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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think always being late isn’t a quirky personality trait

420 replies

CorianderDestroysFamilies · 13/04/2019 11:39

I’m meeting my friend today and I already know she’ll be late. Normally she’ll message me at the time we’re supposed to be meeting saying she’s just about to leave so I’ll be stood waiting for 15 minutes, one time she messaged saying she would be an hour late Angry I was already at the meeting point with my DC so it was a waste of all our time.
Anyway I’ve just seen another funny Hmm meme about how someone will still be in the bath at the time they should be going out and how hilarious it all is. I just think things like this normalise lateness and justify people like it’s some sort of quirky, unavoidable character flaw when it’s actually really rude and makes people like me less likely to want to see you. So AIBU?

OP posts:
Borntobedifferent · 14/04/2019 15:01

@imnotmad

Exactly. People have no idea how hard it is and also hard upsetting it is when people tell you to try harder because I've been internally calling myself lazy and stupid for 30 years !

Maybe neuro typical people should just relax and not worry about it, it's apparently that easy to change your mind set about something so they should just do that !

Borntobedifferent · 14/04/2019 15:03

@BlueCornishPixie

Why don't you just not stress ? That easy isn't it! Apparently !!

Oh wait ....

grannieanne · 14/04/2019 15:14

@Motoko I am well aware that I do not have the monoply on difficult family circumstances and I do not wish to get into a tragedy top trumps with you, I won't be disclosing my own health isuues to prove a point on here.

I am currently sat here waiting for an out of hours Dr to attend my father, he is now 4 hours 'late' .. is that rude or taking the piss ? It's not... I understand, and I understand the pressures each and every one of us trying to juggle the demands of life.

There are far more important things in this life to concern ourselves with than being a bit late for stuff, that ultimately, does not matter - that was the point of my original post.

Peace to you and yours .

GreenTulips · 14/04/2019 15:22

Imnotmad

Thank you for sharing,people do need to be educated about this, and hopefully some have changed their minds on ‘rudeness’

howmanyleftfeet · 14/04/2019 15:22

My sister is always late for everything which annoys the hell out of me, but she's the kindest, most considerate person. The reason for her lateness is she is incredibly indecisive and a faffer , so it takes her so much longer to get somewhere than anticipated. She underestimates timeframes. I think it is anxiety based and in no way means to be rude.

I'd strongly suggest she looks into ADHD. Look up inattentive ADHD in adults and see if it strikes a chord.

howmanyleftfeet · 14/04/2019 15:30

It's waisting my time so that they can get done what they wanted

Usually what I'm doing when I'm late is rushing around trying to find clothes to put on (note - I'm not trying to find something I like - merely something that a). still fits and b). is clean).

Then I'm trying to find my shoes, remembering at the last minute that I need to transfer money over into DP's account and borrow his card - as I've lost mine, finding shoes that have gone missing etc etc.

None of it is stuff like washing up - it's the basics and it's chaos.

BroomstickOfLove · 14/04/2019 15:41

This is what it looks like to be a lazy, unpunctual person who doesn't care enough to be on time for an appointment with a friend.

Friend suggests meeting at the cat café at 10:30 am on Thursday 15th.

What my brain registers: "meet at the cat café on a Thursday". This is an improvement - I used to get muddled up with days of the week, but now I'm pretty good at them, although I have to pay extra attention if something is on a Saturday or Sunday because I do sometimes mistake one for the other.

I then anchor the approximate time in my mind by thinking of it as "meeting my friend for coffee" which fixes it as a mid-morning event, as I use "coffee" as a sort of number-avoiding code which my brain will understand as as indicating some time between 10am and 11:30. I'm much better with "straight-after" times for meeting up, eg "straight after school drop-off", "straight after work".

I ask my friend to text me the time and date, because there's a reasonable chance that I'd write down the date or time wrong if I did it myself. I set a reminder on my phone to enter the appointment on my calendar when I get home.

I get home and write the appointment on my calendar in pencil. I check three or four times that the date and time I've written is the same as the information in the text. I go off and do something else. I go back to the calendar later, and check another couple of times that they match. If they do, I write it in in pen. If not, I ask someone else to double check for me.

As the day of the appointment approaches, I start to plan the bus journey. Ideally, I have a paper copy or a print-off of the bus timetable. It's even better if it's in large text. That way, I can cover up the columns on the table I don't need, so that I don't read the wrong row or column by mistake, and then use a highlighter pen to show the information I need. Otherwise, I make the text very big and hold a ruler to the screen, to help keep me on the right track.

