That this work sickness policy is utterly crazy?

[SongforSal]

Been with the company over 2yrs and have always had a good sickness record. A few months ago I was very worried and in lots of pain as I had a period problem. My menstrual cycle lasted a good 3mths with only the odd day off. Other than a hospital appointment I had been waiting for an internal (I took a holiday day) there was one other day during this time, where I had to call in sick as I was in no position to work.

Last week, I called in sick for the day as I woke up in the night vomiting. Couldn't keep even water down. Didn't fancy the prospect of throwing up at my desk!

After a meeting with my boss, I was informed that having had 2 separate sick days, within a 6 month period, if I took another sick day within the next 6months-I would get a disciplinary!

Now, my contract allows 10 days per year paid sick leave. There are no stipulations, nor references to and reprimands, verbal or disciplinary procedures which may be enforced within this contract. Not that I have ever taken the piss.

Here comes the what the fuck rabbit hole have I just fallen down.

So. A colleague came into work today sweating, coughing, kept running to the bathroom, clearly very much unwell. On the back of a couple of weeks ago, when another colleague came in and spent 3 days at his desk with a cough, headache ect and chugging back lemsips. I asked my boss ''What happens if I catch this bug?'' and the reply I got was I could basically soldier on in as it is my choice to work, however if I got ill, and stayed home. You guessed it-a disciplinary.

So I am thinking I may need to invest in a hazmat suit for work, and fill the pockets with bloody dettol spray, as people are having to come in ill-or face reprimands! I can see why they feel forced to do so, but the knock on effect (selfishly) is I will get ill from being at work, and effectively punished if I take time off as to recover and not infect everyone else.

Does my place of work sound like a 18th century factory to you? Is this common?

Oops - it should say 'a potential claim'.

You have to draw the line somewhere but I’m not sure the Bradford way is right.

Example I have had less that ten days sick in 33 years. Colleague had 997 in ten years. She knew exactly how to milk it.

Funnily enough when she was at risk of beng managed out of the business it stopped. No sick for three years 🤷‍♀️

Cammie you are covered under the Equality Act which means they are required to make reasonable adjustments and this should include adjusting absence triggers x so sorry to hear about your diagnosis

@HunterHearstHelmsley - thankyou - and yes my manager is amazing as is the Deputy Manager - we rotate management teams every 5 years and my managers are due to move in a year and I'm nervous of whether the new management team will be as understanding if I'm still working then (which I aim to be).

You will have made that lady's life so much easier in ways you can't even imagine - my managers couldn't begin to realise how much they're supporting me x

The NHS is terrible for this, the sickness policy encourages unwell nurses to come in and spread their germs as they fear being sacked if they are on sickness monitoring.

So the next time I’m advising one of my clients on an absence issue I’ll be sure to tell them that some random on the internet thinks it’s not a huge problem. That’ll keep regulatory bodies/their shareholders happy sure!

I suspect badlydrawn you’re one of the skivers who are the reasons for some employers engaging such draconian policies in the first place

@oblada and @Schmoobarb - thankyou for the advice x

mayrhofen yep that’s it the pisstakers always know how to milk the system to their advantage and it’s the genuinely sick/unlucky ones who wouldn’t do that who suffer.

997 days absence in 10 years 😬 she must have barely been there!

But in case you really can’t think out of your own narrow realm of experience, imagine
I can do imagination, thanks. I was wondering if it's one of those things like "skills shortages" which are cited as a crisis when it's nothing of the kind - it's just unviable business models expecting masses of highly skilled workers to be available cheaply, that's all. I was wondering about actual metrics rather than an assertion from someone who as it turns out has a vested interest in seeing a "huge problem"

Yanbu

We get a follow up after 3 absences in 12 months, but not a disciplinary unless you've been found to be piss taking i guess.

You get a return to work interview each time and you're told how many you've had that year.

Your work sounds nuts tbh. I'd hate sick colleagues staggering in

I suspect badlydrawn you’re one of the skivers who are the reasons for some employers engaging such draconian policies in the first place

Currently self employed, but haven't had a day off sick in 5+ years, but don't let that get in the way of nasty assumption.

Wow makes me realise how lenient our place is! Some people are always off with colds, stomach upsets etc. Hospital appointments also count as sick. The only rule is that if you take five days in a row off, you need a doctor's note. We also allow working from home, so anyone with an infectious cold who's still capable of working can do so.

I am so glad i dont work in the UK!

To my knowledge i have no limit of number of paid sick leaves. I think the most absences ive had was 6 or 7 x 1-2 days off in a year with migraines. A drs note is required for every sick leave. And in all my jobs, if Im not there then the work just waits for me to get back, so I often worked despite a migraine to avoid a build up.

No manager or RH has ever questioned my absences. Suddenly feeling very lucky!

I had two separate days off sick in 14 YEARS and scored an 8

I'm super lucky too as my Bradford index is off the scale and I've kept my job so far. I'm off once every couple of months because I'm always ill and I catch all the bugs going around in my son's nursery. In the last year I've had norovirus twice, hand foot and mouth, the flu, pneumonia, sepsis and a couple of chest infections. I feel like I'm taking the piss but I'm fairly sure I shouldn't be going to work with any of those. In reality I'm ill a lot more but I do soldier on and come in if it's anything more minor, like laryngitis/sinusitis/pleurisy/nausea etc. My boss usually sends me home when I do. Lol.

