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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to say that some people just cannot work full time or even at all?

349 replies

thebeesknees123 · 16/01/2019 11:52

This does seem to be an age old discussion among parents, particularly among women with young children.

I can think of various reasons why people can't work:

Just had a baby and breastfeeding
Mental or physical health conditions
Caring responsibilities - e.g. elderly relative
The money does not cover childcare/commute expenses

Personally, I do work (30 hours per week) but I am lucky in that it is shifts around the school so I don't have childcare costs. I would never slate someone who couldn't find something suitable for their needs or pressure them to take something that is going to cause them undue stress because they are put in a position where they are forced to be unreliable, which, frankly, I would be if I were forced to work 9 to 5.

OP posts:
blackteasplease · 16/01/2019 15:13

I just about manage to work full time (single parent, school aged kids) but only because my job allows flexible working, depending on job needs.

I can well imagine how some can't.

I have a professional qualification that makes it much easier to find work and also never stopped working. Once you stop I think you would find it harder to start again around kids.

cestlavielife · 16/01/2019 15:15

Each person decides... some opportunities cost money so it becomes dependent on earning. So when you want your child to go to uni open days...you need to.fund that

Not all opportunities are free...
Of course there are schemes for.low.income Sutton trust etc

treaclesoda · 16/01/2019 15:17

If you don't want to work because there is no financial benefit at the time, that's fine but you can't then expect to start working after years out and expect the same salary than those who didn't stop. It's a choice indeed.

It's not always a freely made choice though. When I had my first child I was working for a company where I started at 8am and had an hour and a half commute to get there. I had no option of starting and finishing later, and my husband had the same start time and the same commute. We couldn't both continue to work in the jobs we were in because there are no nurseries or childminders open at 6.30 am. In fact, where I live there are no local nurseries at all, it's childminder or nothing.

My husband earned far more money than me so he continued as he was and I had to spend my maternity leave looking for a new job. Which I found in the nick of time, but it was a temporary job and was part time. And then that led to another temporary job, with even less hours. And repeat. And then I ended up as a sahm because when I had a second child, the childcare costs outstripped what I was earning. And no matter how much better it would have been in the long term, how could we put food on the table in the meantime? We couldn't. Then on top of that, my parents became old, ill and disabled and I had to help look after them.

So yes, on the surface, I've made a decision to give up full time work just because I wanted to. But in reality much of it wasn't a decision in the true sense. It was just doing what I needed to do to survive at that time.

Ragwort · 16/01/2019 15:20

Some people are just unemployable, we learned that in Sociology A Level in the 1970s. My (part time) job involves working with volunteers, most have mental health issues, many of them would just not be suitable for the most straightforward of jobs, some tell me that they would like to be employed but, I don’t mean to be harsh, no employer would offer them paid employment.

Bumblebee39 · 16/01/2019 15:26

Lots of people can't work full time.
But it's always- oh, why is she on benefits with those kids and can't be bothered to work? Not why is the CSA so useless?

We have a system whereby a persons worth is judged on their earning potential unless they are already rich so can 'afford' not to work.

Which means that people who are mentally ill, disabled and/or have caring responsibilities for small children/disabled relatives/ elderly relatives are treated like second class citizens.

You have to go to work to earn a wage to pay somebody else to look after your young children or relatives who you would rather be looking after. It's bonkers. Oh, and to clean your house because you don't have time..

snurguzelly · 16/01/2019 15:32

"We have a system whereby a persons worth is judged on their earning potential unless they are already rich so can 'afford' not to work. "

That sounds to me more like a person being judged on their ability to support themselves or expecting others to support them.

BitchQueen90 · 16/01/2019 15:33

I am a single parent working PT school hours. Technically I could work full time but I would have to find and pay for wrap around childcare and it's not worth it with the wage I'm on. I'm staying PT until DS is old enough to come home from school by himself and be alone for a couple of hours.

I am lucky that I get good maintenance from my ex husband and I am putting as much money as I can into savings.

Firstty · 16/01/2019 15:36

If you don't work because it only covers the cost of childcare then please consider that you are a) not paying any taxes and b) not giving employment to someone working in childcare.

ReanimatedSGB · 16/01/2019 15:36

Plenty of wealthy people do no work and are supported by the labour of others. The entire royal family of parasites, for instance. All those who, by simple accident of birth, have a lot of property they can rent out and live (very well) on those rents without having to lift a finger.

And what about all those senior executives who earn something like 1000x the salary of their lowest-paid staff? Yes, the executive has more responsibility, more stress and may well 'work harder' (depending on the industry) but 1000 times harder really? The mess we are in now is completely down to a faulty economic theory which has effectively transferred money and assets from the poor to the rich, yet the poor are the ones who get blamed.

