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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Would you pay back this 10k?

507 replies

cantchooseyourfamily · 06/01/2019 04:25

I'm looking for some advice, I was really ill over the last few years and managed to get treatment overseas that cost almost £50,000. The treatment was somewhat experimental at the time but is now available on the NHS, however I couldn't afford to wait and see if it would start being offered on the NHS so we made the decision that we would pay and I would go abroad for it.

Before I went for the treatment I wasn't sure about going, was worried about leaving my children and was also worried because I was about £10,000 short with being able to pay for it. DH and I have good jobs and are very lucky, we would have been able to get hold of the last 10k within a few months and were prepared to wait until we had it before I went ahead.

However, my mother offered to give me the remaining money and was insistent it was a gift, I asked several times over the following months if I should pay it back and she was insistent that it was fine, it was a gift, she wanted to help, etc. At that point we had the 10k and could have given it back, no issue.

Not that it necessarily matters but she's fairly well off with different companies and a few properties. This all happened over a year ago, I've moved on, am doing well health wise and have not thought about the money much, other than to feel grateful. Now out of nowhere she has messaged saying she's having business problems and wants the money back. I'm so upset, I hadn't factored this in, have my own stuff going on have made investments and purchases this year that I would not have done had I thought this was a loan rather than a gift. If I don't give it to her the family fall out will be huge, with my sister's and mother likely disowning me. On the other hand I think it's a rubbish way to treat me. There's so much more to the backstory but I wasn't raised by my mum and had very little to do with her until I was in my 20's, didn't meet my sister's until they were older and so on. I'm quite sure this would be the end of our fragile relationship but don't know if it might be for the best anyway. I couldn't imagine gifting my children a house deposit or sum of money to help with there wedding or medical treatment and then asking for it back a year later.

I'm very upset and wondering if I should just pay it back or not?

I also can't help remembering times over the last few years when she has paid for very expensive holidays and bought cars and things for her other children, none of which bothered me at the time, I didn't need anything from her and am a bit older. I can't help thinking she won't be asking for those gifts back from her other children and it's just another way in which I'm treated very differently.

OP posts:
selepele · 07/01/2019 13:11

if she actually said it was a gift then no or i would pay it back slowly then not speak to her again

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 07/01/2019 14:07

Wow, fuck that for a response!! "emotional energy" my arse - she just can't be bothered to argue.

I feel that I would need to pay the money back, even if it did hurt me financially for a while, just to be rid of her. But yes, I would then go NC - call it a terminal settlement and cut all contact.

Or I might consider paying back only half of it - as a "good will" gesture - but keeping the other half as the gift it was meant to be.

But in reality, I think I'd do the former - I couldn't bear to keep that money after this attitude!

So sorry your egg donor is such a bitch, OP. Flowers

billybagpuss · 07/01/2019 14:19

If it was paid out of the business, how did she account for it originally.

Are the accounts due and they are only just now trying to justify it to the accountants?

Ngp64 · 07/01/2019 14:23

I completely understand why you are torn. It was a gift NOT a loan but she is your mum whether you’re close or not.

There may be a family fall out but would she also hold it over you in the future if there isn’t much fall out and you don’t pay it? Could you not ask your siblings to help too as she is their mum too (maybe she is only asking you because she knows you are the one most likely to be able to get her that sum).

Personally I’d reiterate all this that you have said - it was a gift (show/ send screenshots or copies of this if you have it writing), you can’t spare the funds immediately anyway & that if she desperately needs it you’re willing to work as a family to raise the money all putting in to the pot so all this pressure isn’t on you. I’d then raise the remaining money if you all chip in & have it to hand next time she asks for anything then she can’t expect you to bail her out.

You are under no obligation to ‘pay her back’.

DarlingNikita · 07/01/2019 14:24

If it was paid out of the business, how did she account for it originally.

Yeah, I think it whiffs a bit.

SimplyPut · 07/01/2019 14:26

Oh @cantchooseyourfamily you are better off without them all. Paying back this money will merely afford you the ability to cut the last string they can pull. Pay it back as you can comfortably afford over a timeframe that works for you and your family.

A biological mother and a mother are two separate things. You can choose your family, choose your future!

HubbleBubbleBlahBlahBlah · 07/01/2019 14:30

Perhaps tell your mother to tell her business partners that they'll need to deal with your husband to save yourself the emotional expense here too?

And let them know you'll need some formal notice of how this was a loan and what their expectations are for repayment as you & your husband believed it was a gift and so now your confused when their terms are on the loan as it was never called a loan before and it certainly wasn't a business expense from your side as it was used for a personal medical expense as they well know.

Stay strong OP. Thanks

GinandGingerBeer · 07/01/2019 14:36

Wow Sad
Money aside, how upsetting for you. I'd block the lot of them and tell them to swivel. ( but if I could afford it, I'd pay it back in one penny pieces delivered to their business premises, then my conscience would be clear)

MrsMaker88 · 07/01/2019 15:00

My parents would never ask me to repay money given as a gift even if they had business problems. £10k is not worth hurting your daughter this much surely.
If she is really struggling and thinks you might have easy access to the money as you did before then I guess it may be understandable but still. Have you actually talked face to face to understand what the hell is going on?

I agree with poster that said you may need some counselling with all of this.

You are not some creditor to chase, you are family! Is her husband very mean / controlling???

Giraffey1 · 07/01/2019 16:02

Fir me, the bottom line here is how you perceive your relationship with your mum in the future. If you really want some semblance of a family link, then I think I would pay back the money. However, I’d be writing something like this ...

