It’s MY decision as a parent NOT the schools

[IfeelSoIll]

I’m really quite angry
My dd (secondary school) has been unwell quite a bit lately, some very nasty viral illnesses. Been to gp and nothing underlying just bad luck it seems.

Anyway, yet again she returned yesterday feeling grim so had an early night but barely slept this morning throat was horrendously red and sore. Very congested and extremely nasty runny nose.
Generally tired and achy but no temperature.

School have called and told us bring her in. That THEY will keep her there and administer paracetamol and they will decide if she needs to go home. That in future if she’s ill to get her up and send her in and they will then decide.

AIBU to think that it’s cruel to send a visibly very unwell child to school just to prove who makes the decision about whether they are well enough to be in or not ?

The statistic about attendance/GCSE results always makes me wonder. I can see that a child missing maths every Monday will have a problem but does a single week off have the same effect?
A single week in a year would be around 97%. Statistically, those students make good progress.
The data in our school is very clear about those below 95% on average not making good progress. There are some exceptions, but not many. Below 90% is a serious concern.

Below 90% is a serious concern.
It’s amazing isn’t it? People who are ill are disadvantaged. People who’s disability leads to missing school are disadvantaged.
I know!!! Let’s make them walk and talk and behave like they aren’t ill or disabled (or bereaved, or relocating or all of the other things that mean you might miss some days of school)....that’ll fix them.. Are people REALLY this stupid.

Hell would freeze over before I allowed the school to decide if my child was unwell enough to be at school.

It's really shitty to have a shitty cold. It makes you feel shitty.
It does not, however, affect your learning ability.

This is the most ludicrous bollocks in a thread packed with ludicrous bollocks.

Yanbu, but sadly I’m not surprised. This culture of making ill kids attend school is going too far.

The absolute worst are the teachers and mothers on this thread who swallow this bollocks and even preach it on here as if it all makes sense. That is why our schools are full of anxious children with an explosion of mental health issues, because people use statistics and fear to raise them rather than learn to parent properly and to use common sense.

Missed 11% of school attendance? Then you simply have to catch up your work. Simple. Not hysterical school targets, forcing teachers to become ersatz health professionals and Council workers doing home visits and the rest of the sad, mad shit.

Agreed Haff

It's all just a bit... over the top.

Although I say this as someone who has shit attendance throughout school, college and uni and always did very well so I don't think attendance is the be all and end all as long as someone is working hard in the background.

Well said, @Haffiana

When we were looking at secondary schools, the local "high achieving" school prided itself on its robust attendance policies, including an explicit expectation that sick children would be brought to school and soldier on. They did mention providing buckets for vomitting children.

We went elsewhere.

Missed 11% of school attendance? Then you simply have to catch up your work. Simple

Who catches up the work? The student or the teacher?

Council workers doing home visits and the rest of the sad, mad shit

Parent hits child and bruise appears. Child kept off school and parent phones child in 'sick'. Parent hits child again and bruise appears. Child kept off school and parent phones child in 'sick'. Parent hits child and bruise appears. Child kept off school and parent phones child in 'sick'. Parent hits child so hard, child is permanently disabled as a result (or worse). School damned for not having followed up frequent absences.

Ah yes all sick children should be forced into school because some parents are abusive

My DS is doing his GCSEs this year. He's had more bout of sickness this year than any other, very possibly due to a reduced immunity resulting from the ex essive pressure he and fellow pupils have been put under to achieve. The lastest infection resulted in a letter and phone call from school. I explained the situation and the nurse was extremely understanding. She understood that going to school with swollen tonsils to the point that you dribble is not the right thing to do to get over it as quickly as possible. I agreed that it was a pity that he had his worse sickness record this year but some things can't be controlled.

So maybe hell end up with levels 6 rather than 7, or 7 rather 8. Pity for the s hool but for him? It will make no difference to getting a place at the college he picked nor his expected choice of further studies and doubt it will mean him losing out of a job offer because of it.

