A splitting the bill AIBU

[JamHolyMoly]

We recently went out for dinner to celebrate my step-father's retirement. There were 11 adults and 4 children. The adults, bar one, had 3 courses. Most had at least one alcoholic drink, some only had soft drinks. Money wise, most people consumed roughly the same amount of food and drink except for one person who had the most expensive dish on the menu (double the cost of everyone else's). This person also had a number of very expensive drinks as well as a couple of extra side dishes. The children all had the kids menu food which was £8 for 3 courses. They all drank water.

At the end of the meal, the guest who had the most expensive meal got the bill and told everyone that it would be £40 a head, and included the children in this. We have 3 children so by his working out of the bill we owed £200 for me, dh and our 3 children.

FYI I am not someone who ever argues about the bill and I'm always happy to split the bill evenly amongst all adults present. I don't think I have ever refused to pay an evenly split bill so I don't have form for this.

Anyway, I immediately said that DH and I weren't going to be paying £120 for our three children's meals seeing as their 3 courses totalled £24. It then became really awkward as the person who had split the bill up started getting arsey with me and made a number of rude comments implying I was being tight and basically tried to embarrass me in front of the group. I kept my cool and didn't bite back. Everyone else went very quiet and refused to be drawn into it. My dh was chatting to an acquaintance at another table at the time so he didn't even know what was going on and wasn't there to back me up. It put a dampener on the entire occasion and it's left me feeling very upset that no one spoke up to say "hey that's not fair to expect Jam and dh to pay £120 for £24 food".

In the past I have always stood up for people when they've had one course and a soft drink but been asked to pay an evenly split bill which covered alcohol and numerous course, and would never expect someone to pay for my meal if I had had considerably more than them. I told the person to remove the £24 we owed for the kids from the total bill and then we were happy to split the remaining amount amongst all adults and add the £24 onto the amount we personally owed. I didn't expect anyone to pay for our children's meals but likewise I didn't expect for us to be covering everyone else's expensive food options and alcohol consumption through our children.

Anyway, a couple of family members have since contacted me to say that I ruined the occasion and have upset SF and his (adult) children.

I honestly don't believe I was unfair to refuse to pay £120 for my children's meals but at the same time a number of people in the family disagree and think I was being very unfair. I don't understand their mindset or how they can justify this so maybe I ABU? What do you all think? Should I just have sucked it up and paid the entire £200?

Obviously by £100 I mean the bill for all of you: adults and children (rather than the £200 he demanded)

I am always happy to split the bill, and have never made a fuss. However this situation was utterly ridiculous. The children shouldn’t pay an equal share. If they can’t see that, then they’re idiots.

They shouldn’t have put you in that position. YANBU.

YANBU. I remember so clearly a meal with DH’s ‘friends’ from work decades ago. At the time we were both on very low income (unlike his colleagues who all had higher paid roles). We ordered a starter each and tap water and they split the bill evenly. I just put in the £20 which more than covered our food and then sat in silence while they passive aggressively complained there wasn’t enough money. Since then I’ve always been really considerate about that kind of thing. It’s just not fair to order expensive food and expect others to pay for you.

We had Sunday lunch out once, about 20 of us including children....
Over deserts, we all quietly got up and paid for our food and drinks,. I paid for my parents as it was only £20 a head, and they always worried about us paying as we all had young children...
One of the group got up and made a big show about they supposed they were picking up the bill, they had 6 close relatives on their side... . They can back and kept looking at their bill, so someone said what is wrong...
Comment was it was fair less than they expected,. So we all said well it was only their side as we had all gone Dutch .
Do you know not one of their relatives even offered a penny

He’s a massive CF, OP. I bet your mum tells you he’s the embarrassing one. Don’t back down, it’s disgraceful that he wanted you to pay an extra £100! Idiot man!

Reminds me of having to go out to a meal with some people last year who were staying with us for a week. Two of them (a couple), me with 6 year old DS, and my elderly relative. They ordered a seafood platter (designed for two people) between themselves, and elderly relative and I decided to share one as well. DS also wanted seafood and waitress assured us that there was more than enough on one to feed him as well. Each platter was $150. Couple and I had two bottles of wine between the three of us (about $120 all up), elderly relative and DS just had water. When the bill came, couple wanted me to pay 3/5 of the bill and them 2/5 because there were three of us. I said 'well DS just ate off my plate, so let's just split it down the middle' (Elderly relative and I take turns paying, so this was my turn to pay for us). I didn't actually care about the wine, wasn't going to bother splitting that, but no way was I paying $84 for DS who ate off my meal anyway. They were most offended that I wasn't going to split it five ways.

BTW, never eating out with them again!

