To wonder if changes in parenting approaches have affected MH on a population level

[SquiddyMcSquidford]

Not a TAAT as such but inspired by this one about how hard life was in the past
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3510138-AIBU-to-wonder-how-some-people-coped-in-former-times

A lot of people have talked about how parenting was much less hands on then, that parents provided food and shelter and that was all. Nowadays things are very different for most families in the UK and yet we hear a lot about children, adolescents and young adults experiencing MH problems in greater numbers than previously. Does this imply it's actually better not to parent in a hands on way? Or is it solely due to other factors like better recognition of MH issues, lack of community spirit, pressure/competitiveness over academic achievement/jobs?

Obviously it's multifactorial but I'm interested to hear what others think about this.

badgers I have read a lot of young adults with high anxiety say it was caused by helicoptering parenting.

My DM went in over bullying, because it was so bad I was refusing to go to school. She and my teacher agreed it was happening because I was weird, and I just needed to fit in better so it would stop happening.

Can't imagine that happening today.

It does. I was told by my DD's headteacher that the only reason all the other children bullied her was because she kept trying to play with them and if she just left all the other kids alone then she'd be fine.

God ^^ reminds me I had a similar encounter with a primary teacher apparently Dd didn't really help herself and was a little bit peculiar so yeah it was all her fault she was being picked on.

That's really interesting what you've said, my professional/personal background is MH also and I've never heard ACE used before.

That surprises me if you have any background in trauma informed MH. In fact even if you don't I'm a bit astonished. They're everywhere at the moment.

But the OP is not talking about, or at least I didn't read it is the extreme end of parenting which becomes domineering, controling and suffocating. That is a form of abuse and not the everyday change in attitudes that the OP seems to be discussing.

I don't and have never worked with children

@reetgood I don't think helicopter parenting necessarily is to blame, my OP was just there to start the discussion

I think that parents mental health and behaviour definitely has a detrimental effect on their children. Anxiety especially can cause children to become anxious. I have seen many children whose mothers are anxious be anxious themselves. It's a learnt behaviour.

Barton It's worth a look at ACEs even if you're working with adults.

Here is a very small but of info but Google has lots more. www.healthscotland.scot/population-groups/children/adverse-childhood-experiences-aces/overview-of-aces

Thank you it is definitely something that I have heard much anecdotal evidence for from people who have diagnoses/direct correlation to manifestation of issues. I'm really pleased that it has become an "acknowledged thing"

Always glad to share

There definitely seems to be much more awareness of the impact of childhood trauma now, something I think a lot of people working in the area already knew really. The ACEs can be a bit of a blunt instrument in many ways, but is definitely a good start.

I'm shocked & saddened to read that children are still being blamed for being bullied .

This

I had very hands off parents, I mum left the family home when I was nearly 2 and my dad was very busy/preoccupied. It had pros and cons obviously. I was very happy to travel the world alone in my teens and was independent financially from a young age. I felt a sense of adventure throughout.
However I had quite a few near misses with dangerous situations and because I wasn't ever observed I shudder at the situations I was in.
As a mum now I want to be that maternal figure giving my daughter all of the cosy, happy and gentle experiences I felt my childhood lacked.
I also feel (having worked in nursery schools) that children who are placed in nurseries for most of their early years are too peer orientated and this impacts very negatively upon their maturation process as they move into their teens.
I'm now a primary school teacher and can see a wave of children coming through who lack speaking skills probably because parents have been sat behind screens when they should have been present and engaged with developing their child's speaking skills.

Have you seen the ACES film Biglybadgers

I think chronic levels of loneliness is the biggest factor at play that we did not see to this degree one or two generations ago.

I think things are differently hard and differently dangerous for our kids' generation compared to ours. I think the most salient factor is an online culture that is constantly evolving and that we're a bit ignorant of - it's the virtual equivalent of playing out with no supervision. Predators and bullies will find a way to get to children and it's now in the online sphere, where the ground shifts so quickly that parents struggle to keep up with how to keep kids safe.

I think it’s a combination of better identification of MH and a very perverted approach taken by schools (which I remember from my childhood) of sanctifying and validating emotions. I appreciate that the aim was to help children deal with their emotions but all it did was raise a generation who think their feelings are of primary importance and now they’re having kids. God help them.

