To be feeling so hurt by my parents?

[OneThingOffTheList]

There's a backstory to this which is a lifetime long so I'll summarise as best I can.

My mum is a manipulative person and has always been emotionally abusive to me. I'm one of her 5 children and she has a bad relationship with all of us. You could say my dad is her enabler, but he is actually a lovely person who has made some questionable choices (such as standing by her) but I believe a lot of that is down to the abuse he's suffered from her over the years.

I could give you a long list of things she has done to me over the years which would shock you but I'll not go into all that right now as I don't want to drag this out.

Basically, things came to a head this summer. It was my sister's wedding weekend. I like in the south of England and I flew up alone with my 2 young children. When I arrived, my mum had set the bedrooms up differently to how she normally would. She had put the cot up in the room that my older DD was going to be sleeping in. My younger DD is a nightmare at sharing a room, every time we've tried, she's take literally hours to go to sleep. My eldest is also a very early riser so I knew she would wake early and then wake my younger DD. I explained to my mum and asked if I could just put the cot in the room with me (there was plenty of space). My mum hit the roof about how ungrateful I am and that his her house and I should be thanking them to putting us up, not complaining. The upshot was that I wasn't allowed to move the cot. That night went exactly as I'd expected. The kids didn't go to sleep until almost 10pm (normal bedtime 7.30) and we're both up before 6am. I had 2 vile kids the next day. They were completely and utterly exhausted and every small thing became a huge challenge. The next day my sister arrived and would be sleeping in the room next to my girls room and the following morning was her wedding day. I was so worried that the kids would wake her up in the morning. My older DD has a grow clock so if she's in a room on her own, she wouldnt get up before 7am and youngest DD is a great sleeper so I knew she'd sleep a full 12 hours at least if sharing with me. I was also concerned that on the wedding day they would both be exhausted, grumpy and uncooperative. I was bridesmaid and so I really needed them to be on good form for the wedding.

I called my DH in tears because the whole situation was becoming so stressful. He told me to tell my mum that if she wouldn't just allow me to move the cot, then I would be booking a hotel for the evening. She once again went ballistic at me, calling me names and saying I was blackmailing her. I categorically wasn't. I was telling her the truth. I wasn't going to stay there another night under those circumstances. My mum said to me that I just want everything to revolve around me and that I was obviously trying to ruin my sister's wedding weekend because I was jealous of her. She said a lot of very hurtful things.

Eventually they let me move the cot and, lo and behold, the girls slept amazingly that night. As did my sister and I. The wedding all went smoothly so i was very relieved.

After that though, I came to the decision I couldn't stay at their house on future visits to Scotland. Stuff like this happens every time but I believe my mum was worse because my husband wasn't there with me. I was more vulnerable.

Anyway, things turned really sour when I said I wasn't going to stay with them on our next trip and lots more was said. At one point my mum actually called me a rat infront of my 5 year old DD.

I stayed with my lovely brother and his wife and had a lovely trip. I only saw my mum once and she spent the whole time having my eldest on her lap, sort of whispering into her ear so possibly bad mouthing me.

Anyway, we're heading back up to Scotland in a couple of months and I received a text from my dad saying to remember we're very welcome to stay with them when we visit. I sent a very nice reply, thanking him but explaining that a lot had been said & done which I'm sure he understood, and I thought it would be best to stay elsewhere but spend a lot of time with him and my mum and that we should just take things one step at a time and that I was really looking forward to seeing them.

I then posted on our family WhatsApp group to give them the dates we'd be visiting and asking them to let us know when they're free.

I received a message from my dad (written by my mum) which basically mirrored the message I had sent to my dad saying "these arrangements aren't good for us, I'm sure you'll understand. A lot has been said and done and I think it's best if we visit you at DB & SILs house". So basically I'm not allowed to go to their house when we visit. My D.C. haven't seen their grandparents for 8 months and probably won't see them again until the end of the year. I didn't want to drag the kids into this. DD absolutely loves "grandad garden" and has been talking lots about going there and now I have to tell her we can't go.

AIBU to be upset by this? Am I dealing with this the wrong way? I just feel so lost.

radishingravish did people say he wasn’t lovely? He’s her Dad, whatever is going on with him, he needs to do the right thing by his kids, or he isn’t a lovely Dad at the very least.

radishingravish
OP's Dad may be the victim of abuse; he is also enabling an abuser. Thats not lovely behaviour, and its not victim blaming to point it out.

OP Seriously you need to woman up
Do you really want your daughters to see their mother as a snivelling wreck who pleads with her own mother to move a cot?!
You sound like you have no idea how fearful it is dealing with someone who has taught you to do as they say since you were tiny. Unless you have grown up to be like them you revert to that scared child. If it was that easy OP wouldn't be posting here.

