He should have got her a cab first (before his own)

[Jalila07]

Hi, in a desperate attempt to find relief from Brexit, we’re here having lunch and discussing my friend’s date last weekend.

Ladies of MN, please may we put it to you for the casting vote as we’re in some disagreement. To cut a longish story short, the date had gone well until they were on Charing Cross Rd and his Uber came first so he got in it and just left my friend standing on the street!

Now he’s texting her to meet again. She’s inclined to not bother, I feel as if I agree with her, but two others here think she should give him another chance (citing excuses such as traffic, it’s hard for cabs to stop, etc).

WIBU? Shouldn’t he have called her a cab and seen her off before just sailing off into the night? By the way, we are all early 40s so she can’t be bothered messing about.

Thankyou in advance.

If your friend was put off by this, I don't think she's ready for dating in London in 2019.

It's Charing Cross not a warzone. The man did the standard thing and got into his Uber as soon as it arrived. What else could he do? The driver is not going to stop longer that needed?

As for going to Hampstead, well, it's on the tube line. Does your friend use the tube regularly?

No men don’t need to do “extra stuff.” As far as I’m concerned, it should come naturally to them, as men. If it doesn’t fine, but they’re probably not my type.

And what comes naturally to a woman, where she does little extras in a date to impress.

Come on. You want a man to to think about getting her home safely, to show he cares and is interested. What should come naturally to a woman to show the same?

If you don’t want men to tray you badly, then start as you mean to go on, frankly.

Exactly. I wanted a partner who is fine assuming I'm a fully functioning independent adult. Start with a guy who thinks you need help to find your own home and next thing you know, he's choosing what you're allowed to eat at a restaurant..

next thing you know, he's choosing what you're allowed to eat at a restaurant..

Quoting the OP:

And yes, he might order for me if he’s recommending something he thinks I’ll like.

There is nothing particularly wrong with your husband ordering for you in restaurant if he knows the menu or whatever.

Ordering for herself is not a priority for her.

The thing is that the OP and her friends clearly come from a very different world to most of us - both in terms of wealth and gender norms.

OP - I think the things you should take from this are a) a bit of an understanding that you and your friends are out of step with most people so it's going to be hard for your friend to find someone who meets her expectations and she likes and b) I would worry a bit that some men who superficially seem suitable might turn out to be controlling or abusive, I am not saying this is the case for all of them, you seem happy with your husband, but I think it's worth your friend looking out for that sort of red flag.

I wouldn't like it, OP. Irrational, given that she was hardly likely to come to grief on Charing Cross Road unless she walked in front of a bus, but clicking with someone is made up of many things, some of them irrational.

I'd have been standing on the pavement thinking: 'Mmm. Maybe not for me.'

Avoid. He sounds unspeakably rude.

Hi OP, I suspect you are the 'friend' maybe!? That aside, it isn't 1950. Why on earth should he pay your friend's cab journey home and what is wrong with calling his cab and getting in it! My husband (who is lovely) would do exactly that if we were not both heading different places and I wouldn't think anything of it! I think that he is the one who should be concerned!

“What should come naturally to them? Eh?”

Well, being a gent and having a certain standard of behaviour and integrity. Also, I think some women get worked up about “protectiveness” in men because they confuse it with “abusiveness.”

As for “what should women do?” Well, again it’s in the eye if the beholder. I guess certain types of women attract certain types of men. If you’re talking about me, you’d have to ask DH what he saw in me in the first place. I’m not entirely sure.

But yes, of course there are extra pressures on women that don’t apply to men as much. How they look, dress etc. You’d have to be living under a rock to not notice or experience that to some degree.

Left this thread earlier but couldn't resist checking in again as it's nearly hit the 1,000 mark.
OP, you sound like a nice, intelligent person and you've been very gracious to some rude people on here. The reason the thread has run and run is because yours is a lifestyle that not many of us ever get an insight into. You do know that?

So for women it comes down to looks, that's what they need

For men it's how much they can do for the woman.

Not very equal. And makes women ornamental.

You’d have to be living under a rock to not notice or experience that to some degree.