If the bus is the sort that shows up every 10 minutes, I relax a bit and take a note of the time of the bus that is the one before the one that will get me there on time. If it's the sort of bus that is infrequent, I stress a bit, and write down the time of the bus that will get me there on time.

I have lived in the same house for a long time, so I now know what time I need to leave in order to be at the bus stop with time to spare. If I'm starting my journey from an unfamiliar place, I'll need to spend 30-45 minutes (probably. I don't actually know as I don't really have a proper sense of time. Enough that my tea will go cold, and I'll be stressed and miserable) with Google maps and a calculator working out bus routes and walking times.

I take a post- it note and write down the appointment time at the bottom. Above that, I write the time of the bus. Above that, I write the time I need to leave the house. I stick the post-it in my diary, on the page with the appointment date.

The night before the appointment, I check my calendar, and see that I am due to meet my friend the next day. I get a sheet of A4 paper and a felt tip pen and write down my schedule for the day. I include the information from the post-it. I remember to include a few 15-30 minute gaps for dealing with stuff that comes up unexpectedly, because I know that when stuff does come up, I won't be able to prioritize as effectively as most people can. I make sure that everything I need is packed and ready for the next day.

On the day, I follow the schedule I have written for myself. In the past, I've set timers, in an attempt to keep on track, but they don't work well for me, because I don't really notice how time is passing between the start and finish. I've been doing The Organised Mum Method for housework, and she does timed music playlists which are incredibly useful as I can hear the music changing, so I've started making my own playlists for measured amounts of time.

On the day, I follow my written schedule, and hopefully arrive at the bus stop on time.

Once the bus gets in, I go the café. It's 20 minutes before our table is available so I go to the shop next door to browse. This is a big danger time. I set a timer on my phone for three minutes before the table is free. Without the alert, I could easily let 30 minutes pass without checking the time, thinking that only 5 minutes had passed.

I leave the shop and make it to the appointment on time.

I realise that most of the steps are things that punctual people do anyway, but the main difference seems to be that they internalise the process, and don't forget to do them if they don't write themselves a reminder note. I basically have the timekeeping skills of a distractible 5 year old, and I don't ever improve to the stage where I can do without the prompting of very a sensible adult. When I tried to internalise the skills, I couldn't do it and was always late, so I had to become my own sensible adult and set up systems to prompt myself. This works, BUT because the system relies on the prompting of my past self, it all falls to pieces when unexpected things happen.

So if I write the date wrong, or read the timetable wrong, or read my reminder note wrong, or deal with a homework crisis which means I don't finish writing my plan for the day ahead, or my mum phones and interrupts my schedule, or I don't hear the alarm on my phone, then I'll probably be late, because although I've learned how to give myself sensible timekeeping instructions, I haven't yet learned how to cope without those instructions.

DaftDaffodil · 14/04/2019 15:47

All this ‘I have problems processing time ‘. What self-important cobblers.
fluffiphlox, I don’t think you have any idea what you’re talking about, but I don’t really blame you as I spent years assuming "normal for me" was probably roughly normal for most.

I was diagnosed with ADHD not that long ago and one of the biggest eye-openers (of several) from the medication they gave me was that I suddenly had an understanding of time that I’d never had.

It was pretty overwhelming. I get that everyone has to plan and they don’t just magically get places/do things on time but I’d also been planning, thinking "everyone else manages – they must be trying harder – I must try harder – try harder, you lazy idiot". The difference was that with the medication, the planning actually worked, and with far less struggle.

It wasn’t until then that I asked some of my closer friends about how they coped with things like time planning and we decided that yes, they made an effort, but that I seemed to have been putting far more effort into it for years and still frequently got it all wrong.

AsleepAllDay · 14/04/2019 15:49

Give her a limit for how long you will wait & if she breaks it, the brunch or dinner or whatever is off.

Being late from time to time really is normal but she's taking the piss and if you meet regularly then that's a lot of your time that she's not respecting

havingtochangeusernameagain · 14/04/2019 16:03

I suspect that if you have ADHD it shows itself in more than just being late for everything. It will be clear to your friends and family that you are disorganised and stressed and not being rude. Although I read an article last week about someone who was diagnosed with ADHD and even her (ex) boyfriend said it was "malicious fuckwittery". She was always late paying bills and her tax.

On the other hand, the person who is late for everything because they decide they'll go to the gym first, or got held up elsewhere but insist on washing their hair even though it will make them 30 minutes late, doesn't have a condition. Or they do - it's called being inconsiderate.