I think most parents these days are waaaay over the top with their children. Everything is so intense. And if you don’t follow every guidelines known to man: breastfeeding for a year, having your baby in your room, read facing in an approved car seat until 3/4, limited screen time, a perfectly balanced diet feee from preservatives colour etc. I mean the list goes on and on. That it somehow means you “don’t care”, aren’t as good, or have “detachment issues “ (like some idiot on MH accused me of having). It’s a high pressure, high judgment game out there for parents now!! And it is NOT doing our kids any favours.

My personal feelings are that the pendulum has swung too far in the opposite direction. Many children have few behavioural boundaries and their opportunities to build self reliance and independence are severely contained - we are seeing this already with the so called "snowflake generation" and it is only going to get worse.

It was sheer bedlam in my local Sainsbury's this afternoon with children running around and shrieking. No parent said anything - I'd never have got away with such behaviour in the 1970s and my own children in the 1990s wouldn't have done it. There were places where rowdy behaviour was OK and supermarkets were not that place.

That is a good point

The children of egotistical parents whose own feelings have always been paramount, may experience a less intense parenting approach, in some cases this might mean neglectful but in others might build resentment but necessary self reliance

It was sheer bedlam in my local Sainsbury's this afternoon with children running around and shrieking. No parent said anything - I'd never have got away with such behaviour in the 1970s and my own children in the 1990s wouldn't have done it. There were places where rowdy behaviour was OK and supermarkets were not that place.

I don't understand why parents think this is ok behaviour

@Nothinglefttochoose you make a valid point. Certainly there is a lot of judgement and if you read certain sources of advice/info (especially, IME, attachment parenting based ones) there is a sense that "messing up" whilst your children are young will mess them up for life.

But at the same time, I don't think the cars of very young children was outsourced nearly as much in previous generations, at least not in the 60s/70s/80s - I'm talking about babies being in nurseries for 50 hours a week from under a year old. That could tie in with some kids being too peer-orientated as @Bumbalaya* mentions.

• I realise that makes me sound like one of the judgy attachment parenting people!

I guess what we need is balance, and we don't have it now, nor did we have it in the past.

care not cars!

And by messing up whilst they're young I mean things like letting 3 year olds watch lots of telly, not breastfeeding etc.. Not what most would call major problems but very condemned by some.

My childhood wasn’t fun. My brother lived in the same household but it was worlds apart. He was my narcissistic mothers golden child, violent bully to me. My father gave him everything he would have wanted as a child with not one thought to the power that wielded over me. Those things were extras to Christmas and birthday presents and amazing. Big things. Stuff I wanted too but had to beg my brother and demean myself to use.

My parents punished with hitting sometimes pretty violent eg hand print bruises (I was too “good” to ever be hit that hard) so it was an all round scary childhood. I had no concept of unconditional love as an adult. I hate hitting. My brother thinks it’s fine. But he’s still violent with me.

I also wasn’t allowed to go off alone so was trapped. I hid in my bedroom a lot. But that was not a sanctuary. I didn’t enjoy doing things with my mother as it was very parent led. My parents didn’t come into my world. I was expected to move in theirs. I did this badly.

When I was about 16/17 I became aware of childline - I think it had recently been launched and I remember thinking I wish I were younger so I could phone the number.

I am sure there are still plenty of households still similar to mine. Overall parents are more attentive and less violent then mine these days thank goodness. My mental health has improved loads but I am easily destabilised.

I do think children given too many choices and few or no boundaries is also destabilising and anxiety inducing.

My friend is in his 80’s and tells of a wonderful carefree childhood. Of going off exploring every day. He had caring and loving parents. Therefore I think whatever the era and societal values, parenting style is key.

These days parents talk and have wonderful resources, which is why I think in general there are possibly more parents, who are in tune with their children’s needs than in the past.

I did read somewhere that up until a couple of hundred years ago the emotional needs of children wasn’t really considered at all. That does make sense as children were expected to work throughout history and school up to the age of 10 only became mandatory in 1880.

We don't let our children feel their feelings. Parents micromanage so much of their kids life that they don't get to experience things and work out how to cope. Then when something happens parents can't fix children don't have the coping mechanisms and this damages mental health. A tiny example. Parents buy 3 identical teddies incase child's bedtime teddy goes missing they can pull out a replacement. But actually losing that special toy at bedtime can help a child to experience the feeling and with parental guidance work out how to deal with it. Then They can deal with similar bigger or smaller problems.
There's loads of examples of parents mitigating painful emotions from interfering with friendships or getting overly critical of school issues.
It's totally understandable as no one wants their kids to be upset but I really think feeling and experiencing the little things helps people learn to cope with the bigger things.