Neighbours dog has just attacked me and DD.

[katkat90]

Have had issues with them in the past

They are elderly, with two large breed dogs (think Great Danes?). They cannot control them. Honestly the amount of times I have seen them nearly pull them over in the street/simply pull out of their grasp and go bouncing off and jumping all over people is untrue.

Was walking back from the shop and saw them coming from a distance so I stepped to the side into another neighbours driveway and next thing I know- one of them had pulled out of its owners grasp and came bounding over and knocked DD (who is just about getting confident with her toddling) over.

It was over in seconds- by the time I put the break on the pram (was stood on a slopes drive so it would of ran off into the road) and went to grab DD she was already on the floor the dog barking at her- so I kicked it to get it away, and it bit my leg.

I was furious. Owner very embarrassed an apologetic but I’ve said enough is enough and I would be contacting the police and the RSPCA.

Heaven forbid it bounded on the pram and just decided to bite my 2 week old. It would of taken her head off no doubt.

V shaken and waiting for DH to get home to call the police and RSPCA.

I’ve also messaged his daughter on Facebook

No. blingthing, she kicked away an animal that was barking at her fallen upset child and refusing to leave her alone. No need for the outraged shouty capitals.

Broadly speaking dog owners are too emotionally involved with their pets to take a rational stance on these issues, however the law is on the side of the humans and out of control animals can and should be reported to the authorities

any animal behaving in an aggressive manner whether it's on a lead or not has clearly not been properly trained and is a potential threat, my local council does have an online facility for reporting problem dogs and from now on I'm going to be more proactive and take photographs or film where possible if I come across a problem dog.

polite well behaved dogs are of course always welcome and I see no reason not to tolerate them

Broadly speaking dog owners are too emotionally involved with their pets to take a rational stance on these issues Eh??

Honestly, Wordthe, you are coming across as completely irrational yourself.

You have absolutely no basis for making such an assertion. Why on earth would responsible dog owners not want irresponsible dog owners taken to task?

Objecting to cries of "put the dog down" in this instance, doesn't equate to an inabliity to understand the issue with dogs out of control.

Your statement Wordthe is as ludicrous as saying that parents are too emotionally involved with their children to take a rational stance on neglect / abuse of other children by their parents. Batshit.

Responsible dog owners are likely to be more rational because they know the idiot owners could cause a lot of problems for them. The bad ones make life hard for everybody.

When constructing an argument the mind of the irresponsible dog owner always goes straight to the analogy with children
this tells us all we need to know.

Are you a psychiatrist? If not you are in no place to decide who is & isn't rational. Someone who wants to kill dogs for barking isn't exactly best placed to decide on someone else's mindset...

Breaking free of your leash, bounding along the street towards a toddler, knocking them over and barking at them is not a bloody 'accident'. Its an out of control dog as described by law. Ops dd was scared, op was scared for her dd and her baby thats all the law needs.

Why the hell should people walking along the street be subjectrd to some gisnt dog jumping all over them?
Claws rake, they could knock over someone especially someone infirm and do them real damage. They could scare a child off dogs for years.. it doesnt matter if they were aggressive or not. They are a danger to the public by thier actions.

If you cant stop your dogs charching at people then dont have any.

When constructing an argument the mind of the irresponsible dog owner always goes straight to the analogy with children
this tells us all we need to know. [hmmm]

You truly are not helping your cause Wordthe.

You appear to have created bizarre vision of the world being divided into 2 camps: pet owners (lonely, irrational and unable to form social relationships) vs non pet owners (sane, socially functioning people who the only ones able to act rationally).

You are exactly right @Willow
it's an out of control dog as described by the law
the law is the bottom line

I feel sorry for all concerned here except the owners . It's their responsibility to ensure the dog is under control in public whether it's lead, double lead , muzzle, anything. Training would be good 🙄 it's not the op responsibility to understand what the dogs bark means, she took it as agressive and reacted , and I bet a lot of people would. Someone said pick the child up? That's an absolute nope too! A playful untrained dog will leapt thinking it's a game and an agressive one see it as bait/target :( but these are the things Jo public shouldn't have to know just because there's irresponsible dog owners. I just hope the dog isn't destroyed and they take a warning to get it trained

Also, Wordthe could you explain why you refer to me as an irresponsible dog owner?

LuaDipa

This dog was not aggressive. It sounds like it was no more aggressive than your own dogs.

If you accidentally let go of the lead this could be your dog getting kicked.

Dogs on general don't bark to show aggression.

In the dogs mind he was excited to see people on the walk and accidentally knocked the toddler over. The barking was calling the owners over to show them what he had found. His tail was probably wagging and he was excited and for that he got a kick.

Years ago I am sure there was an episode on Its Me or the Dog which featured Great Danes. Can't remember the owners name but she was a famous model back in the 60s or 70s. Very experienced owner of GDs but they are really scatty and she was having similar trouble to the owners in the OP. They were never going to harm anyone intentionally but were out of control.

If an experienced owner has problems then it might not be completely the current owners fault.

It is the ones that are not barking you have to worry about. The ones who are too busy snarling to bark

Oh wordthe you really are the gift that keeps on giving!

Unfortunately you seem to have been “attacked” by dogs on numerous occasions, probably more so than any other person. Just wondering whether they were mainly spaniel types that sniffed round you and stood barking at the end. The person at the end of the lead did nothing apart from seeming to encourage the dog and seemed to reward the dog by playing fetch!