Mum, I’m sorry you find yourself in financial difficulties. However, I find it very hard to understand why the money you pressed upon me and insisted on multiple occasions was a gift, you are now saying was a loan. At no point in the past have you every said the money was a loan, and it’s really disappointing that now you are changing your mind. I wish that you’d simply said you were having money troubles and was there anything I could do to help. I also hope you have approached my siblings to ask for their help. I’m afraid I don’t have that kind of money available ‘just like that’ and I have other financial commitments I must honour, ... then suggest repayment plan at so much per month to suit you, and not her. Or offer to pay back s percentage, with each of your siblings doing the same!

You may feel this route is morally easier to deal with, leaving you with a clearer conscience going forward.

If you have no emotional capital invested in prolonging what sounds like a rather damaged relationship I think you would be within in your rights to tell your mother you are very sorry, but the money was a gift to help with your illness, was spent to that end, that you were and are grateful for that gift, but that you will not be repaying any money.

HowardSpring · 07/01/2019 16:26

Of course you should give her the money. She gave you 10k when you needed it. Now she is in trouble and has asked for your help. You have the money. You are clearly not poor. Why wouldn't you give it back with a smile and good wishes for her business troubles.

Alternatively you could keep it, enjoy her difficulties and deal with the fall out from the rest of the family.

cantchooseyourfamily · 07/01/2019 16:26

Thanks again everyone.

I've had some very unpleasant massages accusing me of ruining her life, I think she's drunk as it's not making much sense. It seems she will now be ousted from the company and her husband and her are separating (apparently the separation was happening already and isn't a result of this money but the ousting from the company is definitely my fault).

She set up a group chat with the company accountant and I reiterated my position, that this was a gift and had been used for it's intended purposes. I said I was willing to pay back at X amount per month in the interests of keeping family relations civil. That set off a fresh tirade so it seems there's no winning here unless I transfer the whole lot.

OP posts:
DarlingNikita · 07/01/2019 16:28

God Almighty.

Maybe give her to tomorrow to sober up and see if she/the accountant keep sending messages and take it from there?

cantchooseyourfamily · 07/01/2019 16:29

Howard if you helped your children pay for a wedding or house deposit with a monetary gift, would you then ask a year later for that money back? Would you rewrite history and suddenly decide it was a loan instead of a gift?

OP posts:
MarshaBradyo · 07/01/2019 16:30

She sounds in a bad position

Could you pay the whole lot if you decided to?

Coolhwip · 07/01/2019 16:33

I'm guessing history is repeating itself and the mum is once again scapegoating OP with her problems.

MrsMaker88 · 07/01/2019 16:42

Yup agree with coolhwip

I very much doubt getting back 10k is going to resolve their issues. Are they just using you in an argument? You’ve said your bit. Come off the group chat, let her sober up, it’s nothing to do with the accountant is it?
Let them fight it out. I don’t know the full story but based on what you’ve said it’s time to kindly and firmly set some boundaries. As upsetting for you as may be in the short term.

Stay strong, you’ve been through a lot, you can do this. I’m sure if she was needing emergency medical treatment or was being made homeless you’d get some money together for her. It doesn’t sound like she’s desperate, just involving you in some dramas

Tistheseason17 · 07/01/2019 16:42

YANBU OP.
You have done the right thing. If she cocked up on how she gave the money to you that is her problem - she's an experienced business woman, right?
You are a better person than me as I would not have offered to pay back a penny of her "toxic gift"
She's vile and you are better off without her.
Block, ignore and move on.

MrsMaker88 · 07/01/2019 16:45

Could you ask the accountant is there is some sort of serious trouble she is in? Facing prison for non payment of taxes...?! If you can’t have a grown up conversation with your family..

LimpidPools · 07/01/2019 16:50

I'm sorry for your hurt and disappointment OP. She's never going to be who you hoped she would. And you won't be able to reason with her either.

You will need to focus on doing what's right for you and on trying to avoid getting hurt by her any further. The "right" thing to do has no place here, it's a matter of self-preservation.

Ethel36 · 07/01/2019 16:51

I think you've handled it well. You explained it was a gift, and offered to pay it back in instalments. She's being very unreasonable, and treating you poorly. She hadn't asked her other children for a refund from their gifted holidays etc has she?!

Mitzimaybe · 07/01/2019 16:53

Oh OP this must be so upsetting for you and it's a really shitty thing your mother has done. You haven't answered whether you have evidence in writing (e.g. emails) of you offering to repay and her saying no, it's a gift.

I think I'd be saying, "We had the money to repay you last November" (or whenever your husband's bonus came) and offered at that time, but as you insisted that it was a gift and was not to be repaid, that money is now tied up and we can't afford £10k at this moment. We can pay £500/month until it's settled."

But honestly it may be better for you just to pay it and not have it hanging over you.

keely79 · 07/01/2019 16:55

I wonder if there's an issue with her having withdrawn money from the company for personal payments and now that they are separating, the accounts are being looked at more carefully. If she was a director at the time and took the money out improperly, she could be liable for breach of duties, fraud, etc.

cantchooseyourfamily · 07/01/2019 17:04

I don't have any emails or messages even mentioning the money until a few days ago.

I do think something is going on with the company but as I said earlier I had actually thanked her husband for the money shortly after receiving it, he was definitely aware of it.

OP posts:
DarlingNikita · 07/01/2019 17:04

keely79, yes I wonder about that too.