To email school AGAIN re religious assemblies

[pineapplepenthouse]

I have twins in year 4 both in different classes. I have expressed my feelings about not letting them be involved in religious assemblies or having anything to do with religion. My children are in different classes. Today for the third time my DDs has come home saying he has been included in the religious assembly.
I have strong feelings on this but other mums just say 'it's not a big deal' and 'it didn't do us any harm'.

AIBU?

What are the 'branches' of Catholicism, Janedoe5000?

The churches that arose in the Reformation?

Oh God, here we go again, everyone piling on with their view that you should chill out and just let the low level sales pitch wash over your kids because they might like the songs or whatever and it completely missed the point that you have a legal right to withdraw your child from religious worship which is not being respected.

Surely you knew this when you chose the school yet still chose it!

I'm pretty sure that the op's complaint would come into sharp focus if the scientologists rocked up at the school and were offered a platform to teach their beliefs as truth but did so through the medium of fun times, singing and arts and crafts.

They would be pleased to let you supervise your children when you choose to withdraw them or are you expecting someone else to rearrange their day for your convenience?

Er, she would have known that she had a legal right to exclude her child when she chose her school trotter.

If you don’t want your dc to be involved with religious assembly then the school should be respecting your wishes.

Eye rolling or dismissing your views is irrelevant, no reason the school should go against your request.

I would suggest the humanist society for advice and guidance on letters etc to send to the school

It's so hard OP.

I am in Scotland, sent my kids to a non denominatiobnal school, there was a lot pf religious indoctrionation, in assemblies ( local minister often preaching) but also in class, bible stories, prayer, chat about Jesus etc.
Kids were taken to church seberal times a year for worship.

And yjis was a " non faith " school. ( Although I understand there is no such thing in the UK)

I became a parent helper, I became a school governor, the head was not to be moved in the amount of christian indotrination he chose to deliver.
He was within his rights, in fat had a legal requiement to deliver worship ( which he does).

I did think about removing mu hildren from assembly, but didn't for several reasons.

Instead I worked on removing and "progamming" at home.

Happy to say they remained atheists ( as they were born) for theit childhood. But is was not easy.

Mathanxiety the branches of Catholicism are Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Coptic and Anglican.

Disappointingly, many teachers aren't that great. That's also part of the life skills our kids learn from school! Older doesn't mean wiser or more professional.

Gosh you're a treat @Putitdownnow! 🙄What's your career? If you've got school age DC, I'm very glad I'm not their teacher and on the receiving end of your views after my 60 hour week!

@pineapplepenthouse this is a really interesting thread. I'm Scottish, but work in England in a non-faith school. We have a prayer at the end of assembly sometimes, but that's literally it. Our assemblies contain no religious content. What's it like in Scotland?

I am in Scotland, sent my kids to a non denominatiobnal school, there was a lot pf religious indoctrionation, in assemblies ( local minister often preaching) but also in class, bible stories, prayer, chat about Jesus etc.
Kids were taken to church seberal times a year for worship.

@speakout It must be different in Scotland, as there's not nearly as much emphasis on this as there is in England (in my experience anyway!) unless you're at a faith school.

i'm finding lots of these answers v bizarre! totally unacceptable for a teacher to ignore a direct request for something that is your right as a parent to ask for:
www.gov.scot/publications/curriculum-for-excellence-religious-observance/

i would send the link above to the school by email, stating that as per para 21 you do not wish your children to participate in religious observation.

up to you whether you then say that you want a chance to come in and discuss exactly what that will mean in practical terms for both your children (i.e. are they doing drawing in a classroom/how are they being supervised), or if you've already been through that then i would add that if an incident occurs again where your wishes have been deliberately ignored you will consider making a formal complaint.

I sympathise with you. Views should be respected & taken seriously- doesn’t sound like the school is doing that at all so I echo others recommendations to hold a meeting.

