AIBU to ask why my mother's venom still slips through the cracks?

[tympanic]

My mother just popped in to visit, and as usual it wasn't long before she started making PA comments about my parenting choices, work progression, cleanliness of my house, my appearance, imaginary issues with my son... whatever tickled her fancy.

She has form for being like this, and my siblings and I try to joke about it but her endlessly cold, critical negativity is so damaging. I'm the only daughter and we all agree I cop the brunt of it.

I really only started to realise how damaging it is when I celebrated my first Mother's Day and considered what it all meant. I imagined what sort of mother I wanted to be for my son to make sure he lives as happy a life as I am capable of providing. To help him through the low points and the pride I feel with he achieves his highs. And then I thought about my own mother who I have to avoid when bad or good things happen to me and got deeply, deeply sad.

I'm pretty good at letting it roll off in general, but every so often she finds a wee crack to pour the venom in. She did this today with a targeted comment about how some women find juggling high-profile work, multiple kids, maintaining a house so easily, whereas others (ie me) clearly don't, even when they have "only one child".

She hit a nerve, as she knew she would. I don't understand why after knowing this woman for as long as I have she can still get to me. I understand she's a miserable old boot and will die a miserable old boot, but I wish I could get to a point where it didn't affect me anymore.

Thoughts? Stories? Witty retorts to shut her down with?

I think you'll find that more and more unpleasant memories surface for you: I thought my DParents were pretty ok until I had my first DC and suddenly all this awful stuff started coming back to me. My DM is very PA too: she makes comments about the cleanliness of my house, the behaviour of my DC, my weight, my DSis's weight … she said something to me once and I said 'did you mean that to sound so bitchy?' and she looked at me as though I'd slapped her. I still get very angry about a lot of the stuff I now remember: I have tried to talk to DPs about it but they don't want to know: DF just smiles and walks away, and DM gets all martyr-ish: 'the trouble is, Piffle, that NOTHING we do is good enough for you'. The only way I can handle it is by seeing less of them. They are not going to change and they are never going to think that they've done anything wrong - it was all done for my own good, apparently. You know better than me how your DM will react to you if you give back as good as you get: will she fold, get nastier, storm off, try and stop? When my DM has a little dig I usually just act like I'm busy and not paying attention: she said something about my table being a mess the other day - I just pretended I was looking for something (anything) picked it up, and walked into the other room. I've also tried not looking at her whilst she's talking - keeping myself busy doing stuff, wait til she finishes talking, then look at her blankly and sort of nod or give a little smile, so she thinks I'm not paying attention. Not the greatest tactic, I know, but since confronting didn't work, this is my chosen action. Quite sad that this is our relationship, really. Good luck OP.

It’s hard to give up on the ideal of a loving, supportive relationship with your mother. Becoming a parent yourself makes it incredibly obvious how far from normal things are, I’ve found. I thought the book Toxic Parents (which is much recommended on MN) quite helpful. Plus 6 months of therapy. It’s hard OP, I get it

I could've written this Op word for word, so I completely get it. I've no words of advice I'm afraid, as I am very much still in the thick of the FOG with my own mother.
I am very low-contact with her, which is fairly easy as she lives 350 miles away. But, there's still the phone calls and, when I do see her, it's generally for three (long) days at a stretch. It's awful.

What would she do if you said;

" You know that saying 'if you can't say something nice, say nothing ..."?

Or "do you ever have anything positive to say, ever?"

Or how would she react if you copied her behaviour and criticised her regularly?

A lot of bad memories started to come back for me when I had my DD because I now have a better understanding of parenting. If you can go no contact or even just minimum contact then it really helps. I’ve been NC with mine for 4 months now and I’ve progressed so much in my life and my wellbeing

She hit a nerve, as she knew she would. I don't understand why after knowing this woman for as long as I have she can still get to me

She knows which buttons to press, because (being your mother) she installed them!

She won't change, but you need to develop deflection strategies.

See less of her if you can or develop a light laugh that you can use to in response to her strange comments. That'll throw her off balance!

I'd pick on anything I could about her appearance,her house, her behaviour, your memories of her parenting etc etc and see how she likes it. Will she cut you off? Sounds like that wouldn't be an entirely bad thing.

You get to get out of the reacting, accepting, quiet, defensive victim role. Don't take it, bite back. You're no longer s child, she no longer had any power over you, except what you choose to give her.

• need to get out

My mother can be like this too. I feel like she's always wanting to improve me, if that makes sense? Like me and my home are never good enough. I always need something fixed or updated, my hair cut, a new coat/shoes or whatever. She always finds something to criticise. When she comes over, she'll make the same list of home improvements I need done etc, stuff she knows I'm aware needs done, but that I don't have the money to do, yet still she feels the need to point out these flaws, every single time. She told me about 2 years ago, when I had just gotten out of a physically and emotionally abusive relationship, and was trying very hard to build myself/my esteem back up again, that she was disappointed in how I've turned out/the woman I am. That was a new low. Generally her hearts in the right place, bit the constant criticism and always feeing judged, is hard work.

I don't live at home any more, but my sister does, and they're all so cheeky/hard on each other to the point of being nasty. But they would say they're all normal and I'm just a snowflake. But it's not normal? Far from??

Anyway I find not responding at all or a simple "do you think so?" in a dismissive, humourous tone works well with these people.

"Mum - I'm worried that your life must be a bit boring or empty these days? You seem to have far too much time on your hands. It's often the case for women at your time of life. I know you can't really want to be hanging around my house all the time, finding things to nitpick about. Have you thought about taking an evening class or meeting new friends?"