As someone else said, a very few people may have mental processing difficulties which make them ditzy. Everyone else is just selfish.

On the other hand, I am too early for everything and it drives my son mad. If Google Maps tells me it takes 90 minutes to get somewhere, I'll leave 2 hours before I need to be at my destination. If it says 3 hours, I'll leave 4 hours.

When ds missed half a sports training session in another county because he was stuck on the motorway in a traffic jam for a couple of hours he started to get it though.

BitOfFun · 14/04/2019 16:04

I fully appreciate that some people have extenuating circumstances or various neurological conditions, but the vast majority of persistent latecomers are just rude and inconsiderate.

BlueCornishPixie · 14/04/2019 16:05

borntobe all I'm saying is I don't think you can expect people to not get annoyed about wasting an awful lot of their time waiting for you. If you were my friend I probably would make sure we met at my house for example to minimise my stress, but you can't expect people to just be fully accepting all the time, without any acknowledgment of how it affects them.

howmany but where are your clothes? Like if they are in your bedroom you just grab some and put them on. Takes 5 minutes. 5-10minutes late is okay. If you know you are always having a faff then build in faff time. Like I too am always running round trying to find things before I leave, but I know I do this so I have to add 15minutes onto my leave times. I have mobile contactless so when I forget my card I can still pay. I have cash scattered everywhere because I'm always forgetting my purse. What were you doing before you were madly running around trying to find things? Because you were doing something even if it was just sitting there. I always have to clock watch when I know I have to leave to make sure I leave on time.

Borntobedifferent · 14/04/2019 16:13

But why is it annoying ? Why is stress more important than my neurological condition? In fact as someone with anxiety I know this is something that can be changed through CBT and medication.

There are things to help with my ADHD but at the moment all that I've tried haven't helped.

And nope the chances are people including close friends and family won't know someone has ADHD. I didn't know I had ADHD so how would they know? I just thought I was a bit of a scatterbrain or lazy not that something's are not just difficult but impossible for me

TheNavigator · 14/04/2019 16:29

Why is stress more important than my neurological condition?

Why does your neurological condition make you more important than the person you are fucking around with your lateness? Also, how do you know what is going on in their head and their issues? All your posts are 'me, me, me'.

If you can't be on time to meet someone, be up front and tell them not to make arrangements with you as you won't be able to keep them. Otherwise, your behaviour is rude and inconsiderate.

Supersimpkin · 14/04/2019 16:38

Late = rude.
Pulling disability as an excuse = rude.

Be careful what you wish for - every single symptom of mental illness is a lot worse than being tardy for a wine bar.

Borntobedifferent · 14/04/2019 16:40

My point is real though, eveyrone is saying it's ride and their concerns are more important than my condition.

Being on time consistently is asking me to go up stairs in a wheelchair.

But it's ok, you are just another person that has no idea what my condition is like and has no empathy for it.

WhereYouLeftIt · 14/04/2019 16:41

@ poster CorianderDestroysFamilies "I’m going to start stating an earlier meeting time or just tell her to catch up if there’s a few of us going."
Or when she texts you that she's just leaving, text back 'Don't bother. I'm fed up of you making me wait around for you."

Ski4130 · 14/04/2019 16:43

If you know you have a tendency toward being late due to a neurological condition, then that’s ok, it is what it is. I’d say 95% of the people I know who are repeatedly late are just that, late, with no underlying reason whatsoever. If you know you’re constantly late due to whatever very good reason you have, own it and let people know that, I’d be more understanding of someone saying ‘you know what, my anxiety/ADHD/insert reason makes me run late for meetings’ then being left sat waiting for 45 minutes/an hour for my friend to show up.

underneaththeash · 14/04/2019 16:49

If you know you’re going to be late, just put an alarm on your phone (or two) to remind you. Do it when you’re actually making the plans if it helps.

I can’t be doing with people who are repeatably late and I if it’s happened a few times, I just leave and text to let them know.

TheFirstRuleOfFightClub · 14/04/2019 16:53

*AfterSchoolWorry

Again though, late people, if it's due to a cognitive difficulty why make plans in the first place?*

FFS! Hmm

PlatypusLeague · 14/04/2019 16:55

I have always had a tendency to be late, but didn't know why. Decades later after lots of therapy etc. realised the reasons. For me it was because of a combination of social anxiety (if you're early you may have to talk to other people or have them notice you) and OCD (which makes it harder to leave the house). Neither of these are rational but equally they aren't a sign of thinking your time is more important than someone else's. It's the opposite, that you don't feel valuable enough to get out there and be seen. It's to do with fear and anxiety being so strong that they outweigh even the embarrassment and guilt of lateness. I have struggled with this for years and no, I do not take any pleasure in it at all or think other people's time is less valuable. I am forever grateful to people who have been kind and patient despite this obvious fault of mine.

howmanyleftfeet · 14/04/2019 17:25

howmany but where are your clothes?

