To be feeling so hurt by my parents?

[OneThingOffTheList]

There's a backstory to this which is a lifetime long so I'll summarise as best I can.

My mum is a manipulative person and has always been emotionally abusive to me. I'm one of her 5 children and she has a bad relationship with all of us. You could say my dad is her enabler, but he is actually a lovely person who has made some questionable choices (such as standing by her) but I believe a lot of that is down to the abuse he's suffered from her over the years.

I could give you a long list of things she has done to me over the years which would shock you but I'll not go into all that right now as I don't want to drag this out.

Basically, things came to a head this summer. It was my sister's wedding weekend. I like in the south of England and I flew up alone with my 2 young children. When I arrived, my mum had set the bedrooms up differently to how she normally would. She had put the cot up in the room that my older DD was going to be sleeping in. My younger DD is a nightmare at sharing a room, every time we've tried, she's take literally hours to go to sleep. My eldest is also a very early riser so I knew she would wake early and then wake my younger DD. I explained to my mum and asked if I could just put the cot in the room with me (there was plenty of space). My mum hit the roof about how ungrateful I am and that his her house and I should be thanking them to putting us up, not complaining. The upshot was that I wasn't allowed to move the cot. That night went exactly as I'd expected. The kids didn't go to sleep until almost 10pm (normal bedtime 7.30) and we're both up before 6am. I had 2 vile kids the next day. They were completely and utterly exhausted and every small thing became a huge challenge. The next day my sister arrived and would be sleeping in the room next to my girls room and the following morning was her wedding day. I was so worried that the kids would wake her up in the morning. My older DD has a grow clock so if she's in a room on her own, she wouldnt get up before 7am and youngest DD is a great sleeper so I knew she'd sleep a full 12 hours at least if sharing with me. I was also concerned that on the wedding day they would both be exhausted, grumpy and uncooperative. I was bridesmaid and so I really needed them to be on good form for the wedding.

I called my DH in tears because the whole situation was becoming so stressful. He told me to tell my mum that if she wouldn't just allow me to move the cot, then I would be booking a hotel for the evening. She once again went ballistic at me, calling me names and saying I was blackmailing her. I categorically wasn't. I was telling her the truth. I wasn't going to stay there another night under those circumstances. My mum said to me that I just want everything to revolve around me and that I was obviously trying to ruin my sister's wedding weekend because I was jealous of her. She said a lot of very hurtful things.

Eventually they let me move the cot and, lo and behold, the girls slept amazingly that night. As did my sister and I. The wedding all went smoothly so i was very relieved.

After that though, I came to the decision I couldn't stay at their house on future visits to Scotland. Stuff like this happens every time but I believe my mum was worse because my husband wasn't there with me. I was more vulnerable.

Anyway, things turned really sour when I said I wasn't going to stay with them on our next trip and lots more was said. At one point my mum actually called me a rat infront of my 5 year old DD.

I stayed with my lovely brother and his wife and had a lovely trip. I only saw my mum once and she spent the whole time having my eldest on her lap, sort of whispering into her ear so possibly bad mouthing me.

Anyway, we're heading back up to Scotland in a couple of months and I received a text from my dad saying to remember we're very welcome to stay with them when we visit. I sent a very nice reply, thanking him but explaining that a lot had been said & done which I'm sure he understood, and I thought it would be best to stay elsewhere but spend a lot of time with him and my mum and that we should just take things one step at a time and that I was really looking forward to seeing them.

I then posted on our family WhatsApp group to give them the dates we'd be visiting and asking them to let us know when they're free.

I received a message from my dad (written by my mum) which basically mirrored the message I had sent to my dad saying "these arrangements aren't good for us, I'm sure you'll understand. A lot has been said and done and I think it's best if we visit you at DB & SILs house". So basically I'm not allowed to go to their house when we visit. My D.C. haven't seen their grandparents for 8 months and probably won't see them again until the end of the year. I didn't want to drag the kids into this. DD absolutely loves "grandad garden" and has been talking lots about going there and now I have to tell her we can't go.

AIBU to be upset by this? Am I dealing with this the wrong way? I just feel so lost.

Don't worry about getting the exact tone right. Just work towards messages that basically say "whatever". ""Okay." "Okay, see you then." "We'll be at X's from 2 till 6 - see you if we see you." It doesn't mater what she thinks of if you have done it "right". Just sytick to calm, neutral reality.

It's hard, it takes practice and time. But you are doing great.

Re no contact, I find very low contact is better with my mum. Once or twice a year if she wants to visit us she can, briefly.

If I went no contact that would require some kind of announcement or decision. She would then take that as a deliberate Grand Rejection and see it as me engaging with her and in some kind of stand-off. Instead I've just reduced it and made it more and more arms-length.