My mother's brilliant at this. I swear she finds it physically impossible to give a genuine heartfelt simple compliment. They always sound insincere, although I'm beginning to think she's autistic to some degree and is acting out what giving compliments 'looks like'. It's odd and hard to describe. On the rare occasion I get one she has to follow it up with a barb. She'll say "DS1 is so polite isn't he... It won't last." Or "DS1 is so.polite isn't he?... Unlike DS2".

Or if she gives me a compliment she has to then find some spurious reason to compliment my two sisters as well, in the same breath lest I get notions of my own importance. If I've got a promotion she'll find a way to mention their new kitchen.

So sympathy from me!

Sympathy from here too. Mine is incapable of being supportive - she just lacks empathy. It gets to me so much but I'm trying to remember not to mention anything that she could be negative about. It does reduce topics of conversation a bit on the phone but then she can just waffle on about shit that I don't give a toss about while I look at Mumsnet! My dad is even more useless.
People suck.

My mother once commented on my Halloween decorations “Are they decorations? It’s hard to tell through the general grime in here’. I was a young, single, working mother of two. I was trying my best. It was never good enough for her. I was never good enough for her.

Sympathy here as well. I am about to visit my parents on Weds/Thurs/Fri of this week, and I am bracing for the endless stories she will tell about what a horrible child I was. DH sits there with a raised eyebrow, having seen all the counselling I've had to go through to deal with the relentless lack of self-worth that resulted.

What would happen if you reacted out loud: "Ouch, Mum, that feels really hurtful and personal!" It can be quite liberating just to have it said.

It does reduce topics of conversation a bit on the phone but then she can just waffle on about shit that I don't give a toss about while I look at Mumsnet!

Ditto here.

My mother was also aecerbic and after yrs of her comments and actions I realised 'the only way to win was not be I it'
Princessmaryabolkonskaya: did it occur to you that SHE wasn't good enough? That was why she was criticised you, to make herself feel better.
When mine passed away, I felt nothing but relief.

I could have written your post word for word. Also the only daughter of four and I cop the brunt of it all. Thing is, she moans about her own mum being hard on her all the time but she clearly didn't learn anything from it.

No advice really, I just don't tell her stuff really but I also have the advantage of her living a 6 hour drive away.

user It occurs to me now that she’s the one with the issue, we no longer have a relationship. It’s liberating. But when I was 26 she just made me feel like shit.

Really feel for you.
My mum is the same. Always finding something to 'pick-on'. I can usually 'feel' her looking at my clothes and she will say something like "oh Blue, that top really shows your tummy". It makes me feel violated if I'm honest.
When my DC we're small she used to mention about other mothers having beautiful tidy homes and ask why I couldn't keep things tidy.
Ever since I was a child she has always commented on my friends and others being "so pretty" and as a child she would comment that I was fat. ( She completely failed to provide me with a healthy diet and would buy me unhealthy foods and fill my plate)
I live with anxiety and she totally puts me down "what have you got to be worried about?". ( Like she thinks it's that simple and like I'd confide in her anyway).
When a partner left me after we had moved in together she said that it was only a matter of time before he found someone better looking than me.
When I pull her up on her behavior she cries and says how awful I am to her.

It’s an external demonstration of their own (hidden) insecurity. Still hurts though.

I ended contact with my mother for myself and my children. She was very toxic and believed her own her lies. Imagined negativity happening when it wasnt and was so self absorbed. When I first did I was devastated. I couldn't grasp how i would live without a mother. However two years later I've come to really believe it was the best decision as I have way less stress and negativity, more time on my hands and I'm happier. Sometimes I'm upset I dont have a mother figure or my children dont have grandparents but I know its for the better. I couldn't carry on being emotionally manipulated and guilt tripped all because of the title mother.

My mum has some very lovely points, and is a kind person who looks after others in many ways. Moreover she has been very supportive to me in hard times. I've noticed though that she cannot stop the critical comments when I'm in the same house as her. Maybe it is not even criticism it is micromanaging, "I want to you to be a better person, make more of your life etc". When you are about 54 it begins to feel very strange.
Since my children have become teenagers I see more clearly how this comes about. You really worry about your children and the only way you can think to help is to constantly warn them..But it comes across as a critical narrative, interfering, putting down, shaming whatever. You don't mean it to, but it is dangerously near that.
It is from a place of fear and anxiety, and possibly a kind of jealousy if they are happy and you feel cheated or thwarted of your own happiness on any level as an adult. (which I know my mother sometimes does)

I really do admire and love my mother but her own low self esteem, which displays itself in micromanaging controlling behaviour, can reduce me to tears at times. She is miles better on the phone. It is difficult to detach from her highs and lows, but I'v had to resist a lot of her theories on life whilst feeling at the same time "programmed" to have many of her instincts. For example we both love gardening and reading. We are both quite introverted, not clothes orientated, and love small children. You see yourself, and then you don't.

But venom is a good word. I do feel there is a kind of bitterness and rage that is not directed at me specifically but the world in general, and for some reason, your adult children end up taking the brunt of it.

I have a very similar DM, she always finds something nasty to say and never rejoices in any of my achievements - when I told her my DH had proposed she said ‘well? What do you want me to say?’ She’s also doubly messed up by being very lovely and charming at times too - it’s all so confusing.

I’m sorry your mother had generated such a difficult relationship but I find my best coping strategies are to distance myself - I see her about for times a year and to remember that she has taught me how not to parent. I treat my children like they are gifts, I don’t screw them up and mess with their heads.