in-laws with problematic views

[Sleeplessinthecountry]

Have NC for this, and don't want to put much specific/identifying detail. It's more of a WWYD.

DH comes from a different country from where we live, and one where certain sections of society are, even now, completely racist (He is not, even the slightest). I have very strong views on any form of predjudice/racism etc and am not at all afraid to express them if I come across this. I have actually thrown "friends" (now ex-friends) out of my house in the past for expressing homophobic views, for example.

DH has very little contact with his family. He doesn't have any contact at all with some of them and the rest he hasn't seen in many years. He has very little in common with most of them, less so every year that he lives in the country where we live (my home country, where he moved to to be with me, fifteen years ago). He has had a little Facebook contact in recent years with a few of them, stuff like catching up with what has happened to people's kids in adulthood, seeing family snaps, wishing happy Christmas etc.

Over Christmas he had a message from a close (close in blood tie, not in relationship) family member who might be travelling with her husband to where we live and naturally would like to see us. Of course I said great, I have never met any of these people and it would be really interesting. I even said why don't they come and stay with us for a few days. These people are getting on in years and it may be DH's last chance to actually see them (he never travels back to his country of origin).

He then explained to me that I would basically have to bite my tongue if these people were around as they are completely racist, to the point they would be certain to not only be casually be racist in conversation without even realising it is a problem, but also to use language that we would find completely unaccaptable (think the "N word", it's not that word exactly but another word just as offensive if not more so, which is used by true racists in their country). They would even be quite likely to do things like refusing to get on public transport if people of another colour were on it, or to refusing to eat somewhere of people of another colour were also eating. That is the level of racism we are talking about. It sounds shocking to most people but it is still present (although thankfully no longer that widespread) in parts of the country they come from.

I said I was not sure I would be able to promise to keep my tongue in those circumstances. DH understands it's a difficult situation but asked me to do so just this once, these people are his family, he would like to see them after so many years, they would like to see him, they are old and we will not be likely to ever see them again. Could I not just set my beliefs aside for a day or two, in the full knowledge that DH is as appalled by racism as I am?

Bear in mind that DH is a very isolated person, family-wise. His parents have been dead for many years, he is estranged from some of his family, and those he does have contact with, the contact is minimal. I still have both parents, and siblings (they live in other countries from me as well, but we are all very much in contact and see each other when we can). So basically I have family and a feeling of belonging to a heritage and background. He is completely cut off from his and I think that must be very difficult.

WWYD?

@Patroclus

That figures, Eastern Europe is notorious for that now that I think about it. And homophobia as well (my late abusive F (Czech) was shockingly homophobic).

I'm sure there are occasional such incidents in this country, but there were far more of those back in the 1980s before it became a criminal offence. The FA takes it very seriously as well, bans football supporters for racist behaviour now. It was part of a package of measures to combat hooliganism in football.

I did a long special study on the Taylor report into football following Hillsborough at uni, hence my interest in the subject. (I never watch football, except when my DH watches Match of the Day in bed, it helps me get to sleep. )

Hi again, thanks for the replies and thoughts. All very thought-provoking and has helped me sort out my thoughts.

Just to answer one question, no they certainly don't have British passports, I don't think there is a single non-Afrikaner in that side of DH's family tree for as many generations back as you can see. I cannot see any way they would be coming here to live, they would not have any right to for a start, and anyway they wouldn't want to and would have no way of surviving here (they are elderly farmers, they are not going to leave their family farm). DH in the only person in his family, as far as we are aware, that ever left southern Africa except to fight in WW2. He himself had never left Africa before he met me.

Birdsgottafly that is exactky how it often is. Not necessarily open obvious racism but things like expressing surprise (often disguised as admiration) at a well-dressed black person, or laughing uncomtrollably at a black person in public because they hear them speaking in a British rather than a "black" accent (I have seen this myself). And then when called up on it, excusing it by saying how the clothing/accent took them so much by such surprise (and I don't buy that at all because no-one can have avoided seeing plenty of well-dressed black people in movies and on TV with British or American accents).

Sleeplessinthecountry, I know that well, you'd have to experience it to understand it. Or watch Katie Hopkins in Big Brother.

(sorry about weird grammar in last post!). I don't think I could stand KH for long enough to see anything! (when she used to be on LBC I would literally sprint to turn the radio off)...

I would hate this scenario. The thing is... why aren't they abiding by the rules 'When in Rome....'

I have travelled a lot. I cover my arms and head if necessary in mosques, temples etc. I read about a country before I go because I don't want to offend anyone. Your DH needs to speak to them and spellit out.
'I know you have racist views. You cannot show even a hint of that in our country'. If they laugh, argue, disagree and he thinks they're not taking it in, I honestly think they shouldn't come over.

I would be on edge the whole time they're with you if they come.

FWIW, I went to Cape Town and we had 8 hours booked with a white afrikan tour guide. I was ashamed to be in his company. I called the tour to an end after 3 hours. He geared the tour to everything 'white' and wouldn't even walk near a statue of Nelson Mandela, and how he spoke to lovely black staff in a cafe was absolutely appalling. I was shocked and felt quite sick.

Because it is so ingrained, they can’t modify their behaviour when here

They don’t see any problem with it so why would they modify their behaviour?