*BrinkPink
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I can totally relate to what you're saying about low contact but I actually blocked my mum on my phone around the time she called me a rat infront of DD. I also blocked her on Facebook because I couldn't bare all the pretence she puts on. Pretending she's a loving parent & grandparent when the reality is so far from that.

As you implied in your last post, me unfriending her on Facebook caused WWIII!! She had known I'd blocked her from calling me which she wasn't bothered by but she blew up when she noticed the Facebook thing. She's been worried about people noticing I'm not friends with her on there. It's all about what other people think. She has absolutely no care for me at all.

Bluelady Wed 13-Feb-19 11:32:42
Your dad's doing exactly what MN says every spouse should do, he's backing your mum up in exactly the way you expect your husband to back you up. Strange how the rules change for a different generation.

And your mum sends you exactly the same message you sent her but, while it's fine from you, it's wrong from her. Try treating your parents as you would wish to be treated. They're sending you a very clear message here.

Never heard anyone on MN ever say that a husband should back up a wife in her abuse of her children.

Try treating your parents as you would wish to be treated

Tbe OPs Mum has abused her all her life. That is completely the wrong thing to say to a victim of abuse.

Wow, this could be me...the very same thing happened with the sleeping arrangements also the last time (and very last) I tried to visit.

I also have the enabling father too, even though in my case they are divorced, and I live far away also (which helps a bit!) but have my brother and his family nearby. They usually (bro's family) visit me, could yours come to you sometime if it is easier?

My en dad has been a nightmare since I went NC with mum since a horrible episode where I was seriously ill and needed an emergency op (she blamed me and told people I was on drugs ) she also has the mad rages and blame / projection)

I have also had to go NV with dad sadly as he started tying to rope me back in- telling me to forgive her and wrote to the DCs about 'how wonderful' she is etc and how her 'other grandchildren visit her' - so basically trying to guilt my children into seeing her. To please her.

I too thought he was lovely but see he just seems to ignore the way she treats me...and I have had enough.

Sorry NC I mean.

You’ve done your best to promote a good relationship between your parents and your children but your mum hasn’t been able to treat you with respect.
Time to back away in a way that will cause the least drama for you, maybe see them at your brothers house a few times a year.

I never answer the phone to my mum, or have any social media connection with her at all. She sends me controlling emails and letters which I mainly ignore except regarding practical arrangements. The contact really just means very occasional visits and I won't visit hers any more because of her behaviour.

Just saw your update on how your mother treated you as a child OP and just wanted to say how sorry I am. You sound remarkably well adjusted and strong despite how you grew up. But it also makes me sad that even after that sort of treatment your dad doesn’t fight your corner more.

Mine alos do the weird thing where he speaks for her on the phone and relays messages etc, you can't tell them (the dad) anything in confidence. It's horrible. I do feel for you.

OP I’m really sorry for what you have gone through. I think your request with the cot was perfectly reasonable but it was a control issue on your mum’s part instead of listening to you and accepting that you knew better. She has not forgiven you for undermining her authority.

Sadly I don’t think you can improve your relationship with your parents. Your father should absolutely challenge his wife’s unreasonable behaviour.

Do you think maybe you crave a lovely relationship between your children & their grandparents (perhaps compensating for the relationship that you desired yourself)? In reality I fear your mum will continue her manipulation. If I was you I would try not to get drawn into confrontation - I doubt you will ever make your mother understand & she just will not be interested in attempting to see your point of view. I think it best to concentrate on your own lovely little family and your Db. Don’t rise to the bait.

Your reply was perfect. You mum feeds off of drama. When she text nasty thing for example, treat her like a naughty child and say " I don't think speaking right now is helping. I will text (later/tomorrow) to see if you are calmer"
Don't indulge her with fighting back and givi her attention she craves.
You need to act like the adult in the relationship because your mother isn't capable of doing it.

You hands are tied when it comes to your dad. He has picked his side. You now need to look at what you are willing/ not willing to let your children witness.
Do you want them seeing these behaviours you seen as a child?

Then start making boundaries you and your children deserve.

I found this website very helpful about boundaries etc. It is called Out of the FOG (which is fear, obligation and guilt).

My parents were just like this. I haven't seen them for 20 years and life is much easier. Shame about my dad, a lovely man but not able to deal with my mum's manipulation. This is your life, your kids. Don't get involved. She'll always find the next thing to fall out over.

As your mum’s abusive you need to toughen up a bit.

Your sister’s wedding weekend - as soon as she tried to control the sleeping arrangements - I’d have simply said my way or hotel. You shouldn’t be having to call your DH for advice on how to deal with her.

