To be shocked at this comment about poverty?

[abacucat]

I have been thinking for a few days about a comment a MNer made on a thread about poverty. She said that she has nearly been in tears because a woman at the toddler group she went to had a hole in her shoe and thus had wet feet.
I have a hole in my shoe. I got a wet foot today. I don't think this is a big deal or worthy of "nearly being in tears". Surely it is pretty normal to have to wait a bit to be able to afford to replace things like shoes?
I just do't see it as a big deal at all, and I think this comment was OTT.
AIBU?

When I was a child I had one pair of shoes - that was for school, out of school and every occasion. DF used to get angry with us for messing up the shoes Playing outside but we had no other shoes. I remember feeling poor.

I would consider only having 1 pair of shoes - and broken ones at that, some level of poverty. I may not be rolling in cash but I could afford a pair of wellies from Tesco or some of their shoes in the sale if I had to replace some shoes. I own more than one pair of shoes, because I have a formal job. I wouldn’t expect to be able to replace my washing machine without some planning but shoes - yes

A small boy I taught yesterday was shuffling around in adult size shoes. That would suggest his family is without the means to get him school shoes of his own. That’s poverty. I would need to wait till the end of the month then tweak my budget for the next month to be able to get a pair of good shoes. So I may need to wear holes/ scruffy stuff for a while. I don’t consider myself to be living in poverty, me and the kids have what we need and are fed and warm but there’s not much left.

RachealDod it would cost me £15+ to GET to my ‘local’ Primark

I think not being able to afford to spend £10 on a pair of shoes to avoid having wet and cold feet in winter is an indication of poverty, yes (although she might just really like those shoes and not realise it was due to rain).
But I don’t see how not being able to instantly afford to replace a washing machine (unless you’re buying it on credit) is poverty? That’s at least a couple of hundred pounds on an unexpected expense, there must be lots of families who have to budget their income who couldn’t afford to just spend £200? I think calling that poverty is a bit offensive to the many people out there who literally can’t afford to live.

@TheBigBangRocks ‘Absolute’ poverty is not being able to afford the essentials. So if that is her only pair of shoes and she cannot afford to buy a new pair then she is going without essentials.

Poverty is having no food or shelter so being homeless

That's very extreme poverty, poverty has different levels. It's not if you can't eat or home yourself it's poverty and everything else is not.

I have a hole in my shoes at the moment and when I go out in the rain my feet get wet, I know it's a few months before I can get a pair of shoes but for them not even to be able to get a pair of kids' shoes in a supermarket when the CHILD has a hole in their shoe-yes I'd think that's a big deal, because people always put their kids ahead of themselves and if they can't get shoes for their kids it must be pretty tough for them financially

*We have 0p in the bank, its payday tomorrow. Tomorrow we will have nearly 4k in our bank, so not poor by any means, just waiting for payday....

We couldn't buy the shoes today but could tomorrow.*

If you had a week and a half with 0p or a few quid to get you food but were then getting paid ... I think that's a grey area, because people on good wages can still struggle and be poor?

Just to put a different slant on it.
We can afford shoes for our kids, at the moment I would be able to go out and replace the kids school shoes (hasn’t always been that way)
BUT both my sons are weird little things (eldest has ASD and youngest is really fussy about clothes) and they hate having new shoes so often they have new shoes/trainers sitting at home but they refuse to wear them. One time I had to ‘lose’ these trainer things that were falling apart before DS1 would wear the new ones!!!

Of course wearing (without choice) shoes with a hole which causes your foot to get wet is poverty.

I'm stunned people are arguing otherwise

I have holes in my 'everyday' shoes, and don't consider myself to be living in poverty. I live very rurally, and therefore don't generally walk far in the rain. I have good quality wellies, worn for taking the dog out, a fair few pairs of "dressy" shoes for weddings, functions etc, a couple of pairs of sandals for the summer, and a pair of uniform work shoes (which stay onsite). But, if you were to see me at a toddler group of suchlike, you might assume I couldn't afford to replace my battered old trainers. It's not that I couldn't afford it - it's that getting to a town big enough would involve the best part of a whole day out, that's the logistically difficult bit about living so rurally!

I'm stunned people are arguing otherwise

Me too. Or arguing about mental health issues or additional needs. Clearly neither scenario applies to the op unless a drip feed coming.

As said, I grew up like this and it's horrible walking about with wet cold feet. Of course it's not on a par with sleeping in a cardboard box or going hungry but it's still poverty. Why pretend otherwise.

I don't think having a wet foot FOR A MONTH OR TWO is that big of a deal

Yes it's a very big deal to have wet feet in winter. Many horrible podiatry conditions are associated with this.

It's a very obvious sign of terrible poverty if someone has no shoes that keep their feet dry.

It's like something from the Dickensian era.