My only concern is how do your children feel about it? It may be worth having a talk with them & seeing how far they’d like you to take it. I do remember one girl who was excluded from our religious assembly feeling very embarrassed, she stated she’d prefer to go & say a prayer from her own faith (silently) as she felt left out from the others.

Also are there any other parents who may feel the same? I’d be surprised if it’s just you who feels uncomfortable about it?

Good luck x

OP you say you have no religious views and neither do your children. Surely your children need to hear about the various religions and make their own informed decisions. I attended a religious assembly every day of my school life and enjoyed the hymns and the general school.messages. Many years later I attend church about three times a year !

Surely your children need to hear about the various religions and make their own informed decisions.

Surely to make an informed decision the children would have to be exposed to all religions being taught as truth?

I couldn't make an informed decision on which medicine to take if I only had access to the teachings of a homeopath.

There is, of course, a massive difference between a lesson about religion and an act of worship. A difference that many people find difficult to grasp-for reasons that escape me.

This link helps parents who’s children are being forced into compulsory worship OP, very good website worth taking a look...

www.secularism.org.uk/end-compulsory-worship/

@Janedoe5000 my world view is far from backward thank you very much.

I agree your decision to exclude should be respected as you are the parent. But.... personally I think it’s all a massive knee jerk over reaction to prove a point - not pointing directly at you OP but just in general. Ok so the idea of your children being brainwashed is totally worrying but REALLY is it brainwashing to have an occasional assembly or say a prayer . My daughter attended a catholic school and wasn’t brainwashed after 8 years of being there!! Sometimes the need to prove a point really goes too far . Oh and I am not religious at all .

My children go to a faith school and have collective worship every day. I am treating it the same as their belief in Santa or the Easter bunny and always counter things they talk about with facts or alternative religions' beliefs. So I'd say 'well that's what Christians believe but that is just one religion, other religions have other gods and other beliefs.' I want them to realise that these things are cherry picked beliefs, but not necessarily truths and that people choose to believe in all kinds of different things. When they ask what I believe, I say I am an atheist and believe in science. Some of their prayers are hilarious! I have overheard them praying lists of toys they want, like a holy shopping list of greed!

“Ok so the idea of your children being brainwashed is totally worrying but REALLY is it brainwashing to have an occasional assembly or say a prayer”
Probably not. But the point is that in order to take a full part in the life of a state funded non faith school you have to be at least a nominal Christian. Which must, surely, be wrong? Imagine having to say a prayer before taking a book out of the library or chucking something into the council tip!

I actually agree with you but the rage on this issue is usually misguided as the change (in England) needs to come from parliament.

We're in Scotland. Kids are in non-denominational schools.

There is some degree of religion in the assemblies. Once a month they have the local Church of Scotland minister leading the assembly at Primary school. He does a "talk" which you could argue was Christian but isn't explicitly about Jesus/God. He is sensitive to the fact their are cjildren in the audience who are of other religions so it's more about being kind to each other, looking after people who are less fortunate, doing your best. At Christmas/Easter there is more of the Jesus stuff but not much. The kids aren't taken to church. In the RE classes they learn about all major world religions.

At secondary they have no religious assemblies. There are school chaplains from all major religions around in school if children or staff wish to speak to them.

OP - the point is that wishes aren't being respected. Is switching schools an option? If they're P4, you're only half way through Primary. If you're not getting any joy with the head, it might be worth contacting the Chair of the Parent Council if there is one.

It surprises me that the USA (which I understand to be more religious than the UK) does not allow worship/prayer or indoctrination in its schools, but we do.
Many schools in the US teach creationism as fact.

Whilst yanbu as we are a different religion to our school. I don't withdraw dc simply because they don't want to be singled out. We just talk about what they have been told at school and say what we believe and then they can think what they like accordingly. It does piss me off sometimes but we have a bigger influence as they watch us and we talk about our religion whereas in school knowledge of religions always seems very vague and not explained very well. I did religious studies for a level and some of the text books were just not right next to my experience and my thoughts towards my religion. Ask if they want to go in. And then you can discuss your reasons for not believing these topics or whatever you are feeling.