To be angry and feel the Scottish Gov’s Twitter header is an attack on women?

[Badmoonsarising]

i’d like them to clarify exactly what their definition of “transphobic” is because it seems to have become a slur these days often aimed at anyone but mostly women who are critical of or question in any way the recent upsurge of identity politics. I just feel they’re doing a knee jerk, ignorant, unnecessary huge fuck you to women.

Verbeena your crosspost with Hyppolyta leaves an unpleasant impression of which kind of woman you seem to really care about

Can you not SEE that is exactly what some of the thread is doing?
Why is it any different if I do it as a bit of sarcasm?
Hypolyta herself said you can only woman one way (can't find exact quote, it's going the predictable long way again) so I made a play on that.
As in she's presumably a real woman womanning properly. As it seems there's only one way to do it.

Makes zero sense to say I don't care about women. As I am one. Some of us are capable of caring about biological women and transwomen too.

Do not misquote me.

I said the only thing that makes one a woman is being an adult female.

If you are not female then no amount of complaints, name calling, bitching, ignorant arguments, gaslighting, emotions, feelings, souls or sense of sense will make you a woman.

( even though I struggle with how a man knows what it feels like to be a woman, how can he?)

See, I can understand that. It's hard to put into words. If you've never been female bodied as you say, how do you know?
The female self sense though is different; it just knows you are. Nothing to do with feelings. When you're a toddler, you have no sense of your biology really but you do "know" you're female. Not because people have told you either. Even if they haven't, and never mentioned bodily bits at the age of 3, you just "know."

If you are not female then no amount of complaints, name calling, bitching, ignorant arguments, gaslighting, emotions, feelings, souls or sense of sense will make you a woman.

Oh FFS, it is THERE! On thread!!! Not gaslighting. Do I really have to trail to find it? I would, but there's no POINT as if I did, you couldn't see it even if it was being waved under your nose.
None so blind as those that can't see. Never understood that phrase before these threads.

Well, no, because the discussion isn't about different women, it's about men and women. Males and females.

Not sure about how one can "woman properly", there are as many ways to be female as there are females on the planet, but the material reality of a woman's life (especially in certain parts of the world) is certainly grimmer and more dangerous in myriad ways than for a man, regardless of how he presents himself to the world.

Intrestingly Verbeena this isnt the first time you have accused me of saying things I hadnt.

Or the second. Or the third. Yes, go find where I, or anyone, have said there is a way to woman properly.

The only one to use that phrase, is you.

The word means adult human female. It is a descriptor of age and sex.

It excludes males.

It also isn't a verb /pedant

Yes, you exclude transwomen. I heard ya. You've said that before too.

Yes, go find where I, or anyone, have said there is a way to woman properly

No. Point. For anyone capable of reading it has been said on this thread that there is only your biology when it comes to being a woman.
It's THERE.
Which is what I said right at the beginning before getting sucked into the batshittery faux innocence of "have a go at define womannnn" "no, not like that. It's biology only."
Only one way to woman.
I clearly need to get it into my head more.

Yes, women, and women spaces, exclude transwomen.

Because women are female, and transwomen are male.

Males have no need to be in female spaces, do they?

Even if they have a sense of self, spaces are divided by sex. Not that sense.

Should transwomen want their own spaces, for transwomen, for their sense of self, we should support that.

Excluding male people from a female space is not hatred, or bigotry, or transphobic.

Its about safegaurding, privacy, dignity and respect for females.

Verbeena, Can I just ask. If we accept transwomen as women, what are the situations where you think we should be making a distinction?

As Rat pointed out, this thread was about Twitter and a headline.
Not define women or women in huts and getting the vote, and if you accept transwomen you by default don't care about bio women.
This thread shows highlighting the trans issue poster was a good choice, it is needed as it's a thing and just not as acceptable as racism or homophobia isn't either.
You don't seem to get so much of the others on here though, there's not thread after thread after thread of gay men for example.

Because gay men are not fighting there way into womens spaces.

Its intresting you compare it to homophobia.

Do you agree lesbians who dont believe transwomen are women and accept penis are transphobic, as is often claimed?

Its intresting you compare it to homophobia

I didn't compare it to homophobia, it's interesting you interpret it that way though.
I said tackling BOTH transphobia and homophobia is important, and neither should be acceptable. Didn't conflate the two.

Fair enough.

Can you answer either my or Datuns questions?

Which are? Only if there's any point. Not if you go la la la not listening try again.

I can’t face RTFT so apologies if it’s all moved on. YABU, the flyer/poster is part of a series against different forms of hate crimes (racism, homophobia, sectarianism). You wouldn’t be the only one to be offended by them but you’d be in pretty awful company.

I’m all for debate around how rights can conflict and how best to manage that to keep all women and trans women safe. But regardless of different views on this we should all be against transphobia.

If they are part of a series its more understandable, but what makes you think its a series?

I havent seen any others on the twitter page, or anywhere.

Well said, peaceriot. Don't blame you for not RTFT, you know how it'll have gone without looking lol.

You wouldn’t be the only one to be offended by them but you’d be in pretty awful company.

If you had RTFT you might have understood that that isn't in any way the point. It's a case of what the definition of "transphobia" is, who is defining it, and what that means and whether it affects other classes of people.

The moral is, RTFT before jumping in with uninformed conclusions.

If they are part of a series its more understandable, but what makes you think its a series?

It literally SAYS so at the beginning of the thread, and there's a link to it being - part of a series.

People seem to be ON the thread without knowing it's part of a series though so that RTFT thread falls down on both sides it seems.

It makes no difference that it's part of a series, when you look at the group very relevant to the discussion which it isn't a "hate crime" to attack and abuse.

Ive just looked and found it, thanks. Im glad it is part of a series, it just baffles me what they have left out.

49 reports of transphobia in Scotland last year. 49 too many, obviously.

1700+ females raped in the same time.

It baffles me they adress hate crimes, and leave out the most common one.