to be a bit ambivalent about the Pads4Dads campaign..

[BertrandRussell]

[https://www.heygirls.co.uk/pads-for-dads/ here]

On the one hand, obviously it’s great for fathers to be more involved and understanding, and obviously some girls don’t have a mum or an aunt or anyone. But I can’t help thinking that it’s all a bit cosmetic-a bit “hey look what a cool dad I am buying tampax” Ticking the “good dad” box. And what’s wrong with some things being women only anyway?

I just think it’s not to be applauded that we have to add a ‘for men’ aspect about something that is affecting half of the entire human population, for a minority to actually pay attention or learn about periods.

Maybe not to be applauded but we can be pleased that it's happening. Society has for many years told men that periods are for women to sort out. Women didn't want or thought they shouldn't be involved. From our female relatives whispering and telling us to keep sanpro out of sight of any men in the family to schools ushering boys out of lessons so that girls could learn about periods. I remember being told not to talk to the boys about what we had learnt about periods. It's no wonder many men and women see periods as taboo. It's crazy.

How would you like men to learn about periods then? And if they are in the position of caring for daughters on their own it's not enough for them just to have a biological knowledge is it? They do need to know how to use sanpro, what other issues there are rather than just the biology. How can they know this unless they are told?

Educate boys and girls together at schools. Or at the very least give them identical education. It is coming across that some women want to keep this as just for women. As though it isn't an issue for men to know about or get involved in.

I'm glad this campaign is running.

they could educate themselves?

There are far more women who are the sole parent to boys but I don't notice any campaigns of this kind to educate them about boys' needs - is that perhaps because women will educate themselves and not expect everything on a silver platter with a side dish of backpatting for, you know, being a parent?

I have to say, I find it baffling that a man who has had a child would need to “learn about periods”, but I accept that some do. Both of my children, one girl and one boy now young adults, learned about them at school- they had a lesson all together then single sex q&a sessions.

How can they know this unless they are told?

The need to ‘tell’ men things whilst women are expected to ‘know’ is getting very tiresome in all honesty. Apparently the want for an equal world is having to take anything ‘female related’, whether it’s health or housework or raising children or whatever else, and having to break it down for men in minuscule detail. And add ‘for men’ at the end, just so they completely understand.

There are far more women who are the sole parent to boys but I don't notice any campaigns of this kind to educate them about boys' needs - is that perhaps because women will educate themselves and not expect everything on a silver platter with a side dish of backpatting for, you know, being a parent?

Exactly this.

Right, I think some earlier posts have given me a bit of clarity on this subject. The idea that a PP's dad has been awesome, great, brilliant etc for being what I'd say is, or should be normal? Not to take away from the dad at all or belittle how understanding he was........but im not sure I'd congratulate a man who handled his daughters periods in a perfectly normal 'good parenting in general' kind of way, like I'm not surprised a man did this iyswim.

I'll no doubt contradict myself again very soon these splinters are getting a bit hurty.

thank goodness we are moving on from the 'don't tell your father' era. I'm of an age that my df would never even have known if I was having a period and would have been mortified if it was mentioned - in those days he was not allowed into the delivery room, every part of periods/giving birth was a total mystery to him, my dh is more enlightened and would not have worried about buying sanpro for me or dd, however, my son in law is a different kettle of fish, so switched on, would happily make a my dd an 'emergency' pack, understands about pmt, will help out with the dgs if she is in pain etc intelligent young men just seem so much more laid back about womens health issues now.

by laid back i also mean more knowledgible

The campaign isn't really for the benefit of dads/men though, is it. At the end of the day, it is girls/women who will benefit through men being more informed.

When I was a teenager, my dad punched me in the face and threw me across the room, calling me a disgusting whore because I'd left traces of blood in the toilet. So I'm a bit astounded that anyone can be sceptical about a campaign which ensures that all human beings are educated about a normal bodily function.

The campaign is probably needed but I was disappointed by the use of 'menstruator' in some of their tweets.
DD is on her second period and DH has already gone out to buy pads for her. I have been very keen for her periods to not be a secret thing. Next stage is to get her brother to buy some as he'll have to buy some for a woman in his life at some point.

The need to ‘tell’ men things whilst women are expected to ‘know’ is getting very tiresome in all honesty.

What? How are women expected to know? Girls are taught about it at school. Magazines aimed at girls and women have articles about it. When a girl starts her periods she usually asks for help from someone. We don't just "know" do we? We are taught about it at various stages through our lives.

And I asked the question earlier and no one answered- how many mums have educated themselves about boys reproductive health? Not just biology but actual practical experience? How many have educated their sons about self examination for example?

I bet not many.

with respect, sporting, I think your experiences are not the norm and we really shouldn't have 'ignorance about this will cause men to violently assault their daughters' as a starting point.

I am very sorry for what happened to you, that is appalling

Weetabixandshreddies

Absolutely agree with everything you have said. I think girls and boys should learn about periods in primary schools. There's possibly a need to do it separately due to silliness at that age but as you said the information given should be identical. If it's not it gives the impression that girls have this secret thing that only they need to know about. These boys then turn into men and some never progress from that way of thinking. Boys need to not only know what periods are, how they relate to a woman's cycle and having babies but also that they can cause symptoms such as headache, stomach ache etc. Men who are embarrassed of periods are a product of what we as a society have made them. Those that have had a mother or wife that's been very open with them may be different but campaigns like this one are needed for those men that has not been lucky enough to have that influence in their life.