This thread is the gift that keeps on giving

Of course aggressive dogs should be leashed. I have stated this many times. But when Headbang complains about a ferocious dog scaring her DC - who was on a lead what are dog owners supposed to do?

People call for prospective dog owners to rescue, and they do. Very often these dogs come with a whole lot of problems caused by their previous owners. Hence the number of reactive dogs we are seeing now. I meet these dogs every day - and if they are reactive to dogs or people they are usually kept on a lead. Owners of reactive dogs pay to hire a, private, enclosed field to excercise their dog. I very much agree that aggressive or reactive dogs should be kept on a lead, in public.

The very reason I have never had a dog from a rescue centre is because I have children and I want to bring a dog up from a puppy to train it to be a sociable, happy dog. I don't want the responsibility of keeping a nasty dog. I have seen the damage a small, untrained, aggressive dog can do. I can only imagine the damage a dog the size of a Great Dane could do if it attacked. It's not a pleasant thought.

I take my hat off to people who rescue dogs. I wouldn't do it. But I can understand why dog owners get upset when people complain that their on lead, at all times, dog scared their DS.

Non dog owners.. dogs have to be taken out to be exercised. Nobody should keep a dog indoors, indefinitely. And if a reactive dog is kept on a lead the dog owner is a responsible dog owner.

The dog in the OP was out of control- that's the fault of the owner. Said dog did not attack and should not be put to sleep.

Headbangs story- the aggressive dog was on a lead. Off lead it could very well have attacked. On lead it couldn't, and didn't.

Unless a dog attacks & causes real damage imo it should not automatically be PTS.

I have had reactive rescue dogs, mine could have been one snarling on lead. BUT i could hold mine easily & he was muzzled. Having a rescue dog with issues still is no excuse to not take precautions.

Very well put @blueslippersocks

It takes time to train a dog. It doesn't just happen on day one- especially a rescue dog.
A dog barking at you on a lead may well be in the process of being trained. There has to be a first time you take them out to see if the training has stuck. You shouldn't report each and every dog that barks otherwise you're just the boy that cried wolf and you won't be taken seriously when something actually happens (except Word of course, who is attacked daily)

Barking isn't the issue tho. If an owner panics & strains to hold their dog that is a warning sign they are not in control. A dog barking with a nonchalent owner who can handle their dog is a HUGE difference to a dog barking, trying to drag an owner & the owner panicking...

by The way all talk about it’s enough to feel threatened is not entirely accurate, I think the wording is something along the lines of “reasonabl apprehension that it will injure any person” what is reasonable is usually the man on the Clapham omnibus rather than an hysterical dog hater that advocates carrying a taser or illegal pepper spray to attack barking dogs. It is not a subjective measurement.

This idea of feeling threatened is linked to the dog being out of control in Rv Robinson-Pierre [2014] the judge stated that Parliament did not intend to create an offence without regard to the ability of the [owner] to have control of the animal (ie if it was on a lead it’s v unlikely to be out of control) -this is the CPss guidance

Defras own guidance (based on the 1991 act -but the 2014 changes basically extended the out of control provisions to private land) says this part of the legislation is only meant for the most serious of situations.

There is however another offence of wasting police time. So crack on and keep taking pictures of barking dogs on leads.

Barking isn't the issue tho. If an owner panics & strains to hold their dog that is a warning sign they are not in control. A dog barking with a nonchalent owner who can handle their dog is a HUGE difference to a dog barking, trying to drag an owner & the owner panicking...

Exactly.
What if the dog had dragged the owner over to the child? Would that be seen as 'aggressive' or did it actually have to get to the child and bite before some dog owners would consider the dog dangerous?
Being faced with a barking dog straining at the lead to get to you or your child and a panicking owner doesnt instill confidence in anyone.

Unless you can control your dog it should be in a halter/double lead and muzzled in public. Any responsible dog owner would agree. Most dog owners do not presume its ok to go around allowing thier dog to scare kids or adults.

Deadbudgie it depends. I had police, dog warden & housing attend because someone complained. Initially my dog 'attacked' her. Then he apparently 'went' to attack her. The dog warden basically told me i had to be really careful & make sure i was putting every precaution in place because the law is leaning more towards the complainant nowadays. Take the dog jumping at a garden fence - to me that is usually an excited dog wanting to say hi. That can get you into trouble (again, something i have seen) even if your dog does not make any aggressive actions. Sadly the world has gone mental

@pissedoffdotcom but like I say, perhaps that dog had been in training for some time and this was the owners first attempt to take him out. Clearly more training is needed. Perhaps the owner is revisiting this and if it is still not successful, she has plans for the dog to live with someone more experienced. Shrieks of "destroy the dog!" are over the top. Maybe I'm completely wrong but as I say, training doesn't happen overnight.

Take the dog jumping at a garden fence - to me that is usually an excited dog wanting to say hi. That can get you into trouble (again, something i have seen) even if your dog does not make any aggressive actions. Sadly the world has gone mental

Really?

But the owner should have taken more precautions. If you get a dog you know has issues you plan ahead. Muzzle, double contact at all times. And if you physically cannot keep hold of a dog & panic when people come near there is a problem.

I've had many 'problem' dogs, from aggression to merely trying to bolt. Barring an accident such as an owner tripping etc, anybody who walks a dog should be able to keep hold confidentally. If you can't you shouldn't be walking it in public because the risk is too high. Many a time i've had to hire private spaces to train. It's what you do to keep everyone - including your dog - safe.