A United Ireland

[poppiesallykatie]

Not a goady thread or to stir, but how many are against it or for it? Obviously many in NI want to part of the Republic, many in NI want to part of Great Britain, how do the British people feel about it?

If you are not sure about a poster, it can be quite informative to search for their posts, to see just how many times they have been given the benefit of the doubt.

Especially when you see that someone else posted a referenced correction a while back, and said poster still spouts the bollocks from previously. Wilful ignorance is indefensible when information is available freely.

Xenia how do you think the average Brit would feel about 'reuniting' with France. On their terms obvs.

That's roughly the equivalent of what you're suggesting (in terms of how people feel about their identity and culture).

Isn't Xenia on every Ireland thread spouting Daily Mail reader bollocks? Or have I mistaken him/her for another pointless goady fucker?

Xenia is a regular GF on threads about Ireland and Irish history, usually spouting on about her Irish ancestors

You can claim as much Irish ancestry as you want, doesn't mean you aren't a fuckwit.

usually spouting on about her Irish ancestors

As all US presidents since Kennedy have

In fact, to be fair to the Trumpster, he's the first POTUS I can recall who hasn't draped himself in Emerald and dived into a pint of Guinness. (Or if he has, it's been kept quiet by Putin).

I think the US presidents do it purely to appeal to voters (thus can be said of most actions to be fair). But Ireland is a handy country to claim heritage from. We’re neutral and have never invaded another country. We’re also a nation of emigrants with more people around the world claiming Irish Heritage than there is living in the country itself. I very much doubt any of them felt any connection with Ireland at all.

I've lurked on this thread until now, as there have been several of their ilk since it emerged that the great ship Brexit would not be launched to fanfares from the neighbours.

Xenia claims to be of Irish ancestry, and claims to have a legal background.
I have seen her on many, many threads over the years, and have admired and been inspired by her posts regarding womens' finances.

However, on this particular topic, she has had many opportunities to learn how history is viewed from the Irish side; and yet continues to throw out rather uneducated views.
Best ignored.

I have no problem debating with people who are ready to listen and learn, just as I am ready to listen and change my views on the basis of solid information.

I have no problem debating with people who are ready to listen and learn, just as I am ready to listen and change my views on the basis of solid information.

Bloody liberal intellectuals ....

As for the re-unification issue, that is not going to happen without a great deal of discussion, and compromise from all parties (similar to how the GFA was negotiated).

I am from a moderate Irish nationalist background i.e no truck with the violent antics of the IRA, sympathetic to the fears and siege mentality of Unionist, but grateful to those who fought and died for Irish independence.

I changed my views on Northern Ireland since having work contracts there.
It seems to me that Northern Irish nationalists feel somewhat bitter toward the Republic.
There's a sense that they felt abandoned when running from the Troubles.

I deeply admire former Taoiseach, Jack Lynch's words about the potential for re-unification:
‘Amity, not enmity, is our ideal; persuasion, not persecution, must be our method; and integration, not imposition, must be our ultimate achievement’.

He said that ‘all Irish traditions are intertwined; let us all cherish them all’. He committed himself to the peaceful unification of Ireland: ‘In this there is a motive—so I will state that too. It is that in this island there shall never again be fear, turning to hatred, turning to bloodshed.’ Lynch also committed the country to Anglo-Irish friendship, expressing regret for the injuries suffered to British soldiers during their tours of duty in Northern Ireland—a situation ‘which must seem to them inexplicable’. Lynch said that it was for political leaders to govern wisely and justly, and it was ‘not a job for soldiers’.

That gentleman is dead, but his words are as relevant now as they were then.

DGRossetti bleeding hearts

Should have said that Jack Lynch was speaking in 1970 !! and we are still debating this.

So, if shouting hasn't worked, how about a bit of listening???

Should have said that Jack Lynch was speaking in 1970 !! and we are still debating this.

It's not a million miles away from what Ken Livingstone tried to say in the early 80s ...

What did he say, DG - I'm not familiar with that?

Basically he said that there would never be a resolution to the situation in Ireland - and by extension the problems on the mainland - without starting a dialog with the aggrieved parties. Even if this meant talking to Sinn Fein.

Of course he was slaughtered in the MSM at the time (to be honest, Corbyn looks like Mother Theresa in comparison) but that's because they chose to ignore what he was saying.

I was lucky enough to meet him at a 6th form debate (he was leader of the GLC in 1983) and he explained it without the Wagnerian backdrop of the Daily Mail, and it sounded eminently sensible. So much so that 14 years later, it's pretty much what nuLab did (with a not to John Major for having the guts to start the process).

The bottom line is the Thatcherite "we will never negotiate with terrorists" not only lead to much more suffering than necessary. It was also complete bollocks anyway.

Leo's line these days is very much "our only intention is to be a good neighbour to NI" and I actually believe him 100%. He's definitely no Nationalist. He's no romantic, either.

He's been great so far with the Brexit situation, I was ambivalent about him when he first became Taoiseach but he's done well with all this. Very resolute with a very clear policy, but businesslike and unemotional. He said lately that he gets on very well with Arlene Foster on a personal level, for example, and they enjoy very friendly relations.

I'm NI & most of the people I know would have more liberal attitudes nowadays. However, not enough people vote. The apathy is astounding because many people think 'what's the point' as it's seen as a choice between DUP or SF & both are shite. Religion seriously needs to be removed from our politics & people need to believe that they can make a difference e.g. by voting Alliance

Religion seriously needs to be removed from our politics

While - as an atheist - I agree strongly, it seems a bit odd to preach tolerance and democracy and then come out with something like that.

If people want to vote based on religious convictions, then why shouldn't they ?

After all, a country that lived it's entire life by the maxim "do unto others as you'd have them do unto you" would be a pretty nice place to live. Luckily there's no danger of that happening anytime soon.

Sorry my mistake!

Thank fully you didn't @ me to point that out!

I've no problem with people voting based on their religious convictions, however I do take issue with the parties taking advantage of this & becoming more extreme. Recently our town got new drain covers & they used some that had Irish & English wording on them. There was a big issue that they should be changed to covers with only English on them at a stupid cost. It's where the common sense goes just to be provocative that I find frustrating.

Thank God for the Good Friday Agreement. Hopefully nothing will damage it.

But seriously, politics in NI is kind of toxic and tribal.

There is no Assembly either, what's that all about?

If no-deal Brexit goes ahead then Ireland will be reunified within a decade, IMO. The numbers will be there, in the north, soon, according to recent polls. The people of RoI will get there because of the expense and hassle of the north being within a completely different system, not just for ROI but for the whole of the EU - incentivising ROI to lobby for it and EU to fund it.

Somerville, that's exactly what DH and I have been saying. Though he's worried about EU funding (I believe they would fund) and I'm worried about people here voting no.

If we could have united Ireland ruled from Dublin we could have united GB/Ireland ruled from London. Ah come on now Xenia, your efforts at winding the Irish posters up are just getting worse. You need to up your game. Not that we'll heed you anyway but still you could make them more amusing. Tut tut.

I genuinely can't see there being a United Ireland in the next decade. The gfa only came about in '96. I think people are getting ahead of themselves

I wonder AIBU to ask how many million a week NI costs compared to the £350 million a week the EU "costs".