Anyone leaving Labour party with Chuka and his mates?

[longwayoff]

I am seriously worried. Politics across the West is an utter mess - thanks Putin, nice work - and I can't see that this will help. It will split the left vote and right-wing ideology will continue stomping its way to more power. We are asterisked all ways from hell to breakfast.

Only about 37% ish consistently vote Tory. Assume some of those are soft, left of centre Tories.

All the lib den votes 20% (ish) are left of centre and the majority of labour voters are centre left.

Most voters in the U.K. want a soft, left of centre party.

The two main parties are held to ransom by the extremes of their party.

FPTP has a lot to answer for. The views of the British public are consistently not represented by our electoral system.

Bowchica

I'm really glad you're still on this thread. Can you tell me why you referred to Tony Blair in your earlier response to me, please?

@LakieLady Well what you're doing now ain't working, is it? You're the most ineffective opposition against the most sitting duck PM and Government in living memory and you're getting nowhere!

Absolutely the electorate’s fault when they consistently vote in the Tories!

I can't believe someone honestly typed this unironically.

@Just Oh I think you can!

Most voters in the U.K. want a soft, left of centre party.

Left socially, center right economically (which the lib dems and last labour government where)

Its the arrogance isn't it. Somehow appealing to voters is below the Magic Grandad.

Justanotherlurker Nor can I. As both a voter, former Labour Party member and committed Trade Unionist, comments like that, and do many others I have seen over many months just makes me want to weep. The Labour Party will never, ever be a credible party of government when so many are so content to associate it's name with views like that.

If I was Corbyn, now would be the time to fully back the PV campaign it would essentially render the 7 useless.

A PP hoped the breakaway group would back sex based rights of women and not gender, unlikely as any deviation from the current viewpoint will be cast as intolerance.

I dont see how they can claim to be against the new 'direction' of the LP but still be happy to stand on their current Labour ticket so doesnt seem to be about their 'values' but about making more anti Corbyn noise so it gets a meh off me

If there starts to be a run on Tory MP's joining them then I will start to take notice but if more blairite MP's, and I use that term this time as a descriptor not an insult, join up then in my mind this will just be Chicken Coup 2 - Chukka's Revenge

I had no idea that David Icke had stolen his view of the world from Douglas Adams.

Blair and the social democrats in the labour party won 3 elections - that's what will win against the Tories in this country. Socialism won't win. Anyone who thinks New Labour were as bad as the Tories obviously isn't one of the people affected by benefit cuts, local authority cuts etc. As trust me things are alot worse for alot of people now than they were up to 2010.
Corbyn has lost one election - he will lose the next one if he or his gang are still leaders at the time. There's no point berating the electorate for not seeing the light 're JC - unless something more moderate is presented to the uk electorate then the Tories will keep on winning.

If I was Corbyn, now would be the time to fully back the PV campaign it would essentially render the 7 useless

He's not that intelligent.

An intelligent opposition leader should have come out right from day one and said "we're going to represent the 48%" as then they could legitimately claim to be a party of opposition. There would have been an absolute choice at the snap election and either Theresa May would have got the result she wanted - a proper mandate to carry through the referendum result or Labour would have won and been able to stop Brexit. Or you'd have had a real hung Parliament forcing parties to properly work together.

Either way - we'd not be where we are now. Cameron is the architect but both May and Corbyn are the engineers, but in different ways, of the current shit show which NO ONE is happy with. Even Farage said he wanted a deal rather than no deal!

unless something more moderate is presented to the uk electorate then the Tories will keep on winning

It was in Ed Milliband, he lost

And? so did corbyn against the worst tory election campaign I have ever seen, the Tories won't do that again.

An intelligent opposition leader should have come out right from day one and said "we're going to represent the 48%" as then they could legitimately claim to be a party of opposition

If the LP had come out as pro PV straight away the narrative would have been framed as 'Corbyn is trying to deny the people their will' he had to float the fence although I do agree he's floating for a bit too long tbh

Just Absolutely no irony. I have watched with frustration many times the electorate vote in a party who screwed over the miners, the elderly, the state educated, disabled people. They are given an opportunity to vote in a party who want a fairer society and choose self interest.

If there starts to be a run on Tory MP's joining them then I will start to take notice

This is what I really hope happens now but being a Tory seems to be even more of a religion cult, so sadly I don’t think it is going to happen.

There is also the huge problem of maybe agreeing on Brexit, but on nothing else.

Am willing them on though.

It was in Ed Milliband, he lost

And as I said earlier, that was because he was ineffectual and spent ages dithering for years after he won the leadership to actually decide policies. When pressed he kept saying "lots of time until the next election". NO. People need to know what the leaders of our parties and the parties themselves stand for. He should KNOW what he stands for, not take two years to make up his mind.

People loathed Thatcher. But even if you loathed her, you knew what she stood for and was decisive. People want their leaders to be seen to be very clear on their policies while being prepared to listen and change them if required.

Indeed the members of the Labour party may support the current direction, the electorate not so much.

@LakieLady Any Labour member can propose a motion for consideration at conference and, if it has the support of the local party, it stands a good chance of being debated

Yep, debated, even be adopted by conference as policy. Then ignored by the leadership. Well worth joining then.

@JustAnotherPoster Quite possibly. But there would have been an absolute choice and clear opposition to the Government of the day.

The only reason people stick with Labour is because they consider them a better alternative to the Tories. In fact, they are the only alternative to the Tories

This is a terrible indictment of Labour though, isn't it?

The Tories are utterly incompetent, imploding in front of our eyes, utterly divided, and he still isn't ahead in the polls. An election victory is being handed on a plate to him and he can't grab it as he is viewed as so utterly awful by so many, and with good reason.

He's terrible! He's failing badly! I just can't understand why anyone is still backing him.

lakie but what are people supposed to do when the leadership won't follow through on agreed policy at conference?

Propose a censure motion.

Well I was never in the Labour party in the first place but totally support the idea of a centrist party. I would never in a million years vote for Comrade Corbyn and his shower of numpties.

I would vote for Chuka Umuna. Or Yvette Cooper. Or Luciana Bergman. If they want to form a new party they better get their skates on though.

This is what I really hope happens now but being a Tory seems to be even more of a religion cult, so sadly I don’t think it is going to happen.

There’s something in that, but the difference between the cult of Toryism and the cult of Corbyn is that the Tories don’t have a vile army of bullies flooding local parties and spewing bile online.

Labour used to tolerate and listen to dissent. Not now. It’s a playground for extremist shouty types, not sensible grown ups.