Oxytocindeficient A lot of people said he was not lovely. And I am not saying he is in the right, he is definitely not. But if he is an emotionally abusive relationship it is not his 'fault', and I do not think it is right to victim blame. The abuser is always the one in the wrong, no matter what type of abuse it is. And he would have had this emotionally abusive relationship a long time before his parental relationship, so it will have had a large impact on his mental health. Just because he isn't acting lovely, does not mean he isn't a lovely person. That being said it is difficult to help people who do not want to be helped and I think OP needs to put herself and her children first so needs to distance herself from the situation. And if her dad ever does get away from the situation himself she can be there for him then, and forgive him for the things he did under the mum's control. But right now, for her sake, she needs to get away from them both.

No matter how 'lovely' your DF is, he is standing by and letting your DM treat you appallingly. I have something similar, although nowhere near as bad, with my parents - albeit the other way around. DF is a narcissist, doesn't give two hoots about anyone other than himself. Doesn't bother with my DC, didn't expect him to as he never bothered with me and my DSis as children. Expects to be waited on by DM, who has always willingly obliged. He's never apologised for any mistake he's made, or anything he's said or done that was mean. Whenever we have had a fall out my DM tries to get me to apologise to him for 'upsetting him'. He stopped talking to me once (he'd put 4 year old DS in a dangerous situation and I called him out on it), so DM sided with him and they didn't see the DC for a while (we only live 30 mins drive away so she could have come alone). I hold DM just as responsible as DF as she has enabled him to behave badly over the years. He'll behave like a vicious brat, storm out of the house, and DM will sigh, shake her head at me and dutifully follow him out.

userschmoozer yes you are right, if he is not getting emotionally abused himself then he is just an enabler. But I don't think the OP said anything particular about her mum and dad's relationship (unless I missed it), but to me it read like he was in an abusive relationship and going after him seemed like to be blaming the victim. But if he is not being abused then I am wrong.

I hate to tell you this, but you will only ever make progress when you 100% stop caring. My life is bliss, my lifelong severe depression has all but vanished since I stopped caring, really,m deep down stopped giving a shit, about my father's feelings (he;s the equivalent in our family of your mother. Bullying, emotionally manipulative, enabled by everyone, casts crazy rules like your cot rule then explodes when they are not met.)
Just read up as much as you can on being the child of narcissistic parents. It's not what people think. It;s not just me me me, it's having been raised to believe you don;t exist, your feelings don;t matter, your needs don;t count, you should be eternally grateful to be allowed to serve every whim of the Great One etc. Bet it;s familiar to you.

Be breezy with them I now talk to my dad in tones as if he were a difficult client. Never let him get close, and my own personal rule is neither me nor my DC will ever sleep the night in his house becuase overnights are power games.

Plan your holiday taking into account exactly what YOU want to do, Contact your dad and say it would be great to see them, you are free on x dates, but if they are not, not to worry, xxx. Then do what you want. Honestly, my DC really haven't suffered from having my father kept at arm's length.

Your dads as bad as your mum just in a different way. Sorry to say.

If you can accept that (not easy) then I think you will find it easier to step away from the situation.

I don't think it's fair to say the dad is just as bad, they are both victims of abuse so he's probably seriously mentally ill. But OP, you as a victim cannot put your mental well-being at risk to save him. He definitely needs help but you aren't out of the woods yet. You aren't strong enough and you shouldn't have to be, healing takes time.

It is ok to walk away, you have done nothing wrong and it is admirable that you have tried for so long. You can't fix another person until you have fixed yourself. You should not feel guilty for escaping and putting your family first, I know it's very hard to leave someone in an abusive situation but he will not leave unless he decides he wants to.

I think you gave an appropriate response, OP.

I think "D"M will thrive on drama, so don't give her any. It is sad that you and your children can't have the relationship that you want with DF, but that is the reality of HIS choices, and I think you will have to accept that this is the way it is.

If this doesn't sound patronising, have you thought about counselling? Because this situation sounds incredibly stressful and there will probably be some grieving for what you wish you had in terms of family relationships.

I think the only person who will put you and your children first is you!
Meet in public, if she gets too 'cuddly' with your daughter, sit with her/take her to the loo etc/ basically making sure she can't whisper sweet nothings.
Be positive, share nothing and put your family first.

I’m sorry you’ve had such a dificult time with your mother. She has conditioned you into a certain way of thinking and behaving. The thing that struck me was the dynamic before the wedding. I wouldn’t have asked about moving the cot in a similar situation- I’d have just done it. The fact that you felt like you needed permission is quite telling.

@Onethingoffthelist I have been and go through exactly the same sort of treatment only it’s my father that does it and mother is the enabler. I believe personally it’s about control. My DF can be one hell of a nasty piece of work if he doesn’t get his way (which he doesn’t anymore) I’ve never been able to understand how someone can behave this way. Every time you remove something from your life he was controlling he will be absolutely evil. He actually stopped speaking to me for 18 months once because I announced I was planning on leaving home. During that 18 months I celebrated my 21st Birthday, got engaged and married all with no kind word or comment from him.

He would completely disrespect my wishes at all times regarding my DD ie asked my DP specifically not to take my DDto my grandparents house without my supervision. I turn up to collect her and they are just pulling up in the car from visiting my grandparents.

