I can't trust this Mother...

[MistressoftheYoniverse]

My daughter went to a party at a friends house on Friday ..we sent her in a taxi to her friends and booked a taxi back @ 1pm for her to return home she's 16yrs yrs old.

So I get a call @ after 11pm just before 12am on my daughters phone from the mother of the girl who's party it is saying, 'Oh hi Yoniverse, I don't feel comfortable to send your DD1 home in a cab it's too late imo for someone her age, all the other kids are leaving...so can she stay the night and come home in the morning?...Now I was confused, she was using my DD1's phone and making me feel like my parenting choices were suspect because 'she felt' that it was too late...I agreed...mainly because I thought she had possibly been manipulated or cajoled by her own DD to get my DD1 to stay the night and I know what that's like, I'm pretty relaxed, but I was still perplexed and tbh a little annoyed but I said 'OK but make sure DD1 calls the Taxi station and cancels ..she said Ok ...a bit later I tried to call my DD numerous times but no answer....

I thought I might call the mum the next day and explain that the Taxi service we use we have been using for over 20 yrs they took our children to school in the morning when they were young, we know the owners/drivers by name so not just any random cab station so nothing to worry about.

FF>> 6am my DD1 calls me and asks did her friend's mum call me last night?... I say yes but why are you unsure?...'Oh she told me she called ..I was just checking' I asked if she told her that she should have cancelled the taxi..she said no ...so I confronted her and said 'you were wasted/mashed last night weren't you?' ...silence...then DD1 reluctantly admits she was so drunk she blacked out, was passed out for over an hour in the bathroom...didn't know how she got to bed, had 17 missed calls from her boyfriend and numerous other things she was unclear about.

I was upset...not completely about my DD1 being drunk....yeah it's not ideal but it happens and it's really hard for a parent to control other peoples children and what they sneakily do...

It was the bloomin lies and the making me feel like a bad parent for allowing my child to travel home in a taxi...it was the fact that she didn't tell me the truth that she didn't want to sent DD1 home because my child, under her care had become so drunk that she was too scared send her home in a taxi!

I would have really respected her if she had told me my DD was unfit to travel in a taxi because she had been drinking, she was worried and wanted to keep an eye on her...Things happen, I know it's not what you want to say to another parent but don't friggin lie and make the parent out to be a bad decision maker and that you know better!
I am angry right now...
DD still wants to be friends with this girl but I can't trust this mother

@Endofthelinefinally
I cannot even imagine. Much love

In my experience the kids whose parents taught them about responsible drinking, and didn't make it forbidden were the parents who had kids who knew how to handle it and drink responsibly.

The parents who banned it totally were the ones who had kids who didn't know how to handle it and went off the deep end, because they didn't know their limits, and saw it as something cool.

Booze is so dangerous, it really is.

Your daughter drinks herself into oblivion. What happened to personal responsibility?
Unless her drink was spiked.
The relaxed attitude by so many parents on this site to excess alcohol consumption by their children always me.
Alcohol is a drug.
Yes I would be very annoyed with the mother for trying to cover up what really happened.
Perhaps she did it to shield your daughter from parental ire ?
What if your dd vomited while sleeping ?
Did the taxi turn up if it wasn't cancelled ?
I'd be mad with both the Mum and your daughter ( provided her drink wasn't spiked and she chose to drink to excess).

BIWI don't bother, honestly. Apparently teaching teenagers about responsible drinking is 'training and enabling' them.

Much better to let them get pissed down the park or just go mental at 18

Maybe I'm too strict, maybe you all are right. I don't know. I just find the 'they will try to drink anyway, so they can have 2 or 3 at home with me' to be enabling it. I can see the argument about responsible drinking, and about banned/forbid fruit ie they will want it, but in my experience from several friends, it doesn't always work out that way. A few of my friends turned alcoholic because they were allowed to have that '2 or 3' at home with their parents. Because they 'got the taste for it', which they wouldn't have had till older, if they weren't offered it by parents. Another friend had strict parents and never allowed any, to this day she might have 3 drinks on a weekend and that's it. Her parents strictness worked on her and she is very responsible. Relaxed approach to drinking at home doesn't always work out, and a strict approach doesn't always end in a child going wild. (And yes, I acknowledge the reverse is also true. I am not stating it is wrong/right categorically, I am saying imo only).

I had a party for my dd last night, she’s a year younger than your dd, there was no alcohol (no one even mentioned it), all kids were collected at 10pm. I don’t think it’s the norm for 16 year olds to get paralytic at a party even more so when a parent is present.

I would be annoyed that the parent lied to you, she should have told you dd had a few too many to drink but I would also be annoyed that the parent allowed (probably sullied) alcohol to under 18’s. I would also be angry with my dd for getting drunk.

The mum did what she thought was best, for all we know your DD might have been saying how angry you would be and begging her not to tell you, it puts her in a difficult position. She probably assessed the situation and thought it was the best thing to do. I don’t think the taxi thing was to make you feel a bad parent, I think she was fumbling for a reason to have your DD stay over at that time and that was what she latched on to.

