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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

That this work sickness policy is utterly crazy?

189 replies

SongforSal · 07/02/2019 17:23

Been with the company over 2yrs and have always had a good sickness record. A few months ago I was very worried and in lots of pain as I had a period problem. My menstrual cycle lasted a good 3mths with only the odd day off. Other than a hospital appointment I had been waiting for an internal (I took a holiday day) there was one other day during this time, where I had to call in sick as I was in no position to work.

Last week, I called in sick for the day as I woke up in the night vomiting. Couldn't keep even water down. Didn't fancy the prospect of throwing up at my desk!

After a meeting with my boss, I was informed that having had 2 separate sick days, within a 6 month period, if I took another sick day within the next 6months-I would get a disciplinary!

Now, my contract allows 10 days per year paid sick leave. There are no stipulations, nor references to and reprimands, verbal or disciplinary procedures which may be enforced within this contract. Not that I have ever taken the piss.

Here comes the what the fuck rabbit hole have I just fallen down.

So. A colleague came into work today sweating, coughing, kept running to the bathroom, clearly very much unwell. On the back of a couple of weeks ago, when another colleague came in and spent 3 days at his desk with a cough, headache ect and chugging back lemsips. I asked my boss ''What happens if I catch this bug?'' and the reply I got was I could basically soldier on in as it is my choice to work, however if I got ill, and stayed home. You guessed it-a disciplinary.

So I am thinking I may need to invest in a hazmat suit for work, and fill the pockets with bloody dettol spray, as people are having to come in ill-or face reprimands! I can see why they feel forced to do so, but the knock on effect (selfishly) is I will get ill from being at work, and effectively punished if I take time off as to recover and not infect everyone else.

Does my place of work sound like a 18th century factory to you? Is this common?

OP posts:
SubparOwl · 07/02/2019 19:02

In my job any more than two discrete episodes of sickness within a rolling six month period triggers a review.

This is, however, clearly stated in my contract.

Tbh, the only way I've avoided triggering it is to go in ill, which isn't ideal for anyone.

Ollivander84 · 07/02/2019 19:05

Same here. 4 periods of absence (whether 1 day or 14 days) in a rolling year. That'll get you a disciplinary
After that you can't go off sick for a year or you go to the next level

Ollivander84 · 07/02/2019 19:07

I went in with pneumonia to avoid being sacked. Went off a week before my year was up (so 11 months, 3 weeks with no absence despite no immune system) for emergency spinal surgery and was facing being dismissed.
I had struggled in on morphine, diazepam, the lot but I couldn't take the pain any longer and it turned out I had cauda equina

Torridon19 · 07/02/2019 19:12

OP - Your boss has to be careful that they don't say "You'll get a disciplinary next time". They've not to say that before you both meet, have the future return to work interview, and then after it's concluded, they will probably give you a confidential letter calling you back in at a future date for a formal meeting. The letter would say " absences giving cause for concern etc, could potentially lead to Informal Warning etc, you can bring a union representative, or a friend with you...". This gives your union rep time to prepare their argument. If the boss just says, before any meeting, "You're getting disciplined", then they have pre-judged the meeting outcome before it's even happened, and the union will be able to jump on this, and HR will be very annoyed with your boss for being biased before hearing the points put forward by you/the union in that meeting.

Crunchymum · 07/02/2019 19:18

I was going to say the same as some PP, wait until the 6 months are up and the have a 3 days off ill Shock

Schmoobarb · 07/02/2019 19:20

Absence is a huge problem for lots of businesses but they need to strike a balance between clamping down on employees who take the piss and are off all the time and penalising hard working staff who just happen to have a run of bad luck.

Those absence triggers are fairly standard but if you have otherwise a good level of attendance a decent employer might (hopefully) just look at it and advise you that the trigger was hit and to keep an eye on it but take no formal action. One time in my last job I struggled back to work too soon lasted a day and was off again and they counted it as 2 absences, that was the thanks I got for trying to get back to work ASAP instead of just taking a longer block off!

As for the boasters that have only had one day off in eleventy billion years, big wow. You’ve been unlucky not to be so sick you couldn’t physically go to work, what do you want, a medal for your amazing immune system?

badlydrawnperson · 07/02/2019 19:23

Absence is a huge problem for lots of businesses

In what way?

Schmoobarb · 07/02/2019 19:24

In what way?

Seriously? You can’t fathom why staff not being there to do the job they’re employed for might be a problem?

Mmmhmmm · 07/02/2019 19:29

3 absences isn't a lot, you're definitely working in an 18th century factory.

newnameforthis7 · 07/02/2019 19:31

Yes it IS common and it's ridiculous IMO.

