To think that parents who don't vaccinate their children are despicable

[LaBelleSauvage]

Just that. And I think they ought to be sanctioned in some way similar to in Australia. Children shouldn't suffer because of parents' stupidity

ImpendingDisaster - that's why I had no qualms about going ahead (had she been my biological child, she would have had them in hospital - if at all!)

Andro you must live in an are with low immigration, know hardly anyone who was a child prior to the 80s and most of your peers must have vaccinated their children to have such good local herd immunity.

If you have an allergic reaction to a vaccine that is a medical reason not to vaccinate. But surely you want everyone else to be vaccinated to decrease your chances of you and your loved ones dying or becoming disabled??

Btw what is a significant but not dangerous reaction?

Impending

That’s really good information. Thank you.

So, 1.31 instances of anaphylaxis per million vaccine doses. That shines a lot of light.

captainproton - pain, raised glands, high temperature (but controllable). The doctor who saw him described it as a significant reaction but not life-threatening because we could control it.

I'm reading through the whole thread atm, but, the diseases that were al almost wiped out - polio, mumps, measles etc aren't returning at their old levels. They are effectively, over time, becoming superbugs, resistant to drugs. We've all seen the impact MRSA has had, as someone who almost died from meningitis, a supercharged version of these conditions would be very nasty.

For the record, both my children have been fully vaccinated.

@captainproton
my motgers first memory is ger little sister almost dying from whooping cough.
one friend vision impaired from
meningitis B
onevfriend lost leg due to
meningitis b
a friends daughter dead - measles (under age 1, so too young for vaccine)
another friends son - consequences of measles at 10 months not yet clear
an uncle infertile - mumps
2 cousinsxwith severe facial scarring due to chickenpox
that’s just what immediately comes to mind

Agreed. They’re usually also flat Earthers.

Completely agreed.

Sad reddit post from a mother who lost her 8month baby to measles encephalytis after her anti-vax neighbour visited. The anti-vaxxer kid was older, and got measles but recovered. The baby died.

amp.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/5na3ry/please_please_please_god_vaccinate_your_kids/

That post is so horrifically sad

but it does illustrate how it's not just about vaccinating (or not) YOUR child, it's about thinking of these who cannot be vaccinated for whatever reasons e.g. in this case the 8 month old baby was too young to have had her MMR

Andro, the significant reaction you describe sounds like a normal reaction to me. Isn't that why the nurse tells you to give your baby calpol after one of the jabs? Especially with live viruses. They are expected to get ill a bit as their immune system is responding to the inoculation.

captainproton - the components are not uncommon - lymph gland reaction less common than the others - but combined with systemic pain and temperature the whole lot took a bit of managing (and something stronger than paracetamol).

Anybody see this article on the BBC website yesterday?

Measles on the rise again

Personally I think the decision should be removed from the parents. I say that as a parent

You're an idiot @Youshallnotpass. I say that as someone pro vaccine.

Make it mandatory for schools and nurseries etc. But don't ever remove parental rights. You'd be opening a floodgate ffs. What a stupid comment.

I don’t agree with forced vaccination, as opposed to denial of rights and access, which I do support.

But I can’t see that those who do advocate it are idiots or that it would open floodgates. There are plenty of requirements imposed on parents already. In the most extreme medical cases doctors take over decisions from parents by court order.

If there was a real public health emergency of infectious but preventable disease we probably would see compulsory vaccination introduced.

*Anyone wobbling about whether to vaccinate or not should ask themselves these questions...

Q1 How many people do I know (not a friend of a friends cousin’s daughter) who has had a negative and medically proven reaction to a vaccine?

Q2 How many people do I know (not a friend of a friends cousin’s daughter) who has had a medical complication or died from catching a disease you can vaccinate against*

To be fair it's zero to both. Except meningitis, I do know someone who lost her toes. But these threads are usually about MMR.

So you don't know any pregnant women, babies too young to be vaccinated, toddlers too young for the MMR, anyone having treatment for cancer or any old people?

At the moment, I don't know anyone who is pregnant. That doesn't mean you are immuno compromised anyway. And maybe if you are TTC you should consider rubella and chicken pox vaccines if you can't remember having the illness or vaccination.

Babies/toddlers too young to be immunised. Well that's a question itself. I understood that if you had the illnesses you would pass some natural immunity into your baby in utero. But I did not know if that applies if you have been vaccinated. I had mumps, measles, chicken pox and German measles as a child so had natural immunity too all diseases (not sure how long the immunity remains into adulthood, the latest was when I was 7). I don't have a dd, only a ds, but if he'd been a girl, would he pass on his vaccinated immunity to a baby?

At the moment I don't know anyone who is having treatment for cancer. I did, but all are in remission now.

And the old people I knew (my mum and MIL) are not immuno compromised and my mum had all the illnesses as a child anyway.

So no, I don't.

Almost no-one will ever know a vaccine damaged child or even a child who had a very bad reaction to vaccination. Because these things are so very, very rare.

Stats for incidence of anaphylaxis were given upthread, for example.

You don't have to know them socially, you just have to be on the same bus or train as them or any other shared space for them to potentially contract a disease from you.

Kissing... I know 2, parents are currently putting in claims.

I still vaccinated though, I just separated them as don't agree with them being all done together but still want my child protected.

It's hard being a parent and we are all trying to do what we feel is best, even if we don't all agree.

medium.com/@visualvaccines/graphic-proof-that-vaccines-work-with-sources-61c199429c8c

Anyone not vaccinating their child should be prosecuted for neglect/abuse.

My friend is debating vaccinating her 2nd child due the horrible reaction her first had, she almost lost her child so is now scared shitless about it happening to her 2nd... I must report her for abuse