It also may depend where you live. I live in a small town and my rent is cheap. I'm in HA, I could afford to replace my shoes but they are £10 matalan boots. DH is a taxi driver so makes money every day. 5 years ago I wouldn't of been able to replace them as I had nothing. I was on benefits and was just about to start a new job.

My house was so cold that the oil in my cupboards solidified and my electric lived on emergency. All the furniture in my flat was donated to me and I had carpet scraps instead of fitted carpets, My mum would safe her left overs for me. I wouldn't of considered that poverty because I had most of what I needed.

I have holes in my shoes. I am a little bit embarrassed to be wearing them just in case someone sees underneath and incorrectly judges me as being in poverty now. I simply have other things I want to spend myomere on. I’m not in poverty. I’m always a little sceptical when it comes to random people judging poverty. When you’re so far from poverty yourself it’s easy to make shit up about imaginary poverty.

I’m from poverty and now so far detached from it I do forget it can exist in uk. I used to work with people in what would be considered poverty in the uk. The only true poverty i saw were dc suffering as a result of their parents poor choices. That is my own story as well.

I’ve also seen raw poverty in third world countries and i do wish sometimes people could see what poverty really is. Some people in the uk it doesn’t matter how much money you throw at them they’ll still waste it and make poor judgements on how they spend it.

I agree, owning only one pair of broken shoes must be poverty.
Of course reading everyone’s posts it is all relative. I had no money, no access to money ( abusive exh) when my children were tiny and lived with a small amount of cash from day to day and I think I was poor, but had a roof over my head. In the early 80’s I had no access to credit to tide me over.
My late dad always used to quote from his childhood, 1930’s/ early 40’s. “Poor was when a boy in the playground watched you eat your apple at lunchtime and ask if he could have the core when you had finished” so it is all relative and obviously changes from generation to generation. But def no shoes would be poverty to me.

It's like something from the Dickensian era

Mumsnet is very Dickensian these days. You're not poor unless there are 160 of you living in a shoe box in the middle of the road.

I wouldn't consider this poverty personally.

The washing machine has surprised me. Have many low paid/folk on benefits got a spare £200 or access to credit?

We certainly don't (although not relative to us as we would receive financial help from family if needed) and I honestly don't know many people who would.

To me poverty is being unable to afford food/sanitary wear/electric.

Poverty is subjective to your surroundings imo; poverty in the UK is different to poverty in Africa- but due to social conventions and expectations it doesn’t make it any easier for those who can’t afford the basics here. I wouldn’t assume someone with a hole in their shoe is living in poverty, perhaps they hadn’t noticed, find them comfier, or prioritise the money elsewhere (not necessarily on essentials).

I never ever let my account drop below £1000. I saved up when I was pregnant with my first and there would not have been number 2,3,4 had that £1000 been needed

I’d class not being able to replace a £30 pair of shoes for a month poverty.

Everyone deserves dignity.

I think poverty is struggling to have enough to eat or staving off eviction, not waiting a month till you can afford to replace a pair of shoes.

That is destitution.

Not having £30-40 to replace a pair of shoes that has developed a hole is poverty.

Having been there/done that, I recommend looking in charity shops or eBay for a replacement.

I don't think having a wet foot for a month or two is that big a deal.
Of course everything is relative, but just because your parents were poorer or because there are people sleeping rough doesn't mean that a hole in your shoe for two months doesn't indicate poverty. Wet, cold feet as a result of inability to afford sturdy replacement shoes are not now considered something that people should shrug and put up with. I would not ask a child of mine to put up with that. If my mother was going through that I would send her the money for the shoes as soon as I put the phone down.

I am interested in reasons you are so invested in thinking of yourself as 'not poor'.

Mistigri - I’ve noticed that too ! Attitudes have changed dramatically recently along with any sympathy or offers to help

What a horrible thread and posts. There is a massive difference between waiting till the end of the month to replace broken shoes and having another thing (such as a hole in a shoe) remind you how much you struggle with money. If money is the one thing that worries someone the most of course the hole in the shoe could upset them to the point of tears. Have you not heard of the straw that broke the camels back.

I have put up with holes in my shoes for a while for the following reasons: no time to go shopping, liked the boots and hadn’t seen any others as nice to replace them, laziness, not caring enough about my appearance, forgetfulness. I am not poor. I agree her response was a bit weird and I would have felt really confused if she shed a tear over my scruffy shoes.

I think you are trying to convince yourself that you are OK, which makes sense l, but I agree with others that a) not having £30-40 to spend on shoes and b) only having one pair of winter shoes is poverty. Not being able to adequately clothe yourself (e.g. Choosing between a winter coat and shoes) is poverty.

For those saying the could afford new shoes next pay day, but not now I'd also say they're only one unexpected big bill away from financial problems and maybe poverty. What if it wasn't shoes but the boiler needed fixing or your car broke down?

I also think both situations are sadly quite normal in the UK. And I know December can be a tricky month.

This isn't meant to judge anyone though but just because something is normal, doesn't mean it's OK :(