When my DM agreed to care for DD pet rabbit while we went on a hard saved for holiday, the day befor we were due to go DF decided they couldn’t have the rabbit as DP would now also be having a holiday. I spent all of that day riding round trying to get somewhere to board the rabbit. It doesn’t sound much but it’s always calculated to make life as difficult as possible.

I’m now divorced as I rushed to leave home and marry to escape DF behaviour. The first year I left they invited EXh to Christmas dinner, I spent it alone. Apparently it is none of my business who they invite to dinner.

Now DF is having cancer treatment, I offered to assist with trips to the hospital and am not needed every day, I found out that the reason they don’t need my help is EXH is taking them. Bear in mind this is the man who emotionally and physically abused me during our marriage!

Everything is done to deliberately hurt, inconvenience and wound me. I honestly think it’s because he’s a bully and control freak. Same as you there’s so many instances of this sort of behaviour. What I can say it is them not you and you will never be able to reason with them.

I have PILs like this. FIL is an abusive nightmare and MIL is lovely, but a doormat who won't consider leaving him. And yes, you could also call her an enabler, given that she didn't remove/protect her children from emotional abuse. You could equally truthfully call her a victim.

I love her and feel sorry for her. But at the end of the day, she is and was an adult who has options. She has been offered help and support to leave, and has made her own choices. Her kids didn't have those choices.

It's a lot easier to see clearly when it's not the family you grew up in.

Now her grandkids see much less of her because we refuse to see FIL. She sometimes visits us. Our kids haven't seen Nannie's garden, which they loved, for years... so the OP's situation really resonates with me.

It's not an ideal situation. Our kids deserve more. But it's better than any of the alternatives.

The OP has to draw a line in the sand and protect her kids (and herself) from her toxic mother. There is still the option to maintain a relationship with her father. If he refuses to take that opportunity then that's very sad for everyone, but he's a grown-up and he has chosen his priorities. This is harsh, but true.

OP I haven't been able to read through all of these messages, but I see and have regularly experienced the type of emotional abuse you have endured. Sadly I don't have a dad, he died when I was very young, so I can't speak for that part.
I've undergone counseling and training myself to learn how to manage situations. I've learned to mitigate contact, and only visit her for a couple of hours, never overnight, and never without my HTB.

She has what is called narcissistic mother. There are many studies and many children (now adults) that have gone through this. I read a book called "Will I Ever Be Good Enough?: Healing the Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers". It really helped me come to terms and helped me compartmentalize her. Do what makes you, your DH and your DC happy. Your happiness is in your hands, no one else's. Good luck, and I'm sorry this is happening you. You seem like a lovely person

I'm so sorry, OP.

But have you really lost much at all? Your dad can see the DC when you go to your DB and SIL's house.

You didn't want to stay at your parents house anyway, so that's OK.

You live a long way away so thankfully they cannot be day-to-day grandparents anyway.

Your dad was "the best bit" of your frankly miserable-sounding childhood. It hurts you to see that he won't be "the best bit" of your DC's memories.

But thank God for that! You and your DH will give them all the best bits. Thankfully for you, your DC are not reliant on your dad to have a wonderful, loving childhood. He was the only chance YOU had, but he's not the only chance your children have.

Keep going with the limited, grey rock contact. Reach out to your dad only to the extent he reaches out to you. Ignore your mother as much as is possible.

YANBU, and your mother sounds like seriously hard work.

Bluelady Your comments are foul. Who says "truth hurts" to a person who has suffered lifelong abuse by a parent?

OP, I am so sorry you're having to deal with this. I would consider LC/NC with your parents. I know you feel you have to somehow protect your dad but you can't, he's chosen his path. Your mother is toxic and jealous, don't give her any more of your time. Your children will be better off not having her in their lives frankly

I honestly can't thank you all enough for your words of wisdom & support. Much though a huge part of me despises my mum for what she's put me through, there is also a part of me that has sought her approval since I was small and continues to do so. She's always had an opinion on anything I do which makes it hard for me to learn to know my own mind. Hopefully that's something I will figure out as time goes on. Thanks again everyone. I'll really be taking your advice on board.

All posters saying dad is at fault are being unreasonable
He is in an abusive relationship with his wife. He can't even call his daughter on her birthday or see his grandchildren.

If this was the husband treating the wife this way everyone would be on the wife's side.

If this was the husband treating the wife this way everyone would be on the wife's side.

I've often thought this way and, on the rare occasion that I've confided in someone about my childhood, I've always asked them to imagine the roles were reversed. Just because my dad's the man in the relationship shouldn't be a reason for him to be punished. He's very soft natures whereas my mum is extremely domineering.

Yes if you can let go of the approval thing and just see them as they are that helps.

I actually find for some reason thinking of them by their first names helps a lot. Rather than mum / dad / grandparents.

The dads can go along with it though, letting their children suffer, it's wrong. My dad never stepped in, when i was young and it is not right really. They are also parents, and shouldn't let that happen. They are also adults and free to leave, not children.