@BIWI I am not the one lacking in critical thinking skills. It appears you think that people are unable to think and see what you are saying.
"A lot of people here will have been experimenting with alcohol/drinking from an age well before the legal age of 18 (whether that's been allowed by their parents or not). And many posters here will also have been drunk/vomited/done something stupid because of drinking when they were teenagers. So all the moral high grounders who are clutching their pearls about 'bad' behaviour with alcohol are very conveniently forgetting that this was going on when they were teenagers. (Even if they, themselves, weren't doing this)"

I don't think there has been even one poster here who insinuated they didn't know all this. In FACT, it is PRECISELY WHY us 'moral high grounders' take the view we do. Because WE KNOW what teens do.

"But the reality is that they will find a way, no matter what you try and do."
NO ONE HAS DENIED THEY WILL FIND A WAY. No one. Not I, nor anyone else. So you either have an inability to comprehend, or you are reading things in this thread that are not there.

It is PRECISELY because I/we know they will get it any way they can, that we react this way. You simply cannot see the connection and completely do not understand. As I said, and which you have now confirmed, you were suggesting that because they will find a way, then parents should allow a child to have 2 or 3 drinks at home. Right. Which is exactly what enabling is.

The mother was out of order. Your daughter is still a child and was possibly dangerously ill and she didn't even mention it! You should have been given the opportunity to go and get her if you had felt the need to. And why was your daughter able to get so drunk when this woman was supposedly looking after her. I'd be seething.

@DayManChampionOfTheSun "Apparently teaching teenagers about responsible drinking is 'training and enabling' them.

Much better to let them get pissed down the park or just go mental at 18"

So it is either/or? Don't you think that shows a very narrow-minded view? As I said, teaching 'responsible drinking' DOESN'T WORK for a lot of kids. All it does is 'give them the taste'. I know from experience! And not all kids 'go wild' at 18.

That you think those are the only two outcomes, shows how out of touch with reality and how tunnel-visioned you are.

Otoh yes, I don't like the sound of this parent AT ALL. At parties my dc have been to, 16yos have had far more of a sense of responsibility than this and on the few occasions when something has gone wrong, ambulances and parents have been called for- by a teen if no adult was at hand.

But that brings me to the second part of my thinking which is that you are never going to keep your 16yo safe outside the house unless it is well and truly clear that SHE is responsible for her drinking. Unless other people have been literally pinning her down and pouring the stuff down her with a funnel, it is HER decision to drink. If she is not mature enough to take responsibility for her decisions, she is not mature enough to go to parties. There WILL be drink at parties from now on and it is up to HER to stay safe AND keep an eye out for her friends.

And I would be very wary of the "plying with drinks" argument. My db tried that one on when he was 15: our parents rang the organisers of the event in a state of complete fury. He'd lied. Not their greatest moment.

www.drinkaware.co.uk/advice/underage-drinking/the-law/

This is good advice above.

I think some posters/parents are confusing saying as a parent clearly to their teenager that it is better to wait until they drink - to being blind and shutting down the conversation or controlling them.

Several studies show that teenagers are better off long term in their attitudes to drinking when their parents don’t enable drinking, or say it’s fine. So giving teenagers 16 or under drinks by an adult isn’t helping them to make better choices. Kids who never drink before 18 are less likely to have a problem with alcohol in their lives, not more likely. The driven underground argument doesn’t hold weight.

Of course a lot of this is down to their personalities, confidence, peer group and model behaviours at home too. If they have good structure and attitudes anyway, then that’s going to help them make good choices.

@DayManChampionOfTheSun

I have a childhood friend who is an alcoholic, because she 'got the taste' because her parents had the same mindset as you; "let her try it home with us, then the novelty will wear off and she won't go wild at 18".

Only, it didn't work that way with her. Don't you see? This is an issue close to my heart, because what has happened to my friend is horrible. I would not wish it on anyone. I have personal experience in this. Please try to understand.

My father was also an alcoholic, and a lot of my childhood and teen years were so stressful. I was always trying to get dad home from the pub, worrying about mum's feelings, worrying about her worrying about money. It was no picnic. I don't think you have any idea.

We are human beings behind these screens, we all have different experiences.

Children and their parents or carers are advised that an alcohol-free childhood is the healthiest and best option. However, if children drink alcohol underage, it should not be until at least the age of 15 years.

Advice from Drinkaware. It acknowledges that many children will start to drink however the research does say that the longer kids don’t drink, the better. So if your child doesn’t get tempted before 18 that’s better fir them. If they do, then of course we should be having the conversation / first aid / responsible practices.

Ime whether you encourage your teen to have sips of wine at home or not has absolutely zero influence on how she behaves when she gets to a party where there is vodka and she is surrounded by her peers.
What does make a difference is how she thinks of herself: as a person who is responsible for her own decisions or as somebody who makes excuses.