This has baffled me for years though. I just get super sick and fairly often (probably due to stuff like arthritis/fibromyalgia/IBS) and there's absolutely nothing I can do about it. If I worked somewhere else would I get the sack? I do often work from home if I'm ill, and generally work hard AF when I'm actually in and my bosses tell me I'm a good employee, but stuff like the Bradford index freaks me out!

Sometimes it's just policy though , years ago I worked for a well know utility company. The procedure was if you had more than 2 occasions in 3 months you go on a sickness procedure. I never took time off in fact went years without a day off sick but I got quite a bad chest infection and got a sick note off doctor for a week . I came back to work but wasn't properly well and had to go back to the doctors for another sick note . Anyway because doctor didn't put the same thing on my sick note I had a sickness procedure warning at work . I was fuming at the time I mean if I didn't go back to work it would of been a continuous illness so no action taken . I explained that of course it was the same illness everyone had remarked that I was ill . I was told it was procedure and not to worry but it was just the whole policy that annoyed me no common sense.
I wouldn't worry if that's the case , you have every reason to be annoyed and it sounds ridiculous but a lot of companies do this .

Yes it is shit but sadly that is how many employers now treat their staff.

Years ago when I worked in an office staff were not treated so badly. I rarely had any time off sick but a few people did and there was no "back to work talk" or disciplinaries.

Gradually things changed for the worse. My last job I left because I had started suffering migraines and no way could I go to work when I had one. I couldn't even sit up in bed without throwing up and the room spinning let alone the horrendous pain in my head.

I had 2 days off in 6 months and was warned if I had another day I would face disciplinary. I was already sick of the comments about my migraines and how they were just a headache so left rather than be sacked

Where I work is like this too. We're allowed 2 incidences of sickness not exceeding 5 days in total or we get disciplinary and then they'd move to try to sack.

They effectively force people to come into work sick, then punish you for catching something from the sick folk. As someone who is rarely off sick, I was fuming to get a verbal warning after being off for 3 days (hadn't had a day off in years before that). But it's all caused by previous staff members taking the piss and acting like the old 10 day sick policy was an extra two weeks holiday per year.

Looking at some things I have been signed off work with, I didn’t intend to break limbs in accidents. I don’t see how I could prevent that happening in the future.

Not RTFT but I had a job where I didn't get sick pay if I caused the problem. Ie breaking a limb skiing. How can that be policed?!

I think sickness policy's are awful tbh- I was off work last year (quit afterwards due to horrid bullying from boss!) with chronic UTI's that lead to a hospital stay for IV antibiotics to treat the kidney infection caused by the UTI. I was off maybe 2 days (separate occasions) over 2 weeks that were both individual UTI incidents (couldn't walk due to pain and felt crap even on antibiotics, didn't feel like working on the shop floor with no where to rest all day!) then had the kidney infection incident a week after that and had to take 5days.

My boss rang every day (even though MY gp rang in for me as I'd called crying due to the pain and being unable to get to the doctors to get a note to send to work) asking when I'd be back and that I would be facing disciplinary action when returning.

Some people can't help getting sicker than others, I have chronic fatigue anyway as well as epilepsy so really struggle some days but still went in! (Even feeling faint on my feet all day)

I would never stay off for something like a cold or headache but for serious infections/flu/stomach bug etc you have to stay off for your safety and for your colleagues health too!

You're getting off lightly, mine is 3 episodes in 2 years. Consequently everyone comes into work ill and the only 'work' they do is making everyone else ill.

After your 2nd absence you have a meeting with your line manager, my 1st was after I had been off with depression and still wasn't well, not the best time to be being quizzed as to why I felt the need to be off. I just remember saying 'but I wanted to die'

My last sickness I took as holiday as that would have been my 3rd. I am back to 1 period which was 13mths ago.

We get 6 months paid sick leave, however 3 periods of absence in 12 months triggers a warning, so unless you have one very long illness you don’t really have 6 months paid sick.

I’ve worked here for 5 years, never had 1 single day off until this year when I had one chest infection last February (couldn’t breathe for coughing!), a 2 day vomiting bug in April and another vomiting bug last week, so if I’d had the last vomiting bug 2 weeks from now I would’ve been ok, but now I get a warning and told not to be off sick again in the next six months.

It’s ridiculous, they saw how bad I was with the chest infection and I had to leave early because of the first vomiting bug so they know I was genuine, it was just unlucky I got sick three times in 12 months.

We get six weeks holiday which you can book last minute, so I’d never need to take a sickie because I didn’t want to go in - so I really don’t see what they’re achieving with the sickness policy other than pissing off loyal staff.

We have a sickness review after 3 incidences in a rolling 12 month period.

I’ve had one day in the three years I’ve been at my current job.

I had a problem with this system in my last job- I had a miscarriage and took a few days off as I was heavily bleeding, then I had a bug about 4 months later and took 1 day. I thought I was better enough so went back as we were so busy and I felt guilty, lasted an hour and felt all dizzy and really ill but because I’d booked back in to work and then went off again it counted as 2 separate sickness incidents even though it was the same illness.

I was cross but still put on a performance plan. And now I would never try to go back early.

My sis works for the NHS she had some surgery planned - work knew about it for over a year, they planned for her cover etc etc. While she was off recovering from the surgery they were minor pestering her to go tell them when she would be back at work. She felt pressured to go back earlier than she would have liked. Sure enough after two days at work the wound opened up and she ended up back in hospital. Work put her on disciplinary for two periods of absence in a year period - even though the first operation was fully planned and sick notes etc and she wouldn't have had the second time off if they'd not pressured her to go back too soon.