that it has just hit me that this time next year I wont be an EU citizen

[garethsouthgatesmrs]

I know it's yet another brexit thread but it genuinely just hit me that it's actually happening THIS YEAR! I am truly gutted. Would love someone with political knowledge to come on and reassure me that it actually won't be that bad. I have 3 children who have to live with the repercussions.

buble is on jules holland-this has to be a good sign

@SusanWalker where does it say that? We need to move into a dynamic trading position.
I guess according to remainders we are destroying the UK just because we want to live like peasants. We like the sound of poverty and economic disadvantage.
I look at Greece with envy leaving the EU utopia.

What I don’t understand is why 17.4 million leave voters should have to justify and explain why they voted leave.

Bottom line is the majority wanted out and despite many remain voters saying their leave voting neighbour/ brother/ cousin etc voted out but has since changed their mind, their are MILLIONS who will have undoubtedly NOT have changed their mind on voting to leave.

What I don’t understand is why 17.4 million leave voters should have to justify and explain why they voted leave.

Ds: I’m really looking forward to Xmas!
Me: ooh what are you most looking forward to?
Ds: presents! Pudding! Playing games!

Brexiteers on a ‘discussion’ site on a political thread.
Brexiteer: I can’t wait for brexit
Everyone else: what are you looking forward to?
Brexiteer: how dare you.

@onelittleclara my gosh stop with your sadness. Have you ever lived,work or learn another European language. Likely the answer is no.
Europe can and will trade with us. They need our money.
When you talk about us leavers not knowing what we voted for is absurd. Most of my friends voted to leave. Well Educated and knowledgable people.
I won't apologise for voting leave because I know we are heading towards amazing opportunities as global, dynamic global players.
We also have a young family and we know sometimes you have to create change to see further than your nose.

@RedWineIsFabulous - are you in favour of WA or do you want to flush us all down the toilet with you in No Deal?
I don't give a shiny shit about whether Leave means leave or other bollocks like that. Get over it. I only care about whether we have WA or No Deal.

@Bluejag
We need to move into a dynamic trading position.
Who will we trade with after Brexit that we do not already trade with?

@bellinisurge what is it to get over? I voted to leave.
Sounds like you need to get over it?

@bluejag
I know we are heading towards amazing opportunities as global, dynamic global players.
Nice sound bite.
Could you explain what you expect it to mean in progress?
Which dynamic bits of the globe does the UK not deal with at present?

I’m hoping for a miracle I moved from the uk last year. I earn fuck all but will progress given time. I’m scared I don’t want to go back To the uk I was born in a ex British colony I just keep thinking I will be forced to live somewhere I wasn’t born...I’m so angry about it all I barely survived in the uk I often went hungry or was cold. My life is better here.

If they all stop coming i will miss that too. And they are mostly farm.workers so not covered by the new high skilled immigration policy.
Absolutely gross generalisation. I work closely with many families who come from a variety of EU countries. Many ARE skilled with their own businesses.

Obtaining visas is not hard

Oh dear

Actually, its not. Having worked in countries including Africa and Canada, it is not that hard. There are harder things in life.

We're still part of Europe, just won't be part of EU. Wonder which country will choose to leave next?
Absolutely. Whilst this mess is going on in Britain, many are failing (or choosing) to notice the fact that some countries are near to collapse IN the EU. There were definitely be other countries leaving in the future and lets not forget those currently close to financial collapse.

If you are so desperate to live/ work/retire in a different country, go through the process and become a citizen of your chosen country.
If Britain isn't good enough, why worry about being British. Go where you choose, just like millions of other people have.

Absolutely. I have friends who have become citizens of the States and Canada. Involved paperwork, but that is the way it is.

@onelittleclara my gosh stop with your sadness. Have you ever lived,work or learn another European language. Likely the answer is no.
Europe can and will trade with us. They need our money.
When you talk about us leavers not knowing what we voted for is absurd. Most of my friends voted to leave. Well Educated and knowledgeable people.

This: possibly one of few posts that talk sense on this thread. I too would be interested to know how many ‘EU citizens’ in this country who feel their birth right is being taken away actually KNOW anything more than the obvious about Europe.

How many on here have worked across Europe, worked with/know/actually spoken to British citizens from a variety of EU countries, how many know how we entered the EU in the first place, how many know about key legislation such as fishing rights that have negatively affected British industry for 4 decades, which legislation concerning areas such as human rights, trade, environment, agriculture, competition, employment policy etc, etc you know about.
If people do, fair enough. But if as a remain protester you DON’T, do the knowledgeable remain voters a favour and find a stone to crawl under.

As a resident of Northern Ireland I'm disappointed that we still don't know what Brexit will mean for us. There are plenty of people living and working around the border who cross in the Republic on a daily basis and they're still in limbo over what is going to happen. We spent many happy holidays skipping between Fermanagh and Donegal on family holidays and some of my in laws live over the border, my PIL regularly visit them. What will happen after Brexit? Is there going to be a hard border? It's 3/4 months away, this should all be sorted by now! We're applying for Irish passports, and will get one for our baby when they're born in June also, any time we travel to mainland Europe (2-4 times a year) we fly out of and into Dublin airport, it's all been so easy up until now but who knows what's to come.

I really feel for families caught up in this mess who have uncertain futures!

@therewillbetime
Fishing is just under 0.5% of the UK economy.
Video games are around 3%
How will Brexit make fishing magically recover?