It’s black and white thinking, literally

Yes, the "when in Rome" thing does not work if you just have no idea that people in Rome have any different mindset or customs from your own...

I don't know at all that these specific people would think like that, but I have known plenty of people who would not have a clue, and these relatives do happen to be people who have never been anywhere, and as far as I am aware are not particularly educated regarding the rest of the world (and please don't think I am questioning their intelligence, I doubt they are stupid, they are successful farmers and have successful children who are professionals, it is just that they probably live very much in their own world, from what I have been told).

I can't dictate whether or not they should come over here, they are not coing specifically to see me/us, they said thay are coming to the country and wanted to know if we are anywhere near where they are going to be (still a mystery why they are going there, DH has messaged them asking them but no reply yet).

All I can do is decide on the type and level of contact I have with them and what planning/advice is required in advance of me encountering them (or them encountering me...)

You are going to find it difficult to be in their company OP, I don’t doubt that. I suppose you’ll have to keep contact as minimal as possible, meet for lunch somewhere busy, not in your home, so that you can leave.

Yes maybe. It is a difficult one though. My DH is a renowned social entertainer, cook etc, loves nothing more than having an impromptu braai for hordes of people, and is known for his hospitality and parties (and they know that about him). The normal thing for him to do when ever anyone is within travelling distance of where we live (or even to where we go on holiday) is to invite them (whether they are old friends, family, friends of family, friends of children, children of friends etc etc....) for a braai/spit-braai, beach party, whetever, with him doing all the cooking. It would be unheard of to just meet people for lunch somewhere if they happened to be in the country...but that may be what we have to do...

He must take your feelings into account though OP. Let him pay for their meal, take them somewhere fancy, then you can leave

I will have to think about all the options...

Tricky.

I think in your shoes I would agree with DH that I would not say anything if their comments were subtle enough to go over DC’s head. However if they were obviously racist enough for DC to understand then I would have to say something - not start a row, or kick them out, but say something like “I know you hold those views but we don’t and in the UK that kind of comment is considered offensive”. I’d try to agree the “script” in advance with DH basically.

And I would try to stay home with them as much as possible so that they don’t encounter anyone to or about whom they may say racist comments. That also fits with your DH’s hospitable character and reputation. Going out for a meal seems likely to bring trouble.

Having them in your home sounds intolerable, I know I couldn’t do it.

I'll go totally against what others have said and I would call them out on every racist comment they make - regardless of DH.

I would ensure I took them out and about and ensure they came into contact with as many black and ethnic people as I could. That way, they would never come and visit again. Regardless of the being 'family' their views are totally unacceptable.

They'd not be stepping foot in my house or allowed near my children. I would think less of my Husband if he suggested compromising my principles. In fact it would be a deal breaker. But my Husband wouldn't allow people like this in our lives under any circumstance anyway. I don't envy your position op.

There's no doubt their views are likely to be unacceptable. There is equally no doubt that they won't be able to alter them. Another thing of which there is no doubt is that I won't sit by and let people say racist things in my company, whether or not DC is there. DH knows that and that he cannot change that. The only real option appears to be him having a word with them in advance, which won't change their views but may just prevent them from saying something unaccaptable. Even that is difficult though, as I and others have noted above, this type of lifelong, un-examined racism is not entirely conscious so they may not realise what could be offensive (as in the example earlier of making much of how well-dressed a black person is).

Lucy they are not going to come back again whatever we do, and whoever they encounter, I am quite sure. This sort of trip will be an enormous deal for people like these (in terms of effort, energy. money etc), and they are pretty old and not in the greatest health...
I would call them out on racist comments though, that is the issue. I won't be able to help myself.

Waitrose they really aren't in our lives. DH broke away from his background years ago.

The problem is that if you say "no contact with racist people" that means for him basically "no contact with anyone in your family over 40". It's hard for him (although he doesn't express it)

I can't quite get my head round it Sleep. I appreciate you have your family and heritage and all that, and your DH has very little but I can't work out why he would want to see them? You say he broke away from his background years ago, I presume that included them?

I just know my DH would have little in common with relations like this so really couldn't be arsed. For instance, he has little family too, but has this distant cousin we send exchange Christmas cards with. This man is ultra religious to the point of ridiculousness (everyone to their own I know...) He sends us all this religious guff at Christmas, that's fine we pay little attention to it, but no way would my DH want to actually meet up with him. We return a Christmas card out of politeness, that's it.

I don't think he will be devastated if he doesn't see them but it would be sad. Not once has anyone from his family come to this country so this would be a big thing, also others in the family would no doubt be asking "oh did you see [DH]? He lives near there!" . None of them would understand at all if he said to them well we don't want to meet you... (or even well, his wife refuses to meet you etc...). They would not in a milion years see themselves as a problem if you see what I mean...
These are not distant cousins, they are very close relatives indeed (think, the closest you could get)...

Apologies for the passport red herring.
If this is likely to be the one and only time you'll see them, you can grit your teeth and play the gracious hostess
I'd set them up in the lounge with tea and biccies and leave them to it - "you must be exhausted after that long flight, I'm just popping out to get the car washed, see you in an hour or so"
If you can't avoid a braai, make it a small and low-key event. Invite one or two friends you've pre-warned.
Otherwise just focus on the fact this is one very rare time you'll get to hear about DH's family history.