If they say they don’t want to see you when you visit, fine. You don’t see them.

You don’t have to go NC - which can sometimes be more hassle rather than less - you just have to strenghen your sense of self, have better boundaries and more ruthlessness.

You need to detach from your parents, recognise that they’re basically a bit mad, don’t enourage a relationship between them and your children, don’t idealise the bond between gp and gc - my granny was a poisonous old boot and I’d have missed nothing if I hadn’t know her - and don’t sentimentalise your father - he’s weak.

I have no idea why you are forcing a relationship with these assholes. They are both people your children dont need in their lives.

Do you get on with your in laws? Not easy but I would stop contact. The cot thing is mad, no way I would have stood for that.

Onething Maybe not today, or this week, or this month but in time you will eventually realise you are actually much better off several hundred miles away.
Being bullied from a distance still remains a real struggle and understandably you are hurt and lost. Some of the great advice here will help you gather your strength again and find your natural equilibrium.
Don't let them take your sparkle. I promise there will be other older friends in real life - whom you probably haven't met yet -who will give you love and encouragement and do many things for your DC that will be thoughtful and wonderful. Hold on to the thought that your daughters will find lovely oldies - just not them.

I think part of the reason I try to salvage something is that DH's parents aren't great either as luck would have it. In a completely different way and we still have contact with them. They travel down to visit us and we'll stay with them when we go up but as far as grandparents go, my dad was the best hope they had at someone really fun and loving. But I suppose by turning his back on me, he has turned his back on them also.

Thanks Fortysix

They are trying to publicly shame/exert control on you on WhatsApp group right? I’d just reply, ‘yes, of course. I thought that’s what we’d already agreed. Look forward to seeing you both at DSis and BILs house.’

And then your biggest job is to accept that they are not good people and don’t have a clue how to look after and support you and your family, and work on extracting yourself emotionally from them. Then after that, if you keep some limited contact, you’ll need to sensitively educate your kids on the situation. Ie that you love your parents but sometimes they are unkind and not good to your family so they need to take what granny says with a pinch of salt.

Your story is very similar to my DH’s parents, except he had a stepmom as his Mum died when he was small.

Your mother is a narcissist, you can never reason with someone like that so don’t expect to.
We tried very hard to get along with my MIL despite the terrible childhood she gave. She was very controlling, very hurtful and incredibly paranoid. We did things we were told to that we now realise just made her worse, giving in to demands just enabled her to demand even more as time went on. My DH did all this because he wanted to spend time with his much loved father. The problem is, as with you, his father was a huge part of the problem because he enabled her to mistreat and manipulate the entire family, despite it causing obvious pain and a lot of arguments. That’s not ok. No matter how much you love your dad and the kids their grandad, he really is part of the problem and it’s unfair he is putting his wife before his children. Yes a husband or wife should support their partner, but my personal exception is when it comes to children. Your father actually has a lot of power here and he’s taking the easy road. He knows she’s being unreasonable and unkind to his child, and grandchildren, and he does nothing. So don’t allow yourself to be mistreated for his sake, he’s not doing the same for you.

These are your parents, for life. They are supposed to put you first, to support you and always have your back. They don’t. They’re causing you stress and actually now potentially knowingly are hurting your children. You can choose to have a lifetime of drama and hurt, or stand up for yourself now and show your children that no matter who it is, you shouldn’t let anyone disrespect and mistreat you.

We stopped our family drama almost 20 years ago, finally distancing ourselves after they refused to meet our new baby unless we did x, y, z. We would not let this carry on with our own family. I really encourage you to consider just stopping contact. We have never regretted it, our life has been happy fun, and peaceful :)

I think everyone is being so harsh saying your dad is not a lovely person. Just because you are in an emotionally abusive relationship does not make you a bad person. When did victim blaming become okay for this?

DH's parents aren't great either as luck would have it.

Mine were horrid too. You know the saying... ‘ sometimes it’s the family you were born into, sometimes it’s the family you make for yourself’
My child has all our amazing friends she calls Aunties & Uncles and neighbours she calls her ‘spiritual grandparents’, all love her and us, unconditionally. Find your own family in the world, one that treats you well :)

I have a toxic DM and enabler/toxic DF. DW and I were able to handle/manage it but it really escalated after our first child came along. Have tried to make peace but the only acceptable outcome for them was submission by us to them, the “real adults”.

Been virtually NC for 5 years and occasionally there are attempts to rope me back in or being me to heel but I just don’t respond anymore because I just can’t.

I can’t see it ever changing because they won’t change. I feel free in a sense but at the same time it hangs over me every day and I dread having to explain it to my children as they grow up.

I wish people could just be normal.