OP, don't buy into that whole thing about how you've upset people. Sometimes you have to challenge these sorts of family dynamics and people have to be upset, in order to establish a new status quo.

@mummmy2017 - I don't think you can assume anything at all from that. Maybe they usually treat each other, or have one member who usually wants to pay for them all. My parents or DH's parents will always want to pay, it doesn't matter how old we get, and it would be silly to debate it every time when it makes them happy. My parents' anniversary we paid for because we invited everyone (and they're our parents); you wouldn't have heard aunts kindly offering because they'd offered and been declined in advance.

@MidniteScribbler - and you'd put them up, as well!

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I've deciphered @Boobahs code and she just offered to buy everyone dinner, woohoo!

Are you quite all right, Boobahs?

My rules:
Account for food and booze separately
Food is split with 1 share per kid, 2 shares per adult
Booze is split with 1 share per adult
If someone else has had a notably more expensive dish than everyone else, they chuck in something for the difference

Very impressively-designed formula, but it still doesn't solve the issue of one adult drinking water/coke and another hitting the spirits and cocktails. Also, when it comes to children, do you differentiate between two tiny toddlers who might share a kids' meal and a 17yo who eats twice as much as the adults?

If you're going to all that effort, isn't it just easier to charge each person/couple/family for what they've actually had? Granted, shared bottles of wine will still have to be somehow split between those who've partaken of them, when one might have had a small glass and another the rest of the bottle.

Personally, I would say that the presence of children (unless an even number per family dining) and/or the fact that one or more people have had markedly different food and/or drink from the rest should automatically mean that splitting equally is not practical or fair on that occasion, unless everybody expressly and willingly agrees on it.

@Boobahs clearly has a lot of valuable experience to add to this discussion, as I can see clear signs of at least one of the two main issues being debated here: the presence of children and/or an excessive consumption of alcohol

As a small eater and infrequent drinker, I hate huge groups because splitting the bill is almost always unfair, but I usually just suck it up. At one, an amazing guy stood up when it was suggested that the bill was split and said "I think everyone should pay for what they ate and drank because I know I have had more than the average and it's nearly always the women who end up subsidising the men in the group" - I think all the women in the group wanted to kiss him.

@theworldistoosmall

I think your cf is the step brother

I think all the women in the group wanted to kiss him.

Really? (makes a note)

@BadLad is clearly considering playing the long game

“Anyway, I immediately said that DH and I weren't going to be paying £120 for our three children's meals seeing as their 3 courses totalled £24.”

I agree that the bill was split unfairly, but it sounds as if you dealt with it in a very public confrontational manner. And a row about the bill at someone else’s ‘occasion ‘ is bad manners and upsetting.

Was there a way you could have said, quietly, “could we pay the kids £8 meals seperately and then split the rest? “

That has to be the most amazingly privileged post from Gone4Good. The idea that you would just pick up a bill of around £600 rather than 'do maths'. That's a different world to most people, never mind a different country

Our meals are sensible ones at a grill or our favorite Mexican restaurant and don't involve expensive boozing. We take turns in treating as in - "It's our turn to pay, you didn't last time". To me it sounds crass, not to mention awkward to be haggling and fighting over the bill at the table - and then carrying it on until the following day!

Yes, we are in a different worlds. We'd never spend $775 in a restaurant for a family get-together. For a bigger gatherings we have cook-outs or someone shows up with pizza or whatever.

Family celebrations and get togethers are for catching-up, having fun, NOT spending great amounts of dosh on fancy meals - then falling out about it.

Now apologize for calling me privileged. I won't hold my breath.

you dealt with it in a very public confrontational manner
That's because the CF did it publicly and in an unreasonable manner.

a row about the bill at someone else’s ‘occasion ‘ is bad manners and upsetting
This is what CF's are counting on and why so many people let them get away with time and time again.

CF caused the upset in the first place by trying to take the piss!
Birthday Man is CF's dad.....the onus was on CF to behave appropriately at this occasion.

OP did the right thing by 'confronting' him then and there, publicly and then standing her ground.
At least now everyone knows that OP is no doormat and will not be manipulated....maybe in future they'll think twice before trying it on with anyone

It then became really awkward as the person who had split the bill up started getting arsey with me and made a number of rude comments implying I was being tight and basically tried to embarrass me in front of the group
HE should be ashamed and embarrassed....as should everyone else who enabled him.

OMG! I have just woken up to my phone under my pillow and some email alerts re: this thread and realised that I fell asleep reading it last night, I must have pressed a few buttons with a random body part

This isn't the first time this has happened either, I once woke up about to bid £80 on a 99p item on eBay!

Can I be excused as I have a toddler and am currently growing another one?

And for what it's worth now I've ruined your thread OP, you're definitely not being unreasonable!