My clothes are in piles around the house. Some are in a pile in the bedroom waiting to be put away. Some are in a pile on the floor, or on the chair, having been worn but not dirty enough to be put in the wash.

Some are in the wash, some in the tumble dryer, some in the utility room.

None of the clothes in the wardrobe / drawers are ones I wear regularly - they are the ones for special occasions or our of season clothes.

What was I doing beforehand? Say I'd arranged to meet you at 10:30pm, here's how a typical morning goes.

Wake up at 8pm (late as I've been up till about 1:30am trying to get everything done I needed to the night before, and for about 5 nights before that so I'm shattered). Gets kids breakfast, dressed, brushed etc, nearly ready for school in 40 minutes (need to leave at 8:40am to not be late). Realise I forgot to get the water bottles ready - can't find one of them. Look for it last minute. Find it after 5 minutes. Leave house, realise don't have key. Go back, find key. Leave again. It's now 8:50, both kids will be late. Walk and drop DS off at 9am, DD at 9:15am. Back home 9:30am.

I haven't had a cup of tea or breakfast but hope to get a chance before I leave. My hair is in desperate need of a wash, I jump in the shower - literally wash my hair and out in 5 minutes, realise there's no towel (forgot to check beforehand) run about the house naked looking for a towel! Get a towel. It's 9:45, not sure how that happened, I need to leave at 10am to be on time. I know I don't have time to dry my hair properly, a quick blast will have to do. I put clothes on, can't find shoes, I just had the shoes on a minute ago, can't work out what I did with them!

Dressed with shoes on, 9.55am. Realise I won't get time for breakfast or a cuppa. Dry hair for 5 minutes. Put hairbrush in pocket, hope to get a chance to brush it on route. Get up to leave at 10am, then realise I don't have my wallet. (I don't carry it in a handbag as I lose bags, it needs to be on my person). Look for wallet - find it and leave 10:05am. Run to bus stop, see the bus that gets me there on time pull out, I've missed it by 30 seconds! (Done this so many times!). Wait 15 minutes for next one. Late.

Now, I know you'll say - go to bed / get up earlier. But that's just one of many scenarios in which I end up late. I still end up late on the days I get up early. I usually leave the house dishevelled. I don't wear clothes I like - I wear the ones I can find in the time I have available. I don't wear makeup but even if I did, I'd never have time for it.

I live my whole life like this, it's exhausting! There are lots of things I could do to organise myself, and I am trying, but currently I'm in a massive pickle and it's proving difficult to pull myself out of it - not the easiest task with an ADHD brain!

Imnotmad · 14/04/2019 17:27

I get it’s horrid when people are late. It’s hard to wait when you have places to be and no one wants to look like Billy no mates.

I don’t and didn’t expect people to wait for me. I understand if a person can’t cope with lateness decides to terminate our friendship or if I don’t get the job or I miss the show. I don’t demand special treatment due to ADHD (other than the ability to stand up and walk around for 5 mins in exams) but I wish people would stop making value judgements on my motives. I am not late because I don’t care about you. I am late because I don’t understand on a functional level how to prioritise and sequence activities to get me out the door on time.

I think that people want lateness to be a moral failing, otherwise they would have to accept that they are disablist.

To put it another way if I was in a wheelchair i wouldn’t expect my able bodied friend not to climb Everest because I can’t but I wouldn’t expect them to judge me a terrible person because I can’t.

(Btw ADHD is protected under the equality act)

howmanyleftfeet · 14/04/2019 17:28

If you know you have a tendency toward being late due to a neurological condition, then that’s ok, it is what it is. I’d say 95% of the people I know who are repeatedly late are just that, late, with no underlying reason whatsoever.

ADHD and many other neurological conditions in adults are massively underdiagnosed. They simply weren't recognised when we were DC, especially not in girls, and especially if you lack the hyperactivity part of ADHD as you weren't trouble.

You have no idea what's going on in someone's head, nor how they cover for it. Many of them may have some kind of condition but have no idea themselves. Or have an inkling but be in denial, or simply have no idea how to go about getting it diagnosed.

howmanyleftfeet · 14/04/2019 17:29

I think that people want lateness to be a moral failing, otherwise they would have to accept that they are disablist

This.