And for those saying, it couldn't happen on my watch: it is perfectly possible for a teen to bring in a seemingly innocent juice bottle heavily laced with vodka, swig out of it during the evening and carry on acting quiet and unobtrusive until he suddenly collapses. Not all drunken people stagger around the floor shouting and singing: some just become a little more correct, a little more circumspect. Not the fault of the parent.

@Bluntness100 "In my experience the kids whose parents taught them about responsible drinking, and didn't make it forbidden were the parents who had kids who knew how to handle it and drink responsibly.

The parents who banned it totally were the ones who had kids who didn't know how to handle it and went off the deep end, because they didn't know their limits, and saw it as something cool."

My experience was the exact opposite. Those whose parents thought they were only trying to teach their kids how to handle it responsibly were the ones who had problems with alcohol.

Where as the strict 2 families, their kids turned out fine.

Experience is all different. I just think the 'teach them how to handle it responsibly' is a gamble. In my experience of growing up, it wasn't always the outcome the parents were hoping for.

SalemBlackCat4 you have said yourself, multiple times, that you know teens will drink and they will find a way. I personally think it is much better to be in control of what they are drinking and where they are getting it from than leaving it to chance. If they are having a drink or two under your supervision, they could be having a very low alcohol cider or light beer, if they are sourcing themselves, they will probably go for highest content/lowest price, so cheap vodka etc.

And fwiw I don't have a tunnel view, I know there can be many more outcomes than the two I stated earlier but it depends so much on the actual teenager. Some don't care about alcohol at all, great! But some do and those who do show interest should be taught how to drink responsibly. They should be made aware about the dangers of drinking, but it isn't realistic to just assume they won't drink until they are 18.

It's great that you had friends with strict parents who now only drink 3 times a week, my parents weren't that strict about alcohol and I only drink about twice a year and never at home. There will be examples of both working, but just putting a wall up and just saying no, in my honest opinion, is probably not going to yield the best results.

Where this mother was totally out of order, of course, was in not getting her medical attention. I'd be very ashamed if my 18yo had failed to do so under similar circumstances: I'd see that as a parenting fail on my part. Not to mention the lying, which was inexcusable.

@salemblackcat unfortunately I have personal experience too, although not my father, must be tough. I can sympathise with your stance.

I do think my own teenage son is vulnerable to addiction, his nature and family history. I’m watching him like a hawk and not giving him alcohol myself. I am having conversations, he has had drinks with his mates. I’m doing everything that I can to keep him from going down that path which is why I researched a lot into what we should do as parents.

Its a scary world out there for parents with teens.

My 16yr old has only been.to.one party so far and came home early and has refused all other invites since.
All his friends were getting drunk and obnoxious. The older teems there tried to force him to take alcohol. He was ridiculed for taking juice and some idiots poured it all away as it wasnt 'cool' not to drink alcohol. he was ridicules for not drinking.

He got hurt by one drunken boy throwing stuff around.
He ended up walking a friend round the street to try to.clear his head when the parents kicked him out to 'sober up' after providing the alcohol themselves! This was only a couple of hours in! They were drinking like fish.

My son doesnt like the taste of alcohol and can have a good time without it but apparently his mates cant nor do thier parents expect them to which is even more concerning.

He was invited to another party this weekend and regalled with what drugs would be on offer, at a house
party for young teens 😲 He declined.

I hope he doesnt get a liking for alcohol for years to.come.

If he had beem passed out at someone's house i would want to.know why i was lied to and not told to come get him.

Some teens will experiment with alcohol of course they will. But in a house its the adults responsibility to ensure this is done sensibly and they dont get paralytic. That's not 'enjoying' yourself at all.

@SalemBlackCat4

As I said, and which you have now confirmed, you were suggesting that because they will find a way, then parents should allow a child to have 2 or 3 drinks at home. Right. Which is exactly what enabling is.

I did not say say this at all.

If they are having a drink or two under your supervision, they could be having a very low alcohol cider or light beer, if they are sourcing themselves, they will probably go for highest content/lowest price, so cheap vodka etc.

DayMan, are you saying you will keep your teens at home drinking light beer and simply not allow them to go to parties, or how else do expect those light beers they've had at home with you to protect them when they are at an unsupervised party with friends pushing the bottles of cheap vodka at them? Surely they are totally different situations?

16 year olds might drink, but that mother should have told you your 16 year old was passed out due to excessive drinking and let you make the decisions for her care.

But my spider senses would have been tingling and I would have asked to speak to my dc directly when the parent had phoned to say plans had changed.

Depending on my relationship with the other parent I would either speak to them and tell them they should have let me know my dc was severely drunk under their watch, and have words with dc about responsible drinking and how I couldn't trust that parent (or her) and any future nights at that house would mean regular phone contact or you would be at the door.

Thank you @Bananasinpyjamas11 for backing up what I said! Enabling does not always guarantee a child will not become alcoholic. I have personal experience of how that myth works out. Be prepared to be abused though, be called names, insulted and shut down. All because you recognise that allowing a child a couple of drinks in your home will not always lead to 'responsible drinking', nor does never allowing them a drink before 18 always mean they will go wild on their 18th.