WFTisgoingoninmyhead · 16/01/2019 15:37

My DD is due her first baby and she works in a nursery, they pay her minimum wage and their fees are £8 an hour. There is literally no way she can go back to work. Also she is inherently lazy so doesn't want to, but she may have done!!!

TheNavigator · 16/01/2019 15:39

There is no doubt many people cannot work, my relative used to volunteer at the CAB & would get them coming in - poor mental health, alcohol and other addictions, barely able to cope with life, let alone be an attractive prospect for an employer. What can you do? You can't assassinate the useless, we need to support them and be grateful we have the health and well being to be able to do so. It is the basis of our tax system.

NopSlide · 16/01/2019 15:39

If you don't work because it only covers the cost of childcare then please consider that you are a) not paying any taxes and b) not giving employment to someone working in childcare.

People don't go to work as a charity to the state/childcare workers...

Ragwort · 16/01/2019 15:40

Firsty, I don’t pay tax because I earn under the tax threshold. Does that make me a second class citizen? Confused. I chose to work part time, I am over 60, my DH earns enough so that we have a comfortable life style, we don’t need tax credits etc. My contribution to society is through the volunteering & community work I do, not just by ‘paying tax’.

RomanyRoots · 16/01/2019 15:41

firstty
I'm not responsible to make sure childcare workers get paid. There is no problem for them though as working parents are queing for their services.
Plenty people who work don't pay tax as they don't earn enough.

partypooper40 · 16/01/2019 15:42

Just a quick point - I pay someone to clean my house because I don't want to. I thought that was a benefit of earning money - not something I am missing out on....

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 16/01/2019 15:43

What other benefit would there be? I can’t think of anything else that you’d prioritise above spending time with your kids. You work if you have to because you need the money (assuming you’re one of the lucky ones whose salary would cover the cost of childcare)

Lots of people work because they enjoy it and want to continue to progress with their careers. It is possible to work and still be a parent.

snurguzelly · 16/01/2019 15:43

@ReanimatedSGB

We live in a free market where those with skills worth more earn more money. For example, Ronaldo would likely make a better nurse than a good nurse would make a top-flight footballer.

You may not like it but that doesn't change facts.

You have completely misunderstood the way distribution of value works. It isn't that a chairman (or lady chairman - wouldn't want to be sexist) works 1,000 times harder, it's that their skills are 1,000 times more valuable. It's lack of skills, education and expertise which mean the board members earn so much more than those at the bottom of the chain. The CFO could likely work on the shop floor but the same reversal would be catastrophic.

Do you understand yet?

Original poster
thebeesknees123 · 16/01/2019 15:45

There was a back to the floor type programme on tv a while ago where a ceo got fired from the production line for being too slow

OP posts:
anxiousmotherof1 · 16/01/2019 15:45

I work full time . I dont need to money wise but i need to because satying put a few years and then finding a job in my field and. Rh same level qould be impossible

CosmicComet · 16/01/2019 15:52

Lots of people work because they enjoy it and want to continue to progress with their careers

I enjoyed my job. I’d have loved to continue. But I can’t because I wasn’t paid enough. You can’t work just because you enjoy it. You need to be paid as well.

snurguzelly · 16/01/2019 15:52

@thebeesknees123

I said "likely". DS1 is an Aspie. Headhunted by Uber (accounting) and retired at 31. He wouldn't last a morning in a customer facing role.

I think that these are the anomalies which prove the point though. His specialization is worth more than others as it's rarer and more valuable in the free market.

Brakebackcyclebot · 16/01/2019 15:52

it conveys a belief that the only benefit of working is salary

What other benefit would there be? I can’t think of anything else that you’d prioritise above spending time with your kids

Can you really not think of any other benefits to work?

I work because:

  • it stimulates my brain in a way that spending time with my kids doesn't
  • it gives me an identity outside being a mother
  • I want to be able to support myself independently should I need to (and I did need to 10 years ago when my then DH left me very suddenly)
  • I would go stir crazy if all I did was look after my kids

And other people will have zillions of other reasons!

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 16/01/2019 15:54

A job you love more than your kids? Stop being so silly. They're not mutually exclusive

Of course they are. You can’t be in two places at once! You’re either at work or at home with your kids. You’re not going to work for zero profit if it deprives you of time with your kids

CosmicComet Are you really saying that women who go out to work don't love their kids? Don't love them as much as SAHP? Insulting and fucking ridiculous in equal measure.

What about dads? I guess most of them couldn't care less about their children by your logic?

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 16/01/2019 15:55

I enjoyed my job. I’d have loved to continue. But I can’t because I wasn’t paid enough. You can’t work just because you enjoy it. You need to be paid as well. Well obviously but it is possible to paid and enjoy it at the same time!!

CosmicComet · 16/01/2019 15:56

Yes but you must have a decent wage PLUS those other benefits of working. If you aren’t paid enough to afford to work then it doesn’t matter if you feel stimulated and independent and fulfilled. You can’t work just because you enjoy it.