Needs less campaign, presumably men know why women get periods, they must have learned that at school right! All they have to do is make themselves available if their dd needs to talk, if they are going down the shop, ask if their dd needs anything, and just read up about different San pro from the Internet. Sounds familiarly like Fathers4justice to me .

Weet how do you think single mothers (indeed, any mother) learn about all the things they need to know to bring up their sons? All the things they wouldn't have learnt in school? Can you point me to those campaigns aimed at mums, please - I'd like to take a look.

“I think girls and boys should learn about periods in primary schools.”

They do.

WeepingWillow I am aware that my experience was extreme and it genuinely wasn't my intention to bring violence into the debate. I do find it odd though that there are some schools of thought here which state that the information is out there and men can find it for themselves, which is true but it's not always as easy as that and some people just need a nudge in the right direction or help to interpret the information and I can't see anything wrong with that. Other seem to be rolling their eyes at the fact that this campaign will lead to men expecting some kind of hero-worship for buying tampons. I'd roll my eyes myself at these arseholes but at the end of the day, their daughter reap the benefit so I just can't get worked up. The fact that I have deal with a spectacularly crap dad in this respect just makes me a bit more sensitive to this and really militant about demystifying periods for everyone.

WeepingWillowWeepingWino

2 answers to your question

1. all single mothers educate themselves fully about boys reproductive health and development and then frankly and fully explain it to their sons

Or

2. some mums do the above and others have no clue, or a very basic understanding, and either ignore it completely, give it a go with their limited knowledge and make a hash of it or hope that other men do it for them.

Just because there aren't campaigns yet aimed at mothers of boys it doesn't mean that there isn't a need for one. I think there probably is.

I dont know what the girls learn but the boys at my ds' primary learnt very little about periods in PSHE. Just that they happen once a month if you're not pregnant. Pretty much everything my sons have learnt about periods Ive taught them.

How are women expected to know? Girls are taught about it at school. Magazines aimed at girls and women have articles about it. When a girl starts her periods she usually asks for help from someone. We don't just "know" do we? We are taught about it at various stages through our lives.

If boys are not being taught about it in schools, then that needs to be addressed asap. As I said previously, my experience was mix-sex education on puberty, but I know that is still not the case for everyone and that is a problem.

Yes, female orientated magazines will talk about periods, but that doesn’t mean that periods are a hidden secret between women either. This campaign is to encourage men to talk and engage about periods, I understand that - it’s the fact that it has to add ‘for dads’ on to information already readily available for anyone who cares to look for it (man or woman). It’s the fact that there has to be a campaign like this before some men would think to talk reasonably to their daughters about a perfectly normal event, it has to be specifically directed at them before they would think, actually engage their brains to figure it out themselves. That’s shocking, and indicative of a far larger problem that a campaign such as this is only touching the base on. No mother/woman would sit around saying ‘well I wasn’t taught about it at school, there’s no ‘for mums’ literature directed at me, so I can’t help my son with their health/puberty questions’.

And I would and will educate myself on the other side for my sons. I’m not a hypocrite, though I fully expect a ‘for mums’ campaign to balance it out, as obviously that’s the way forward for everything these days.

I dont know what the girls learn but the boys at my ds' primary learnt very little about periods in PSHE. Just that they happen once a month if you're not pregnant. Pretty much everything my sons have learnt about periods Ive taught them.

Very much so. Boys tend to learn about the biological aspect and not much else.

Girls get a more practical education, from school, mums, friends etc.

I dont know what the girls learn but the boys at my ds' primary learnt very little about periods in PSHE. Just that they happen once a month if you're not pregnant. Pretty much everything my sons have learnt about periods Ive taught them.

That’s been the same with my two DS’s. Their teaching at school was vastly different to the girls. Most of what they know about periods they’ve been taught by me.

And I asked the question earlier and no one answered- how many mums have educated themselves about boys reproductive health? Not just biology but actual practical experience? How many have educated their sons about self examination for example?

Exactly. I think many women like to think and go around saying that they as a sex have such a harsh deal. If a man has anything wrong or mentions a health issue their answer is 'try being a woman'. I say that as a woman who has endometriosis and suffer with awful periods but that doesn't mean that boys and men don't have any health issues relating to being male. As a woman who has a male partner, a son and a daughter I see it as my responsibility to be aware of not only things that can affect me and my daughter but also my partner and son too. My partner also feels just as much responsibility for mine and my daughters health as he does for his and our sons. We have to let men be involved and this is what this campaign seeks to do.

No mother/woman would sit around saying ‘well I wasn’t taught about it at school, there’s no ‘for mums’ literature directed at me, so I can’t help my son with their health/puberty questions’.
Sadly, yes there are women like that. Just as there are women who don't talk to their daughters and fathers who don't talk to their sons and daughters.

If all parents do such a good job why do we ned sex education at school? It would all be done at home if what you say is true.

And realistically, how does a mum know what it is like to be a boy? What puberty feels like for a boy? It's not easy to find out information sometimes unless you know what it is that you don't know.

And I think you are naive if you truly think that all mums educate their sons properly.

They do

The rest of my post explained what I think they need to learn. In primary my son learnt that a woman has a period each month when she's not pregnant. Nothing else.