Things have been taken too far trying to tackle a sadly serious issues but targeting everyone as a result when the majority are not really affected by the problem. Some Heads and teachers are losing sight of what matters most through those years of propaganda about attendance.

I have to agree OP I have found over several issues the massive overstepping of boundaries from schools is getting ridiculous, I don't think it helps that more times than I would like I come across school professionals who are unable to deliver a message without being condescending . I recognise they have to speak in a child centric way all day but the sheer stupidity of feeling like they can speak like that to adults just highlights such an insular ignorant system.

I've had a different but similar themed issue with the school my ds1 won an attendance award the same week the school were massively overstepping and making huge judgements around other issues.

Interestingly I don't particularly get on with my Dsis but she had experienced similar with one of her DC and she actually works in a school on the SLT and our discussion was around the fact she frequently heard teachers and staff make really inappropriate judgements they were not qualified for....around sickness , disabilities parental ability.

She explained that it was such a cut off world it had almost become a belief that the knowledge of teachers and staff was far superior to doctors and parents etc

Now granted as a sister she's Batshit crazy but professionally she knows her stuff and has won awards.

It does make me concerned to the level schools have a say withoutspecific training and education on certain issues.

I've had to recently point out to ds1 teacher that she is simply not qualified to make statements about my ds physical needs ,she retorted " I am a qualified teacher you know "... I'm not proud if my response because it was a dick move but I responded " and frankly I have twice the education you do but again not in medicine so neither of us are qualified and should leave it to those who are "

I'd be interested to see the school's risk assessment for this policy.

Ah yes all sick children should be forced into school because some parents are abusive

How does a school know? How do you know the difference between a child who is off regularly because someone is hurting them and a child who is off regularly because they have caught bug after bug and are struggling to get well? How does the school know if the child is causing the parent issues and refusing to get out of bed? How does the school know if this is a family that needs extra help because one parent is suddenly very ill and the other is running around like a headless chicken trying to manage everything? Attendance, for whatever reason, at 89% is very low. The school is right to have concerns. If the parent co-operates with the school, keeps pastoral managers/form tutor up to date, it is unlikely things will escalate further.

So maybe hell end up with levels 6 rather than 7, or 7 rather 8

If he were borderline 3/4 (which many children are) it's a very different issue, isn't it?

How is she today OP, and has there been anything further from school?

I agree that the sickness policy in some schools is draconian and would fight for my DC to stay home if they were genuinely ill enough to need to be at home.
But rereading the OP her daughter has a nasty sore throat,is tired and congested with a runny nose - I'd go to with with that,unless my throat was so bad that I couldn't talk,and that's because I need to talk in my job.It wouldn't be fun for a few days,but painkillers,sore throat lozenges etc do help.
So lots of sympathy for the girl and I'm sure she isn't feeling great but IMO she should be in school.
Whether it's a sign of something else is for the GP to assess.

How does a school know? How do you know the difference between a child who is off regularly because someone is hurting them and a child who is off regularly because they have caught bug after bug and are struggling to get well
They pay closer atte tion to individual pupils and parents. I know that this is very hard to do as staff are under so much pressure from Heads and pointless Ofsted, but ultimately, if they paid more attention, they would be a le to focus more attention to those who need it and less on those who don't.

As said, when my DS took quite some time off sick this year, they knew it was out of the norm for him. They paid attention to him when he came back from being off sick and noted that he still looked hollow and was still sniffing/caughing, supporting that he was unlikely to have made it up. After the 3rd episode, they also called me to discuss and could tell from what I said that I had checked myself that he was really ill and assessed that it was indeed severe enough to keep it at home by confirming for instance that I had taken his temperature and giving them the exact reading.

A supportive collaborative school will get so much out of its pupils than a school that treats everyone the same and by default assuming they are all liars and skivvers.