OP, the irony is that you appear to have been living under a rock since about 1950. Maybe you should compile a checklist of '2019 Normal' for your clueless princess friend, which should include as you appear not to know this that it's perfectly normal, at the initial dating stage, (such as the one she has reached with the man who wants her to Traipse to Hampstead) to see numerous people for dates unless you've decided to be exclusive.

You keep mentioning discovering that a man 'has several women on the go' as some terrible discovery, akin to infidelity, but I assure you it's entirely normal these days to date several people at one time when you're still figuring out compatibility, as your friend will discover.

If a woman isn't safe going from date to home on her own, does that mean she requires an escort from home to the date?

I don't understand the attitude towards inviting someone to a restaurant local to them? She can decline invite in Hampstead if she thinks that travelling from Chelsea makes her seem desperate or something? What's the difference between realising that he's not the man for you in Hampstead or the West End? Dates are all about getting to know the other person and if they tick your requirements.

Ordering food for someone else is infantilising. All well and good recommending it, but if a man actually ordered for me I'd tell him to sod off. It's not romantic or chivalrous in the slightest.

Dairy - Thankyou, you’re very kind. I’ve also found the thread fascinating because I don’t think I’ve ever come across some if the attitudes on here in real life. We honestly thought yesterday, the MN consensus would be “don’t bother with him. LTB!”

Jess - do you think you might be taking my word and extrapolating to the extreme? I never said that looks are all that matter for women. Who would say that? I was simply giving an example of one of the “extras” for women because you asked about that.

I think it’s sad that women feel they have to put up with men multi-dating them, if that’s the case these days. When did that become a thing?

Jessgalinda it's more about being kind.

On our first date with my husband, 30 years ago, I drove to meet him in Central London. We lived 29 miles apart at opposite sides of the city so that was reasonable plan.

We then drove to restaurant in West London. At the end of the evening I could have dropped him off at the tube station which was on a direct line home for him. But I liked him and wanted to be with him so I gave him a lift home.

He lived about two miles off the A40. At the end, when we parted outside his flat, he then worried that I might not find the correct slip junction back east. This is not because he thought I was an idiot, the route was a bit confusing through a warren of suburban streets and you can easily get on the wrong slip.

So he directed me to the correct route and then walked home. That was one of the things that made me want a second date, because he cared about me even though he'd only just met me. And obviously he thought I was a nice person because I gave him a lift home rather than dropping him at the tube.

Jalila07 no I am not taking it to the extreme. You think that a man has perform certain acts to be dateable. A woman has to be attractive to be dateable. That's the effort she puts in.

Can you not see how dated that is? Can you not see how that's reducing women to ornaments. It's not equality.

Women don't have to put up with men multi dating. Women can multi date and enjoy it too. Why should someone be exclusive, when they have had one date. When would you like that to start? Do you become exclusive when ask someone out, before the date?

I think it’s sad that women feel they have to put up with men multi-dating them, if that’s the case these days. When did that become a thing?

There you go again, OP, assuming female passivity and male activity. Women don't 'have to put up with' anything at all 'these days'. They are equally free to date numerous men and to decide whether to discuss exclusivity at any point they like.

Just as your passive friend could have said that meeting in Hampstead didn't work for her, and what about Chelsea/ any other district of London. Or is that something she couldn't say, without wrecking the impression of being a dolly without agency?

And it became a thing because of online dating, I imagine.

I’ve also found the thread fascinating because I don’t think I’ve ever come across some if the attitudes on here in real life. We honestly thought yesterday, the MN consensus would be “don’t bother with him. LTB!”

This suggests you are not only out of touching with dating norms in 2019 Britain, but with people in general. Are you living in a bubble composed entirely of passive trophy wives?

limitedperiodonly and yet op doesnt think the woman needs to perform any acts of kindness for a man she wants to date.

That's the point you are missing. If its kindness, then it would go both ways.

OP wanted him to make the under wait, which you cant. Or let her take it, again not always possible. And hang around until the journey was complete so he could book another.

Wheres the kindness there?

I mean really - you've 'never encountered in real life' the idea that a woman can travel around unescorted by a man?

Oh, FFS. I know that I'm a belligerent fuckwit at times but, hats off to you, I ain't no competition!

Uber not under