Forgetting everything but the fact an innocent baby has died

[UnexpectedButExpected]

AIBU to feel unbelievably sad that Shamima Bergum’s baby has died.

The poor mite simply didn’t have a chance in the world he was born in to.

And you are certain this didn’t happen to Begum?

There is no evidence at all that she was befriended and groomed by an older man who introduced her to ISIS. All the evidence is that she sought them out herself.

The answer is that nobody knows how they got back, because nobody asked. The same people who are now frothing at the mouth over this woman, claiming to be concerned.

The age of consent in other countries is irrelevant, would a pervert be able to use that excuse in court? No. Nor should they.

Her enthusiasm also wouldn't be taken as consent, since legally she was a child.

It's interesting that people will push adult responsibility on to the girl in the burka, but not on someone that age groomed and horribly abused.

The apologists in Rotherham and Rochdale said much the same as is being said here. "She knew what she was doing" "she asked for it" "she wanted it".

I don't know why people are disbelieving that she has had 3 children in 4 years. The availability of good contraception in this country for the last 50 or so years is the reason most women don't have this experience.
But young, fertile married women without contraception will have a baby every year or two. That is basic biology.

And in war torn areas without good sanitation or infection control the majority of these babies die.

Whatever you think of SB or the legal issues, I think it is entirely plausible that the has had 3 children who have died.

I find this a sickening comparison

Why? Both young teenage girls, groomed by older men.

I find the people who give Shamima Begum more responsibility than others who were groomed sickening.

I'm not defending her actions, nor am I saying she should be brought back to the UK. But if she comes back by herself, I find the outcry utterly hypocritical.

Yeap, I agree it’s entirely plausible that she’s had 3 children who have all died as a result of her actions.sickening.

But that’s the point, in the country where she was married, legally she wasn’t a child. It couldn’t be more relevant.

“All the evidence is that she sought them out herself.”

Is it? Bearing in mind that’s what people tend to say about groomed children I’d need to see that evidence for myself......

She showed no remorse in the interviews. Was shocked that her citizenship was taken away and thought she was so important that SJ should have spoken to her personally before taking away her citizenship. How privileged does she think she is

Why do people think her plight and her child’s plight is more important than the truly innocents who have been caught up in this heinous war. How would those innocents have viewed the UK if this terrorist was somehow rescued using our British military. That action would have more outrage that the uk rescued a terrorist leaving innocents behind.

It is not the country where she was married that is so determined to whip themselves into a frenzy though is it?

It is the UK, in which Syrian laws are irrelevant.

She was raised here, not in Syria.

She should face the law in the UK, and be judged by it.

And once again, all people who join terrorist organisations have been radicalised. Who knows how young other terrorists have been when the process of indoctrination begins? Probably from birth in some cases. This wasn’t the case with Begum - she was older. And whatever the age- it does not remove responsibility from the perpetrator

“But that’s the point, in the country where she was married, legally she wasn’t a child. It couldn’t be more relevant.”
So, what about young British girls kidnapped and taken to India to be married? Is the age of consent not relevant in that situation either?

So what older man groomed her? She’d been in Syria on a stolen passport five minutes before she eagerly married a stranger.

She wasn’t kidnapped @Bertrand, she stole a passport to get there.

Amazing how much detailed information people seem to have about this case.

Why? Both young teenage girls, groomed by older men. I thought she was groomed by women.

She was raised here, not in Syria.

She was raised here by Bangladesh parents where many girls marry at 14. I'm not saying that her parents would want her to marry that young but to assume that she must have been groomed because she though 15 was an okay age to marry is naive to say the least.

I'm pretty sure it wouldn't have made any difference even if the UK had said she could come back in, it wouldn't have been immediate so he would have at this point, still been at that camp.

Information you could have too @Bertrand if you bothered to keep up with the news.

Tommy Robinson would love this thread and some of the replies on it.

Funnily enough he brushes aside facts which don't suit his agenda too.

Like instead of worrying about an IS fighter who isn't here and apparently won't be, getting angry enough to demand the proven male IS fighters who returned are convicted, jailed and after release monitored by the security services?

10% of the males who returned faced justice, which leaves almost 400 who didn't and aren't under scrutiny.

But nobody's yelling about them.

Why not?

I feel uneasy about Britain having stripped her of citizenship - it seemed like political posturing from Javid. It seemed very hasty - and based on what? Having joined a terrorist organisation? It was a very popular move though, polls show.

However it is NOT the responsibility of Britain to 'bring her back and try her' though. Why should they bring anyone back from former Islamic State who chose to go there?

Amazing how much detailed information people seem to have about this case. There's been extensive coverage in the press and on TV for years.

She should face the law in the UK, and be judged by it.

She may have committed crimes in Syria and this would be difficult for the UK to investigate, find witnesses etc.
It makes more sense for her to face the law where she is now.

So you at least admit she was groomed then derxa?

Because grooming is just that, you can't pick and choose who is innocent based on religion.

Either a child is groomed or they aren't.

There's been extensive coverage in the press and on TV for years

Not about the male fighters leaving and returning unnoticed.

Amazing how much detailed information people seem to have about this case.

It's called reading the news. You didn't even appear to realise that there is no British consular presence in Syria when that has been in the public domain for a long time. And mentioned countless times on this very thread!