I know we are heading towards amazing opportunities as global, dynamic global players.
I know 3 heavy manufacturing plants that are planning to leave the UK and relocate to ROI. The American parent company wishes to remain a dynamic global player and believes that being in the EU is the best way to do this. It's certainly an amazing opportunity for ROI but it means unemployment and loss of revenue for the UK.

More noise, didn't somebody say something about "sound and fury signifying nothing"?

No one has to justify anything, however, in a democracy discussion, debate and opposition are essential.

The point remainers make is that most leavers can't justify their decision. They say words and make noises about 'freedom' and 'democracy' but it is meaningless waffle.

One of the most important decisions of this century that will impact negatively on generations and you can be arsed to explain or don't understand the reasoning.

I'm really shocked at the levels of ignorance, and scare-mongering over leaving the EU. You will still be able to travel / buy stuff / work abroad. You will still be European. Yes it's complicated of course it is, but in the end we will be better off financially (at present GB loses a net £92m per week to the EU) and in charge of our own laws. Those are the 2 reasons I voted Brexit and would do again,

@OP.

A. you don't know that yet
B. It will be great. Something to look forward to, not to fear.

Professor Patrick Mindford CBE - he is one of the few economists who supports Brexit. He is an outlier in his views. Interestingly the economic forecasters league table has just come out. Those #Brexit fans who minutely follow & optimistically quote the right-wing “prophet” Patrick Minford may have to follow someone more reliable. He belongs to the Liverpool Reserach Group who came er....bottom.

@layla9000
but in the end we will be better off financially.... and in charge of our own laws
Which laws will you change first after Brexit?

The "scaremongering " is a sober assessment of the consequences of No Deal. WA will be painful but not catastrophically awful.
Don't you see the difference?

@therewillbetime
Fishing is just under 0.5% of the UK economy.
Video games are around 3%
How will Brexit make fishing magically recover?

Is this a serious question? Fishing accounts for just 0.12% of output. Your figure is generous. Why do you think that it is so low?

@Bluejag. Perhaps you would like to go back and read my statement and not judge what languages you think I may speak/understand, what experiences I have. I did not blanket state anything about Brexiteers or Remainers, in fact I say ignorance is on both sides as information is neither sought or offered in the main. I have not stated Brexiteers are ignorant or ill informed. What i have stated is my sadness at the divisions that this situation has created that will be life long. The people I know who have voted Leave ARE ignorant of the details and impact of such changes and/or largely financially safe from the impact. I do not state all hold this position. The strong remainers I know are often employed/active in international corporations and institutions, so are very aware of how trade will be affected and not one of the Leavers are. But on the whole of it, neither side can say definitively what the effect will be and most of these conversations seem to be rallying of anger and frustration. I am stating sadness at the ignorance, bigotry, delusion, division that is both here on the mumsnet boards and in real life especially with regard to how our own trade/finances/politics work here. As I stated I don't know all the facts either way but what I do know is that if all I hear is 'We won' as an argument I rapidly lose my respect of the individual to listen to their point of view.

Some of the Leave comments on here are actually hilarious. People talking about laws and economics as if they are lawyers and economists. It beggars belief. I know plenty of lawyers (I am one) and quite a few economists. Not one supports Brexit or thinks it is any way a good thing.

I think it’s great in 3 months we will not be part of the group of countries who put those babies on those boats. The EU has blood on their hands when it comes to immigration policy in its selfishness.

I think it’s great we will no longer be part of a growingly inefficient, beurocratic, self serving unwieldy beast of a governance structure. And yes I’ve worked with them.

It’s good that we will no longer be part of something so totally unsustainable financially over the long term, 3 countries paying in, to prop up the others?

It’s great we will no longer be part of something that has driven and would continue to drive the rise of polarised politics and the far right. Something that has increased the racism my own family experiences.

It’s good that we won’t be part of something that totally unbalanced trade, it’s excellent we will be able to open up opportunities for free trade with others, and that we can offer more migration opportunities to the whole world, after all why should we favour people who want to live and work here just because they happen to be on the nearest landmass?

It’s not good that we won’t be close to our European brethren, whom I love, it wouldn’t be good if we can’t still be part of the trading block that the EU was originally supposed to be just because of the stubborn political ideals of the new rulers. It will be hard in the short term absolutely no denying that.

I didn’t vote, but getting a bit bored of this thread of posts that say “the only reasons are racism and nationalism” as a lot of my very not racist, very well educated family vote leave for reasons of their own.

This is why my DD now has dual nationality ( with another EU country)
If she only had a British passport - Dd wants to work in Spain. Dd and 2 other people are interviewed. The other 2 are French and Danish. Dd and the French man are equally as good or perhaps DD is even slightly better. As an employer would you employ someone who’s immigration/visa status is unclear or requires more admin or would you employ the French man ( assuming both candidates are equally as good)? I know what I would do
And THAT is what makes me especially sad - for our next generation who won’t have the same Europe wide opportunities we have. This is why we have got our dc dual nationality
I also hate the embarrassment we face when trying to explain to people we know in Germany and Spain what the hell has happened in our country

therewillbetime
re fishing Why do you think that it is so low?
Because most of the fish have been caught / fisheries are utterly depleted
And Brits do not want to eat what lives in British waters.
leaving the EU will not change that