Sorry you have been ill. Flowers

Schmoobarb · 07/02/2019 19:34

The irony about these policies is that the skivers they’re intended to deal with don’t give a shit about disciplinaries and don’t care if they get a warning. It’s the good employees with good records who drag themselves in whilst sick to try and keep their employment record blemish free.

namechangedforanon · 07/02/2019 19:37

Call ACAS

They are not acting appropriately ( I work in HR )

Figgygal · 07/02/2019 19:39

4 periods or 10 days triggers a conversation not a formal meeting though and most managers just ignore it

I don't think anyone uses Bradford factor very much these days

Schmoobarb · 07/02/2019 19:39

Call ACAS

Call ACAS for what?

They haven’t actually done anything yet!

badlydrawnperson · 07/02/2019 19:40

Seriously? You can’t fathom why staff not being there to do the job they’re employed for might be a problem?

No of course not I was asking about your assertion that it is a huge problem for lots of businesses. Is it based on any facts? What constitutes a huge problem in this context?

SteelRiver · 07/02/2019 19:41

It seems pretty much standard, sadly. Try keeping within those confines when you have certain disabilities, too. For anyone who thinks you can't be sacked for disability related sickness absence, you can.

I absolutely believe that shirkers should be caught out but, IME, it's people with genuine, chronic and painful conditions that get hammered.

OP, odd to think it, but wouldn't it be funny if your entire office went off poorly, all at the same time, with something infectious brought in by a colleague too scared to call in sick!

FloralTeacup · 07/02/2019 19:42

Policies like that are ridiculous and archaic. Fair enough, some people take advantage and that's not on, but everyone else should not be penalised for that. It would soon become apparent who was taking the piss, anyway.

At my last place of work, this sort of thing got me so worked up and anxious. Their strict policies about everything were the very thing that drove me to become ill. I caught bugs very easily, and given the nature of the job (long hours, physically draining),I had no choice but to call in sick a few times. One of those times, was because I got so worked up I physically and mentally couldn't cope, so made the (right) decision to not go in the next day.

Six months into my new job, and I've not once needed to take a day off yet. For a start, the nature of the job is far less stressful, shorter hours and just a more flexible work environment. I believe that employers who trust their employees, provide reasonable leeway when needed, are far more likely to get better performance out their employees. To be honest, a workplace with hundreds of rigid, unreasonable policies and procedures make me inclined to be a bit defiant (i.e. insisting that you do specific, minute things for the sake of appearances).Halo

These sort of policies need to be reviewed.

namechangedforanon · 07/02/2019 19:44

I meant call ACAS if you have any further issues with them discussing your sick.

It's very archaic way of operating .

CammieKennaway · 07/02/2019 19:45

My company is the same - which terrifies me as I was diagnosed with incurable cancer on Nov 26th and because my prognosis is 1-15 years depending on how aggressive my cancer gets, I want to continue working - partly to take my mind off things and to keep some normality and mainly to keep bringing in money and paying for my own funeral and hopefully leaving a secret stash to help my beautiful husband when I've gone.
My bosses themselves are lovely and have been really supportive and have reduced my hours so I have time to attend appointments without using up leave or having to take sick days (if we go home early sue to sickness, it's classed as a sick day) and so I don't get too exhausted.
We only got this new policy a couple of years ago

gamerwidow · 07/02/2019 19:46

As others have said it’s common for 3 episodes of sickness in 12 months to trigger a sickness review. These are not necessarily disciplinaries though. At my work (NHS) the first sickness review meeting once you’ve triggered a review is informal and looks at the reasons for absence and if any underlying reasons are there. In the OPs case it would be accepted that she was just unlucky.

HunterHearstHelmsley · 07/02/2019 19:50

@CammieKennaway so sorry to hear about your diagnosis.

I managed a lady who had incurable cancer and my work place could be a little strict. I bent the rules as much as I could. Anything to make things a little easier for her. I would probably wind up with a disciplinary if they found out what I'd done.
Hopefully you have an understanding manager. It is shit enough as it is without being shown any compassion.

Schmoobarb · 07/02/2019 19:50

No of course not I was asking about your assertion that it is a huge problem for lots of businesses. Is it based on any facts? What constitutes a huge problem in this context?

No, I’ve just pulled it out of my arse, I haven’t really worked in HR advising on these issues for 12 years.

badlydrawnperson · 07/02/2019 19:51

No, I’ve just pulled it out of my arse

Thanks for clarifying

Schmoobarb · 07/02/2019 19:54

But in case you really can’t think out of your own narrow realm of experience, imagine you run a care home and need a certain number of staff to operate safely. Ditto a nursery. Or you run a factory and a set of production lines and you can’t run them due to absenteeism meaning production and profitability is significantly affected. Or your sick pay bill is huge and eating into company profits. The last (very large) company I worked for lost £100000s a year due to absence. So yeah, it can be a huge problem.

oblada · 07/02/2019 19:55

Commie - sorry to hear that. But in terms of work dismissing you/disciplining you absences related to your cancer diagnosis could land them into hot water in terms of a potential claimed so you should definitely get a lot of leeway on this.

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