The people of Swindon: do they regret voting for Brexit?

[EddyF]

With the closure of Honda - closing their Swindon plant, with the loss of 3,500 jobs, which the firm has attributed to Brexit, I wonder if the people of Swindon are having regrets since they were from the leave camp.

Reminds me of those who voted for Trump knowing his policies were targeted at them but felt they somehow were exempt. Like the Mexican man and his US wife voting for Trump then crying on the news he had been deported/couldn't get back in when he was out of the country.

I'm finding it really difficult sympathising with those who voted to leave by not looking at their own circumstances, but rather, other people. Majority of the people I have heard from who voted leave (from fb, and so on) they only cared about immigration. They thought leaving meant a 'clear up' taking hardly into account their own future and that of their children.

I'm sorry to the people in Swindon, but they did it to themselves.

And before people say "there wasn't enough information" there was enough to determine that we did not know what the 'deal' was.

I can't link article for Honda but it's everywhere on news sites.

No doubt some businesses will be affected by Brexit, I don’t think anyone is denying that, we are having a big shift. But I suspect that many more who will have had these issues anyway will be hiding behind the Brexit bad news mantra

I agree

Or put another way - “This is not a Brexit issue for us...” states Honda who state they made the decision to move out the UK was related to international trade conditions.

So nothing at all to do with Brexit then, oh no...

It’s basically a Perfect Storm!

Undoubtedly there would be hard times for the UK car industry ahead but Brexit has made it so much harder and the outcome will probably be that it is going to be decimated.

What makes things different this time, is that we are essentially isolating ourselves at the same time.

So other types of investment - highly skilled jobs, exciting new industries will not come to Britain in the future.

Honda gave Swindon a number of years of prosperity. What next? What can we replace it with?

I feel for almost every single person in UK - apart from them shouting NO DEAL at the top of their voices drowning out any reasonable arguments.

This isn't fair not everyone who works at Honda will have voted to leave

Honda has stated that it will close the Swindon plant whilst in Turkey it will cease manufacturing current Civic sedan model in 2021 and intends to continue its business operations. Whatever that means.

So nothing at all to do with Brexit then, oh no...

Its a lot further down the list than all those jumping with glee like to make out, the new trade deal eliminating auto tariffs between Japan and Europe. Trump's trade war with the EU and the terrible conditions in the motor industry have been cited by them themselves before they mention Brexit. There has been rumblings about Swindon since 2008.

Although i still wonder if it will actually end up going through. A lot can change in 4 years and we will then have the opposite side using it for political gain.

There are going to be issues with car manufacturers anyway, as there is a decline in diesel production. However, the manufacturers are still going to make cars because people are still going to buy cars - they are just going to go more to electric or petrol.

It is Brexit related to an extent. The rest is down to the EU. The EU were not stupid - they agreed a deal with Japan for car exports and imports. Japan can now import to the EU, I believe, tariff free.

There is no deal for the UK yet. There is no reason for the Japanese car makers to have bases in the UK to be within the EU, when the UK does not have any form of trade deal and Japan now does. Car makers, like most businesses, will plan for the years ahead and without any plan for what Brexit will be, they cannot plan so it is easier to just ramp up production in Japan and move back than take a punt on the UK.

I know people, through family, who work at the Honda plant, but who voted leave. I am expecting the attitude will be like some of those after the Nissan news - 'project fear' / 'nothing to do with Brexit'.

'who state they made the decision to move out the UK was related to international trade conditions'

And international trade conditions are related to...

Begins with a B...

Come on. You can do it...

This article is from October 2015 - but even so - I don't think there is much of a market for Honda cars in the EU...

Last year, Honda sold about 4.5m vehicles across the globe. However, just 150,000 of those found homes in Europe

More remarkably, Honda bosses estimate that, of the 150,000 European Honda sales, as many as 60,000 units are sold in the UK

Honda’s fall from grace — or failure to gain traction — in Europe is one of the car industry’s biggest mysteries

www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/honda-plans-five-new-models-european-fightback-bid

Skirmisher - oh dear oh dear oh dear. Part of Brexit relates to trade conditions but the international trade conditions (and I know remainders have a hard time comprehending the international world outside the EU - but go on give it a try, a really hard try) relate to what is happening globally. Now if it was to do with the Fact that Japan wanted to have access to the EU wouldn’t it have made sense to see production moved to the EU???? Instead production will move back to japan a country with which the EU has negotiated to have a 0% tariff on auto trade. So where is the incentive for Japan to keep building in the EU. A trading, employment, policital anc social structure over which it had no control!!!

