To admit I didn't vote in the Brexit Referendum?

[WeAreTheCrystalGems]

I'm one of the 28% who didn't vote. Anyone else?

@Clueing4looks - in the French presidential election the number of spoiled papers was noticeably huge. Before extremist nutters took over, the Gilets Jaunes were clearly made up of a lot of these voices.

@noodlenosefraggle sorry if I misunderstood your post but when you say it didn't affect the outcome as your area was remain, the ref was 1 person one vote all counted equally. Not fptp like GE. So every vote really did count (not that 1vote from your dh would have swung it to remain though)

Catsize
If we had the chance to vote again, I'd vote 'leave'. Without hesitation.
Do you want Hard Brexit or to stay in the Customs Union?

I didn't vote. I didn't feel I knew enough about it,

Thus puzzles me. Many people who did vote probably knew a lot less than you do.

The ramifications were not clear, and there was a lot of scaremongering.

I agree the ramifications were unclear. On the other hand, you didn't know about enough about it to vote, but you did know enough about it to know what was scaremongering as opposed to simply scary? How does that work? It hasn't happened yet and some of the possible outcomes people talk about are still scary. So which of the possible outcomes that people talked about at the time do you now think are just scaremongering - that is, made up on purpose just to scare us and can't really happen?

There are several different systems of PR. List systems where all votes are counted nationally and seats awarded totally proportionally are used very rarely.

There are pros and cons to the various systems but FPTP has some major flaws that make it one of the worst imo. The feeling that your vote doesn't count and the disillusionment that this causes very damaging.

I’ll have to look into it some more before giving an answer as I’m not sure. I don’t think I’d be comfortable saying yes when there’s a chance someone like UKIP could end up with more seats this way.

Mousse I was giving the briefest of outlines to get the gist across

Clueing
When UKIP had a real chance of winning a seat, enough of the protest voters blinked and stopped them. (Thanet)

More to the point if the UK moved to PR then parties like the LibDems and the Greens would have much MORE representation.
Do some reading at the Electoral Reform Society site - its really interesting.

not really. EU membership is a technical question [do the net economic benefits of EU membership outweigh the costs?]. your or my opinion on this is roughly as useful as it would be on the relative merits of two different types of heart transplant.

In more proportional systems minority parties and extremist parties do get representation.

This is actually not a bad thing. Yes they are bonkers but - freedom of speech. Even people you disagree with have a right to representation.
Also when given a voice and a role it often becomes clear how crap they are. UKIP should be riding high and controlling the Brexit debate but they have spiralled out of control, they are now linked with facists and racists.

When people have an outlet they 'feel' like they have a voice. And one thing we should learn from the Brexit fiasco is that how some people feel matters more than logic and reasoned arguments.

Mousse
PR also allows parties to split ....
The Tories and Labour are now such broad churches that they are more at war with themselves than each other.
Changing to PR would allow both parties to split in three and then coalitions of the sane parts to take power.

Exactly, more proportional systems allow for nuance. Which Labour Party do you want to vote for?

It would take a lot of public education though. Deals are made after elections and compromise is needed. Deals, compromise and cooperation are dirty words in British politics.

Having spent most of the last 2 years explaining (ad Infinitum) the British constitution (it was an advisory referendum) and that the EU is democratic I'm not sure if the British public could cope!

Thus puzzles me. Many people who did vote probably knew a lot less than you do.

Didn't Churchill say 'the best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter'?

Before extremist nutters took over, the Gilets Jaunes were clearly made up of a lot of these voices.

The extremist nutters and the "gentils" (gentle) GJs share a lot of the same opinions (notably, being comfortable with voting for, or not opposing, fascists).

EU membership is a technical question [do the net economic benefits of EU membership outweigh the costs?]. your or my opinion on this is roughly as useful as it would be on the relative merits of two different types of heart transplant.

Totally agree with this, and I'd note that asking people to choose between different types of Brexit is even less useful.

One of my good friends didn't vote because she didn't feel informed enough. I think that's fair enough, but it does show how poorly conducted the 2016 referendum must have been if many felt they didn't understand what was at stake. I also feel that the polls in the run up meant that many people who were fine with the status quo, couldn't be bothered to vote as they thought it would be remain - especially the younger voters ... and some young people have indeed said this to me. Remember that Glastonbury was on at the time! I do think that given all of this, and that what is now on offer from May and the No Deal Brexit scenario are far removed from what was originally promised, we should have another chance to vote. If a second ref came back with Leave, then the answer is clear ... but unless/until that happens, I really don't think it is clear and we will all have to live with the consequences for a generation at least.

Surely we'll be the laughing stock of Europe if we crawl back and change our tune?

We are a laughing stock already.

Surely we'll be the laughing stock of Europe if we crawl back and change our tune?
(a) The UK is already an utter laughing stock
(b) The relief if A50 was revoked would be so tangible that Brits would be welcomed with open arms everywhere.

The feeling that your vote doesn't count and the disillusionment that this causes very damaging

Interesting that (IMO) this is the major cause of why we are at this point. Its a shame that some posters can't see this and still believe that their view is the only view worthy of note.

Its a shame that some posters can't see this and still believe that their view is the only view worthy of note.
On all sides of the topic

We are a laughing stock already.

Strange how people are still desperate to move here though isn't it? Why not move to Romania instead?

I've been thinking about the views and fact issue. All views are worthy of note, but if those views are factually incorrect they need to be challenged.

Brexit supporters see Brexit as an act of faith, like religion. I believe in God, I am a Muslim, I am a Hindu. And that's fine, lovely. I can agree to disagree and show interest and respect in a faith based issue.

Some aspects are too complicated for me - the point about economics and heart surgery struck home. Yep I can agree to disagree.

However, some aspects of the pro Brexit argument are factually inaccurate. I can't agree to disagree when you tell me grass is blue. The EU is democratic.

When Brexit supporters put forward factually incorrect arguments pretending these are valid is just patronising.

Because not many people speak Romanian?

I would imagine that the countries currently providing us with food won't want to lose that revenue?

Jesus wept. Do people still not understand what is going on? Please... watch a wide range of news, read a range of courses, inform yourselves before coming out with stuff like this. (Notice the Y2K bug has made a couple of appearances on this thread, too. What a surprise.)

I proudly voted to leave

QED