Issue with secondary school attendance is that teenagers will often fake illnesses or just plainly skive off because they can’t be arsed. The school are in a difficult position really, they probably don’t believe she’s as ill as you say she is. They’re under a lot of strain from the LA to ensure attendance levels of the whole school don’t dip.

Not saying your daughter is faking, you obviously believe there’s a strong reason to keep her off so much but bear all that in mind. Also depends on which year she is in but years 10-13 really shouldn’t skip days willy nilly.

I’m a college tutor (on mat leave) and students are asked to leave when their attendance reaches a certain level.

Even a simple cold varies from person to person.

If I get a cold I feel really bad. Muzzy head and really unwell. My dh otoh, just powers through and continues working etc despite feeling "rough". He had little sympathy when I had a cold and and I didn't want to move or function.

Then one day I had a cold. I had all the symptoms. I felt rough, but oh my goodness what a revelation! It was nothing like the colds I normally experience. If all my dh's colds are like this one, no wonder he has little sympathy for me. They are not comparable at all.

So people's experiences of colds differ. You can't judge others for being malingerers for having "just" a cold. You just don't know how they feel.

It’s the school’s decision once a child is at school whether or not to send home/keep them there.

It’s a parents’ descision as to whether or not they go to school on a particular day in the first case.

I’m of two minds here......

The school may be in a bit of trouble about attendance rates and 89% isn’t good. ( how many employers would be happy about a worker taking 1 day off a fortnight?) However few days off early in the year has quite an effect on % attendance.

At 89% they may feel that you’re being a bit soft. Is there a back story here? However you are generally in the best position to judge. Their letter may be badly worded encouragement?

Many schools aren’t happy about sick children being sent in ‘see how you go’ ‘my mum says I should get better by break’ etc as they sit for the day outside the office with a bowl on their knees.

If the school is to give paracetamol to pupils they really should be phoning you up/have a prior agreement.

It’s not helpful if children phone home and say that they’re not well and please would you pick me up without telling a teacher, office, pastoral manager. It causes a great deal of upset when a child disappears like this.

FlagranceDirect Oh my goodness! You must be traumatised! On the other hand . .

Dont be silly. I wasnt claiming to be traumatised just commenting on how pointless it is to send in a sick child who is just going to shuffle from lesson to lesson learning nothing just spreading their virus about.

My DCs are now all grown ups. We kept DCs off school when being at school wasnt going to benefit anyone. We knew when they were ill and when they were trying to swing the lead.

It isnt uncommon to go through periods of having one bug after another especially when in a new environment. OP's DD is in year 7 so there will be a lot of new ingredients added to the community viral soup. Better to get this out of the way in Y7 when it will do little if any long term academic harm.

My first response would be a polite version of ‘fuck off’

I would be looking for a new school for Y8.

MY child. MY decision. Any school that think they have more say in my child’s life than I do is not one I’d be sending my child too.

My child is my concern, not their statistics.

How does a school know? How do you know the difference between a child who is off regularly because someone is hurting them and a child who is off regularly because they have caught bug after bug and are struggling to get well

It's all about putting together a puzzle. If the child is always late or taking regular days off, the parent never calls in to notify of non attendance, doesn't do homework, never returns permission forms, and the parents never answer phone calls or have any engagement with the school, that is a very different picture to the child who has had a bad run of illness, the parent regularly engages with the school, attends parent-teacher interviews, the child has signed permission forms, or items needed for special event days.

A teacher is constantly making assessments about the students in their care, and often it is after talking to colleagues (such as the siblings teachers) that the whole jigsaw comes together. Eg the sibling has been at school everyday, so it's more likely an illness, as opposed to multiple siblings missing the same days regularly, which may indicate something a lot more serious.

I always ring parents after the second day of absence, if they haven't called in, not because I'm worried about attendance records (I couldn't care less, and I don't work in the UK), but because I'm worried about their child. I just like to touch base, see if there is anything I can do to help (eg making sure they know the next day is a free dress day, putting together some work for them, finding out if there are issues).