Therefore I think it is most probable that Honda would move out of any EU country!

There is obviously a domestic push in Japan to bring as much trade/manufacturing home as possible rather than spread around the world in various trade blocs. Which for the above reason totally makes sense.

@deadbudgie it would cost a hell of a lot of money to build s new plant in the EU. And the cost may not be justified due to the Free Trade Agreement but a plant that already exists in the EU..........

Oh no wait, they is a high probability of import taxes for cars built in UK meaning it is cheaper to build the cars in Japan and ship them across.

Random the company itself has stated that the decision has nothing to do with Brexit - so unless you know more about the commercial strategy of Honda than its CEO I’m not sure where you are coming from. Mind you as a remainer you know better than everyone else so...,,

Rufus
Though i do think its interesting that when people were complaining about us being part of the EU that nobody was telling them if they didnt like it they should leave the country

\ this.

Whether Brexit was the overriding force for this decision or not I think we may be able to agree that in the political climate we are in now the Honda job losses are catastrophic because it's virtually guaranteed there will not be business investment to replace those jobs for some time. I would be willing to bet that would absolutely be because of Brexit.

Can anyone else see "blame Brexit" become the new "blame the EU"? soon? Except this time there will be F all that can be done about it.

I feel so sad for the families concerned and think unfortunately it's probably only the tip of the iceberg.

'who state they made the decision to move out the UK was related to international trade conditions'

And international trade conditions are related to...

Begins with a B...

Come on. You can do it...

Play the counter-factual. Imagine Honda came out and said "It's because of Brexit" and all the Brexiteers cried "they're just blaming it on Brexit because it's easy, look at the EU-Japan FTA / electric cars / etc". What would your response be? I'd put money on it being some variant of "can't trust them experts can we?"

Understand that you're just as ideological as any arch Brexiteer and will dismiss anything that doesn't support your narrative.

Come on you can do it..

What would your response be?

To say that Honda's decision is multifactorial including changes in the European car market, the EU-Japan trade deal, and the uncertainty around Brexit.

@deadbudgie I do believe any CEO will make a calculated statement based on business interests.

What statement will have the least impact on sales in the UK market?

Whether Brexit was the overriding force for this decision or not I think we may be able to agree that in the political climate we are in now the Honda job losses are catastrophic because it's virtually guaranteed there will not be business investment to replace those jobs for some time. I would be willing to bet that would absolutely be because of Brexit.

^^
this.

Yes, I also thought that was a very good point.

No doubt next week there'll be another announcement from another manufacturing company making an absolutely un-Brexit related withdrawal from the UK.

I blame Corbyn. He has done nothing to protect the rights of British workers and has instead chosen to use Brexit as an opportunity to force a general election rather than oppose Brexit and call for a second referendum.

I still don't understand why people are sayong Honda would lie about why they are closing it?
Or why they are closing the Turkey plant if it is secretly about brexit

It's multifactorial. They'll emphasise some aspects and omit others to avoid getting dragged into a toxic political mess playing out a governmental level. I wouldn't be surprised if they don't discuss the impact of the EU-Japan trade deal either. That's intergovernmental politics and they know they'd be wise not to comment on that.

And Pernille Rudlin makes the following points:

Arguing about whether Honda decision is or isn't to do with Brexit is pointless. 1. Such decisions are always multi factor. 2. Companies will give the reason most palatable to govts, employees, shareholders 3. Being part of a wider network like 🇪🇺 wd have made 🇬🇧 more resilient.

I am Swindon resident.
I voted remain.

I am gutted that Honda is going, and think it will tear the heart out of the town.
We all know someone who works for Honda, so many people will be effected.
This is a working town, there are loads of skilled manual workers that work at Honda, in a long tradition of skilled manual workers that used to work at the railway works. The new jobs coming to Swindon are all office, white collar jobs, there is nothing for the manufacturing sector.

BUT and it is a big BUT, the Honda plant has been working at 50% for a while, and there have been times of short week /no overtime working etc over the last few years. It has felt for a while as if Honda is here on borrowed time.

I do think Brexit is the last straw, and the company is worried about getting their fingers burnt.

Re Jeremy Corbyn not protecting the rights of workers, he’s not in government is he ?