Why the the leavers so scared of a second vote?

[StrumALum]

I don't get it.

The leavers were fed some lies, that much is obvious.

What I don't get though is that if the leavers are so sure of themselves then why are they so worried about a second vote? If it's 'the will of the people' then it will be the same outcome anyway.

Or are they panicking because now the lies (like the bus) have been exposed, people are now more clued up and they were relying on people not being clued up to get the vote through in the first place?

we buy a lot of good from the Eu- how is it in their best interests for us to fail?

@poppoppop100 - we aren't the only market in the world.
Now you are trotting out "they need us more than we need them" .
Are you doing this for a bet?

"Being told they’re talking crap because their perception of life and the world is different. "
But you are talking crap.

The example of how the EU was treating us with contempt was Juncker's nebulous remark.

@bellinisurge
There’s no need to be aggressive. It’s not helping you prove your point. People just stop listening.

You asked for an example, I gave you one. I don’t think it’s a polite thing to say. We may agree that it’s true, but I still don’t think he should’ve said it publicly.

YoungLenny I would genuinely love to hear people's povs about this.

I do have a problem with the pov that this is about perspective though. It really isnt. It's about actual legal details and processes and facts.

I would like for example for someone to give me a concrete example of the EU punishing us and treating us with contempt.

I think people confuse the fact that the EU is rules driven for the EU being difficult, plus the EU's interests lie in protecting its members, not its soon to be ex-member.

The EU has also been constrained in what it could offer by May's red lines - it was only ever a Canada / Korea style FTA or No Deal that complied with those red lines.

Meant to add the nebulous comment doesn't count because it was an accurate description of TM's negotiating position.

Its not a good example or a justification of your language to describe how the EU have conducted negotiations, which also included the term "abusive marriage", which is a poor analogy.

So you using poor language to paint a picture of a situation that has no basis in reality.

Otherwise known as talking crap.

Thought leavers liked people who said it as it is?

I can't keep up with some of these super sensitive types.

I agree bellini

Its a sweary website

Give us some other examples Lenny please.

It's about actual legal details and processes and facts

I think we agree on that!

I just dislike the personal attacks that seem to characterise the debate now, because it accomplishes nothing. And no one listens to each other, because everyone feels under siege, and we’re all defending ourselves from attack.

Instead of: ‘you have that wrong, that’s untrue, here’s what was really said’ we have ‘you’re talking crap, how thick can you be? You’re a racist uneducated lunatic’ and no one comes away from that exchange any wiser or better for it.

You used language about the EU that painted it in an extremely bad light, in fact attacking it for showing contempt.

You were asked to justify these points.

You failed to provide adequate justification.

Poor snowflake

Oh my word...

I never came up with the abusive marriage analogy. I said I could see why someone could arrive at that analogy.

I don’t disagree that Junker was wrong - in fact I agree with him! I think it was impolite to have said it in public.

I’m not super-sensitive. I’m trying to make the point that personal attacks get you nowhere! People just stop listening to you, they ignore you. Do you want to convince people you’re right and bring them round to your way of thinking, or shut them up and entrench them in their beliefs even further?

And Boris - not all Leavers like telling things as they are, otherwise known as being needlessly rude. I’m not even a Leaver! God almighty.

Alright Boris - you’re right. You’re absolutely right about everything. Happy?

I’m not a poor snowflake - if you could explain to me how I’m wrong without calling me names, I’d listen.

As it is, I won’t.

I don't care whether you're a Remainer or Leaver.

Can someone tell me why May has got the Military on stand by?

Are they on stand by to deal with possible riots by either faction or is to protect herself?

I know two separate people who would not vote to remain

Not based on changed information, but purely based on the fact their families cut them off after ridiculing and despising them. They've never been under so much personal attack.

I wonder how many scenarios like this are playing out up and down the country?

"if you could explain to me how I’m wrong without calling me names, I’d listen. "

It was explained to you in the post, nebulous was a fair comment regarding the state of the UK's negotiations. It doesn't represent contempt, or is even a good example of the EU doing anything wrong, Juncker is not the EU.

I wonder why you are so keen to have others be polite and nice to you, and describe things accurately, when you use the langauge of abuse to make inaccurate analogies to the EU's relationship with the UK.

Lenny you sound like someone whom is open to reasonable debate, so here goes... if I had called you a "crap person" that would have been a personal attack and I think you would have a legitimate complaint. As it was I called your opinion "crap," not even your opinion in particular, but everyone who is saying that the EU is punishing us/treating us with contempt, because it is not factually true. I was more direct than I usually am because it is frustrating to see these inaccuracies repeated and repeated again and it's an issue I feel really strongly about. Also, we are in AIBU where fairly robust debate is tolerated. I'm not in the habit of being snidey to other posters.

Please give us more examples of the EU treating the UK with contempt and punishing us.

"I don't care whether you're a Remainer or Leaver.

Can someone tell me why May has got the Military on stand by?

Are they on stand by to deal with possible riots by either faction or is to protect herself?"

Any of the above, frankly. Plus distributing food. Plus martial law. No I am not being hysterical, I have lived in another country which had food shortages. Shit like that can arise.

I don’t disagree that Junker was wrong - in fact I agree with him! I think it was impolite to have said it in public.

Actually he DIDN'T even say it in public now, did he? Wasn't the word 'nebulous' said by May herself and caught from a lip reader during a private exchange between her and Juncker?

According to the Sunday Times, there’s a plan to draft in the army to “assist civilian authorities with helicopters and army trucks to transport medicines, food and fuel to people in hard-to-reach locations outside the Southeast of England”.

The MOD says no formal request has been received but existing plans used in civil emergencies would be put into action. The army would be called on in the event of disruption in ports.

Thanks Bell & YLG.