1 i guarantee the £600 will include hefty arrears which led to the Deduction of Earnings being attached in the first place. I think the OP has been well and truly brainwashed here, the fact that The Court agreed with his Ex on him being a detriment to her MH suggests he is extremely abusive, all of which has been proven in Court.

What? So when parents still living together have another child (or possibly several) they are 'stealing' from their first born? As surely they would have less to spend on them?

And under that train of thought the resident parent shouldn't go on to have another child either I assume. Especially if the new partner had a child... that would be 2 children being robbed.

It seems like a lot of ladies on here have been fortunate enough not to have to deal with or witness an ex who has successfully alienated a child/children from a lingering and dedicated father. You would astounded at the depth of deception and manipulation that can be used.

I am not saying this is the case here as he obviously gave up 13 years ago and a dedicated father NEVER gives up...but to see so many people berating someone for having an opinion on someone she doesn't know.... to then generalise about every man who doesn't see his child is astounding and disrespectful to the thousands of men and children who go through the trauma of this very thing happening.

lingering should read loving

OP your talking shit, you claimed he does not know where she is, his family have backed his version up but do not where she is, and have not seen her in 13 years, yet here you are being a complete cow calling her out because he has told you she is on disability benefits, gets her rent, council tax paid etc etc etc. But how the hell would you know? How would he know, he is as full as shit as you are.

Just sit and have a look at what you put. You could very well find yourself in the same position as his Ex, having to get a Court Order to protect herself and DC, move away just to get away from him. This could be you OP.
Time to seriously read up before you marry this abusive lying twat.

your DF has a duty to provide for his child. He has done a great job financially and his child is almost grown up. I’d ask for a single issue order to ensure he is informed when his dc leaves school - probably in 2 years - and leave it at that.

God knows what she’s actually told her son about him

She could simply start with the truth. Damaging enough don't you think?

Well said @Graphista you are spot on. The OP has been vile towards a disabled mother.

I think the best thing you can do is get this referred back to court.

OP I'm not going to be unkind.

It appears you have been manipulated, there are too many things that are simply heresy - if not everything. I can imagine that if you have been drip fed poison about someone for years you will start to think in the same way. I understand why you would be worried about your financial situation but have looked at it the wrong way. As others have said, CM is calculated the same for everyone. Maybe you should think about a few things.

1. Have you ever seem any documentation re. The court case? I would imagine any parent who unjustly had their child removed from their lives would keep that, no matter how long ago it was. Perhaps the mother has kept it and if so it will eventually come to light.

1. Have you seen any letters from the CSA? There will be a breakdown of why the patients are what they are. £600 seems very high for the salary you've given, there will be a reason for it.

1. At the appeal re. CM, did you attend? You wouldn't be allowed into the hearing itself but could go along to the court, he what his lawyer had to say at the time.

1. You mention her family. Why do they not know their name if the mum keeps in torch with her? How can they know financial details but not their surname or where they live? I find it difficult to believe her mother would gossip about her to her sister (or was it brother sorry?) about being on benefits if they do not get on... but not tell them her name. And on that note, if she has never been alone then every partner she's been with would also have to be unemployed for her to get her rent etc paid.

Maybe just have a think about these things. We all want to naturally believe our partners but I doubt there is one person on this forum who hasn't met a good liar and not realised until time passed.

He would have got contact, even supervised. If it was down to her mental health they must have believed he was linked to it.

I hope you manage to sort everything out, just try not to become bitter over a child and a situation you have no physical evidence of.

Read through my typos...I really should be asleep!

This is terrible. Your dh needs to prioritise reconnecting with the ds. I can't believe he just let 13 years slip
by. I think this should be the first priority.

If the payments are truely unaffordable and I can understand if they are as it is a lot of money, you need to completely revisit your working situation. Can he change jobs and get one with more stable income, even if it is less overall.

Dh could pick up more of the childcare responsibilities with your dd to free you up to take on a second job. You need to maximise your own income for the family. Are you able to find another job, a 9k pay drop to fit around your dc should be something your dh should do, not you!

I think it's better for the son if he continues to have no contact, since his dad clearly doesn't give a shit about him and the OP resents his existence.

But maybe one day far in the future the half-siblings will find out about each other and be able to commiserate about their rubbish excuse for a father. He'll probably be on his third 'family' by then.

Shesonly, try and find a local forum like DIDS (dads in distress in Australia) but for where you live. They usually have a 2nd family section to those types of forums and you can post up the exact financial details and someone on there will be able to tell you if the assessment is correct or not without slagging you or your life apart.

Good luck!

Always give the child - estranged parent relationship a chance once the child reaches adulthood.

Life is complicated and people are flawed. But life is short so at least give it one more chance once the child is grown and independent from the resident parent.